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TeknologikL

"Plug it, play it, burn it, rip it"
TeknologikL is a place for conversation and discussion about new technologies emerging in consumer electronics with a focus on high-definition video and audio. The blog will cover topics including home theater equipment, digital distribution, media streaming, electronic product reviews and more.

The blog's owner Mike Kaplin is an e-Media Supervisor at Globalspec, constantly searching for the next device to satisfy his ever growing hunger for technology. A media junkie standing on the edge of reality, ready to take the jump.

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21 comments

Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

Posted February 26, 2008 5:00 AM by Kaplin

Last week in Part 1, I focused on some of the technical advantages of HD DVD over Blu-ray. This is not saying that Blu-ray doesn't have a few benefits as well.

Is Bigger Better?
Blu-ray supporters have long claimed it's superiority due to 50GB discs, while HD DVD disc capacity at 30GB. HD DVD movies have consistently shown that 30GB is plenty for a 1080p movie with HD audio. HD DVD has been testing a 51GB disc that has been proved to work on all existing players, so the capacity claim would have fallen by the wayside anyway; now those 51GB discs will never see the light of day.

Some people might say the 50GB is really needed for writable PC drives. Obviously when storing data for backup or transport, more is always better. The only thing is with the exponential growth of hard disk sizes, flash memory, and other backup solutions, optical media is no longer the most efficient way to backup your data. Couple that with the high price of blank BD-R discs, and it's pretty much not worth it. (Currently the cheapest prices on Amazon are $11.41 for a 25GB disc and $32.28 for a 50GB disc.) I don't even want to speculate on how often you might get a write error on the 50GB disc and have a $30 beer coaster. Check back in a couple years and maybe media prices will come down to realistic levels.

Blu-Ray Offers (or Needs) Protection
Another benefit that is touted of Blu-ray discs is its scratch-protection coating. What many people don't realize is that for Blu-ray discs the scratch protection isn't a bonus, it's a necessity. The data on a BD is stored 8% deep from the surface, where as the data is stored 50% deep on regular DVDs. Because the data on the BD is stored so close to the surface, it requires that extra layer of scratch protection for the discs to be usable.

Blu-ray Wins, Consumers Lose
In the months leading up to Christmas, sales of discs in both formats seemed to be doing well; HD DVD was closing the gap due to more affordable hardware. Even with HD DVD growing at a faster rate during the 2nd half of 2007, Warner decided to drop the HD DVD format and focus on Blu-ray. Rumors widely circulated around the internet that Sony had paid Warner Bros. $400 million (USD) to support only the Blu-ray format. This is something that happens on a regular basis in the industry, with the "payoff" money going down as shared advertising costs. It is also widely speculated that Paramount received $150 million in 2007 to drop Blu-ray. While many people deny those payoffs, that's how the industry works and the street goes both ways. All the "early adopters" who were spending their hard-earned money to try to support their format didn't end up meaning very much, because in the end the consumers didn't really have a say in the outcome of the format war.

Now that the war is over, consumers have already started to see the negative effects, as retailers such as Best Buy are raising player prices as much as $100. You will also be hard-pressed to find any retailers offering the Buy-One Get-One Free sales, which were very popular during the war for bragging rights on how many discs were sold.

After the Warner news, the writing was on the wall and the end was inevitable for HD DVD. The good thing is that your players will still work and you should see some very good liquidation sales on new and used discs and players. (The HD DVD add-on for the Xbox 360 has just been reduced to $49.99 but should sell out quickly at that price) Hopefully these clearance sales can hold you over until Blu-ray players and disc prices come down to a more reasonable level.

HD Downloads are coming.
I've heard all the naysayer's remarks about how internet connections aren't fast enough and it takes up too much disc space, but the internet is here and it isn't going anywhere. I can download a 720p movie in about 2 days, which is quicker than I would get the movie using Amazon's free shipping. A 1080p movie might take twice as long, but I'm still waiting for a 1080p media extender anyway. In regards to the Apple TV update, I usually have so many movies waiting to be watched that I don't mind if it takes a few days to download.

Many new technologies are fighting for this new frontier that includes HD Downloads, VOD, and streaming movies; each of these is gaining popularity much quicker than disc-based media. iTunes movies outsold Blu-ray and HD DVD movies in 2007. Granted, the iTunes movies were not in HD. Apple just started offering HD movie rentals in 2008, and I'm sure HD movies for purchase will be coming soon enough.

These new services are being offered by cable providers, Apple TV, Xbox Live Marketplace, even Netflix offers online movie watching. The movie industry will be following in the footsteps of the music industry shift away from disc based sales, which have been dropping every year for the past 8 years due to cost and convenience to consumers. I'm not saying optical media will be eliminated completely, but Blu-ray discs will never reach the popularity of DVDs which in 2007 had its first decrease in sales since inception. The bottom line is the average consumer doesn't want to pay $25-30 for a Blu-ray disc when they can get a DVD for $9.99.

I want to thank Kate for letting me submit this controversy to her blog. I know you have an opinion about the way the format war ended and what the future may hold, so let's hear it in the comments below!


