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9 comments

Is It Real, or is It Counterfeit?

Posted August 03, 2011 10:09 AM

Counterfeit semiconductor devices reduce revenue streams for legitimate vendors and generally don't meet the manufacturing specifications that customers expect. Yet surprisingly, response to their increasing presence has remained remarkably muted. Have you had to cope with counterfeits? Did you know that when you bought them? Did they come from reputable suppliers? How could you tell they were fakes? How did they affect the quality, performance, and reliability of your products? How will you avoid them in the future? Should the industry make more of a concerted effort to keep them out? How? How would you change the methods being used to fight them?

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#1

Re: Is It Real, or is It Counterfeit?

08/04/2011 11:20 PM

The question as posed is nonsensical. What is counterfeit component?!? From a new XYZ company it either meets specifications or not. This is not a banknote, where the state does not permit anybody else to print it.

So what does it supposed to be?!?

Sonny, think it over, and post it again, preferably without the blubbering.

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#2
In reply to #1

Re: Is It Real, or is It Counterfeit?

08/05/2011 3:19 PM

Counterfeit Electronic Components are real, and are a big concern. That is "...what does it supposed to be?!?"

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#3
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Re: Is It Real, or is It Counterfeit?

08/05/2011 3:48 PM

OK. I am fully aware of what you are talking. BUT, "counterfeit" is not= counterfeit. When Copyright or IP intellectual property is involved the case is clear, at least in principle. When a medicine goes thru certification procedure to the tune of $800million, it is a patent violation, clear.

On the other hand, XYZ company sells NPXxxx transistors or 74xxx digital chips. Any protection, if any long ago expired. If incoming inspection and continuing QC quality control finds it good, what is the beef?!? What is that different from, when the original manufacturer moves its own production to outer Sahara, as far as reliability concerns.?

Radio tubes and germanium components are still manufactured in a few spots. The original holders transferred their rights. So, Swetlana in Saint Petersburg produces Eimac 3Cxxx tubes indistiguishable from the original. Is that cheating the customer?

The Wikipedia entry mentioned was particularly unhelpful in clearing up any questions.

There is a counterexample of the well aired case of "blood diamonds". The diamonds were diamonds as any. Political concerns and protecting monopoly was real enough.

I said, state YOUR case clearly. Which one is it, or something else?

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Re: Is It Real, or is It Counterfeit?

08/05/2011 4:16 PM

To be certain I am clear:

This 255 page document titled DEFENSE INDUSTRIAL BASE ASSESSMENT: COUNTERFEIT ELECTRONICS was of NO help at all. This document was accessed at the bottom of the Wikipedia article.

It appears that the case for the troublesome existence of counterfeit components is well documented. It also appears that you are unconcerned by this, and are at ease using whichever ripoff artist is the cheapest today.

"There is a counterexample of the well aired case of "blood diamonds". The diamonds were diamonds as any." This is a real stretch as an accurate representation of the concept of counterfeit.

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#5
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Re: Is It Real, or is It Counterfeit?

08/06/2011 2:07 AM

Just to pick one example, Grade 5 vs Grade 8 bolts are identified by 3 vs 6 tick marks on the head. In a consistent system, this allows consumers to identify the correct strength of bolts, without further testing. But if an upstart manufacturer puts 6 ticks on a a Grade 5 bolt (more money), then it is counterfeit. And this is a real problem: either 1) some bolts fail, or 2) consumers must spend more on testing to weed out the fakes.

I am surprised that anyone would be so grotesquely naive about this, and thus I have marked your two posts OT. I request that you now go back and mark yourself OT as well. And next time, learn about the subject before running off at the mouth/keyboard.

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#6

Re: Is It Real, or is It Counterfeit?

08/08/2011 6:29 PM

Anyone that has walked down the street of New York City has seen some form of this.

Electronics, DVD's, jewelry are just the ones I remember off the top of my head. The prices so low it makes it either 1) stolen or 2) fake.

I did manage to wheel and deal my way down on a "Rolex" from $200 to $30... at that point I was proud of my negotiating skills, but too afraid I was buying stolen property to actually buy it.

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Re: Is It Real, or is It Counterfeit?

08/08/2011 7:33 PM

Which one of you did not read my prior, detailed note on the matter?? I have not worked, where incoming testing and quality control was not part of production.

Did I miss something fundamental in my working life there?!?

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Re: Is It Real, or is It Counterfeit?

08/08/2011 7:49 PM

I wrote a detailed note on the subiect. I welcome your answer specifically addressing them.

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#9

Re: Is It Real, or is It Counterfeit?

02/16/2013 5:42 AM

Counterfeit Components are a very real problem in the Electronics Manufacturing. The components can in many cases be refurbished devices taken from old circuit boards then "reassigned" to be what ever is required. I e if the part you want is a 14 pin SOIC IC, then the unscrupulous Counterfitters will doctor up any group of 14 pin SOIC with the appropriate markings of the desired part.

These are usually sold through grey market suppliers and occasionally end up through reputable brokers. More so an issue for obsolete or obscure (read very pricey) devices.

The first thing the Manufacturers know they have been dudded is when the client boards fail to work as required(if they work at all).

The counterfitters are very good at doctoring the parts to look kosher, but there are give aways. These can only be found by very close examination under a microscope.

I have 3 of AD420 ICs which I suspect are counterfeit, because they don't look exactly like the the ones acquired through reputable sources. Its subtle differences in Fonts and texture of the component body which is enough for me to not use them in the SIL2 device they're destined for.

Vigilence is the only thing that saves most board loaders form serious embarrassment. Although in Oz we suffer due to lack of local stock and the long lead times of bespoke parts. Made more difficult due to very tight bottom lines and customers who don't get the economics of manufacturing. It's very tempting to buy from a supplier who under quotes a price and delivery time, but at what cost?

As for recompence for "faulty" parts, er solly no speaky engrish...

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