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16 comments

Biofuel Versus Food

Posted July 06, 2011 6:10 AM

Eight percent of the worldwide corn harvest is now going to ethanol production. In the U.S. 35% of the 2010 harvest went to ethanol. The World Trade Organization recently cited government biofuel mandates and subsidies as significant contributors to record food prices and high price volatility. Other factors include bad weather and record oil prices. Ethanol industry representatives claim these concerns are overstated, since a third of ethanol plant wastes can still be used for animal feed. Considering that ethanol production is at best marginally energy positive, is it wise to continue prioritizing fuel over food?

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#1

Re: Biofuel Versus Food

07/06/2011 7:09 AM

That's like asking whether it is wise to prioritise greed over thrift.

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#2

Re: Biofuel Versus Food

07/06/2011 5:16 PM

35%....holy $#it.

I was at my dad's last week, and he was saying my brother was prett happy, sold his corn at $6.00/bu. A few weeks later it was up to $8.00, he was still happy with 6.

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#3

Re: Biofuel Versus Food

07/07/2011 12:09 AM

Take away the subsidies, and it would be a totally different game--Read what Al Gore said about the fallacy of ethanol, and how the subsidies were used to turn the election results , and how he was WRONG (Did I say that?? No--HE did) Now they want to go to E15, which will cause more havoc with older motors, and fuel lines etc--It will kill the Maritime industry---

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#6
In reply to #3

Re: Biofuel Versus Food

07/07/2011 8:38 AM

C-Mac

Al gore was wrong, He's a politician trying to play a scientist. His motive, a good part was political.

First off, What do you know about subsidies?

The biggest lucrative part of subsidies paid to farmers were to NOT to grow crops such as corn. Which was taken advantage by Large corporate large farms that made 100 of thousands if not Millions of dollars. Its a reverseal now. When the price is there, farmers can grow corn.

Your statement:

Now they want to go to E15, which will cause more havoc with older motors, and fuel lines etc--It will kill the Maritime industry---

Do you not believe this has not happened before, in the late 70's the same thing was said about removing lead from gas. That was also mitigated.

I was taken a PLC Programming night class back in the late 90's, and a empty headed Adult student was making a comment about all farmers making so much money off subsidies. And then he used the Dairy farmer as an example.

I told this pin head, Its 1998, Would you work for the same wage now as you did back in 1978. He busted out laughing said no way, he's not a fool.

Then I told this Dick Head, The dairy farmer today (which was 1998) is selling his milk for $10.00 c/w (hundred weight), which is the same price this same dairy farmer received for his milk in 1978. I said his there were price supports in place. I then asked this dick head to explain himself.

I also pointed out that the low price of food does not seem have a negative effected to his expanded waist line.

Farm subsidies is a complicated issue here. Not just stealing from Peter to pay Paul. and can't be assisted by posting google links.

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#13
In reply to #3

Re: Biofuel Versus Food

07/11/2011 12:49 PM

Gore recently said the only reason he pushed ethanol subsidies was because of the lobbyist's donations, and that he now thinks the information he was given was not factual. So he blames it on false info.... Don't take me there. Now he thinks it was a bad decision and we should stop subsidizing ethanol. However, the dems in congress don't want to do away with this. It is insane. If a new product is worth producing, then why does it need government subsidies? I find it odd that government wants to tax the items that are profitable, and give those profits to the companies that produce items that don't make a profit. Sounds a bit socialist to me. Anyone else's thoughts? I am sure this will stir things up.

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#14
In reply to #13

Re: Biofuel Versus Food

07/11/2011 3:08 PM

Yes that's a real man of him.........now that he has nothing to gain from it.

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#15
In reply to #13

Re: Biofuel Versus Food

07/22/2011 12:10 AM

At this time of government, it isn't obvious to me whether or not "a bit socialist" is a good or bad evaluation. It would be nice if I could be some ripe corn to eat, but around here, its not ready yet. The alcohol in the gas sucks in water, and causes my truck to stall (if I forget the gas dryer), but I don't mind. Uh huh. There is always the possibility that the alcohol/water in the gas is good, as an anti-terrorist action, though I won't tell you how. I'd still rather not have it. Is the corn a new product? With all the genetically modified agri-products nowadays, it could be. I've heard that the corn wouldn't be profitable without the subsidies, though I am NOT tuned into the details (too complex). Anyway, I suspect nobody much cares a bit. We'll see.

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#4

Re: Biofuel Versus Food

07/07/2011 5:12 AM

It's a no brainer.
We won't have food but at least we'll be able to drive to the aid station.
Del

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#5

Re: Biofuel Versus Food

07/07/2011 8:13 AM

Ethanol for fuel is driven by politics, not science. Ethanol is a lousey fuel for several reasons. Butanol or fusel oil from fermentation would be much better from several standpoints. My new $2000 riding lawn mower has a warning sign on the fuel tank: "Do not use fuel containing more than 10% ethanol." And EPA wants 15%??? STOP THE MADNESS!!! We can vote out Congressmen and presidents who make bad decisions, but how do we vote out EPA? End the subsidies, but ADM and corn states have a powerful lobby and aren't ashamed to buy congressmen with campaign contributions.

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#7

Re: Biofuel Versus Food

07/07/2011 8:59 AM

Horses run on biofuel. So what?

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#8
In reply to #7

Re: Biofuel Versus Food

07/07/2011 1:32 PM

If something turns out to be crapola, let's double down on it. By now, it is shown, that ethanol additive has no energy advantage, rather the opposite. In addition, the water requirement making it, is flat unconscionable.

Now the EPA want to double down on it. Double crapola is better, is not?!?

While there are food shortages all around the world for poor people, as corn etc. is going to essentially worthless ethanol. Limousine progressives could not care less.

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#9

Re: Biofuel Versus Food

07/07/2011 5:11 PM

In the case of corn, it might be debatable as to the best use or whether it is a misuse of "food." Corn, has, I think, become very misused; both as a food AND a source of energy.

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#10
In reply to #9

Re: Biofuel Versus Food

07/07/2011 5:44 PM

NAH, not at all!!

Corn, in the form of "high fructose corn syrup" is a biochemical poison, and maybe "the" main factor in type 2 diabetes, a scourge of the present generation.

It is also a main factor in the third world hunger, due its diversion to the worthless ethanol scheme.

So, I am not forgiving either. Darwin is unforgiving on the willfully stupid, so am I. And when I am caught at it, I take the medicine .

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#11
In reply to #9

Re: Biofuel Versus Food

07/07/2011 5:56 PM

Misused as food. Do you mean over used as a food.

You should watch this movie.

Even the beef we eat is traced to corn. They ID it by take a hair sample.

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#12
In reply to #11

Re: Biofuel Versus Food

07/07/2011 6:20 PM

Well, I was trying not to be caustic... Being a vegetarian for just a few months shy of 40 years, I haven't contributed to the misuse of feeding it to produce beef in a long time.

As far as the HFC issue, I agree. I'm not sure what the "willfully stupid" reference is to, though.

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#16

Re: Biofuel Versus Food

07/26/2011 12:39 AM

Dear Friends: The "fuel/food choice" is extremely un-necessary! For one thing, the world is AWASH with oil, with new fields being found all the time. Some along the tidal areas MUST be drilled, or those tidal areas WILL become polluted (California beaches would have NO ALLURE if Natural-seepage wasn't reduced with current pumping of wells offshore). "Peak oil" is an expensive MYTH used to advance the Communist Greens and sell eco-nazi-books. Current un-exploited USA reserves are larger than ALL of the middle east reserves combined, period, EXCLUDING "tar sands". The USA has VAST reserves of natural gas. If all cars & trucks were switched-over to natural gas, we would be energy independent within years. No longer would we send our treasure to lands that re-import corrosive religion/periodic Terror(--part of the "Corrosion", you see). Marijuana/switchgrass/algae(-hi-lipid varities) COULD provide enough bio-fuels to fuel ALL our jetliners, grown from "waste" land. Subsidies for corn-for-ethanol have made corn farmers anxious for such to continue, but there are plants that will produce MORE ethanol than corn. The malthusians aside, the earth could support billions more than the 6 billions we now have.

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