Resources:
Say hello to CH-DVD and a 51GB HD DVD
Blu-Ray Scratch Repair FAQ
iTunes Movies Outsell HD-DVD and Blu-Ray Disc
DVD feels first sting of slipping sales


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Guest
#1

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/26/2008 12:36 PM

You are foolish if think Digital Downloads can compete with a competently transferred BR or, previously, HDDVD movie. Not only that but go look at "The Inquirer" and see your digital dreams fall by the wayside. The FCC hath ruled, and it's not good for DD. Also you might consider the following before betting on DD fantasy:

The average high speed line in America: 2mb/s

1 lossy encoded Hi-Def movie = 10+GB

That is 16+ hours of downloading WITHOUT congestion, other people using the line, et al.

File sizes will only get bigger as time goes on an resolution / audio files increase in size. What's 10GB lossy now will be 15GB-20GB in the future. If you want lossless, it's already up to 20GB so heaven knows what it will be in the future.

The last mile to the house is where the cost is. You have to get that up to speed, and that's going to take 2 decades and billions of dollars. We aren't going to go into traffic-shaping, catalog issues, et al.

I'm sorry you got Beta-maxed, but pull your head out of your arse and realize Hi-Def digital downloads need an infrastructure that doesn't exist yet. One that won't magically appear due to the human cost (labor intensive) last mile. When we've got the equivalent of 20/20 to >70% the houses (preferably 40/40) then we can have digital distribution of Hi-Def movies.

Waited out the war, now Blu. You want to see real HD? Get a PS3 and watch Bladerunner: The Final Cut.

--Inglix

The following statement is false.

The previous statement is true.

Welcome to our corner of the universe.

Guest
#2

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/26/2008 1:03 PM

I'm confused, you say:

"In the months leading up to Christmas, sales of discs in both formats seemed to be doing well; HD DVD was closing the gap due to more affordable hardware."

Yet, the truth is that going into the 4th quarter of 2007 HD DVD had a tremendous hardware sales lead, and over the next three months, not only did Blu-ray surpass HD DVD in stand alone hardware sales, but actually made up for and led HD DVD in inception to date stand alone player sales. Despite players costing twice as much from Blu-ray.

Neither Part I or Part II of this article actually presented any information whatsoever that shows why HD DVD should have won, but simply focussed on some of the minor advantages of the HD DVD format. These aren't necessarily insignicant, but it doesn't lead to a format being a winner, or even better.

Let's step back and focus on why HD DVD lost, and deserved to lose, shall we?

1. HD DVD had zero CE support at any point.

2. HD DVD had less studio support throughout the entire process.

3. HD DVD was based on old technology standards that were underspecified from day one.

Of those three, number three is the most meaningless. The first two are, by far, the most important and the reason why Blu-ray won. While there are lots of people who talk about 'incomplete specs' or 'Sony sucks', those simply don't compete against the real world of marketing. In the real world, people will pay more for Bose and Monster products, even though they are far worse, or barely equal, to products costing 1/10th the price. Yet, HD DVD, which only cost half as much, with the marketing of Toshiba (who?) was competing against the worlds largest and most trusted names in consumer electronics.

Toshiba never really had a chance, and never deserved to have a chance. HD DVD was a good product, don't get me wrong, it simply never put together a team that would lead it to victory. So I'm sorry... No, it should not have won.

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#3
In reply to #2

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/26/2008 1:41 PM

You said, "In the real world, people will pay more for Bose and Monster products, even though they are far worse, or barely equal, to products costing 1/10th the price. Yet, HD DVD, which only cost half as much, with the marketing of Toshiba (who?) was competing against the worlds largest and most trusted names in consumer electronics."

That's exactly my point!

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#4

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/26/2008 1:47 PM

This article (and part 1) is complete and utter nonsense, full of factual errors and misstatements.

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#5
In reply to #4

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/26/2008 1:58 PM

Which facts are wrong? The only thing that I see that can be contested was the software sales in 2007 but dual format titles such as Harry Potter 5 were very close to their Blu-ray counterparts. See the link below.

Bourne, Harry Potter HD DVDs outpacing Blu-ray titles

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#15
In reply to #5

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/27/2008 10:37 AM

what facts are wrong?

how about this for a start:

"In the months leading up to Christmas, sales of discs in both formats seemed to be doing well; HD DVD was closing the gap due to more affordable hardware. Even with HD DVD growing at a faster rate during the 2nd half of 2007, Warner decided to drop the HD DVD format and focus on Blu-ray. "

HD DVD was NEVER closing the gap, it was increasing. HD was NOT growing at a faster rate during the 2nd half of 2007.

Do you really think that Warner is so stupid as to have dropped the format that had greater growth? Warner looked at the facts, decided blu-ray was winning, and ended the war. Very simple.

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#16
In reply to #15

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/27/2008 10:40 AM

According to Home Media magazine reporting the top sellers, Harry Potter OOTP had an index of 57.28 on Blu-ray compared to an index of 44.38 on HD DVD.

That is a ratio of 1.3:1 which is a far cry from the 2:1 ratio Blu-ray has had the first half of 2007.

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#6

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/26/2008 2:29 PM

I think the people who are willing to download a movie, from any service, are not the same people willing to invest in HD movies anyway. The HD-DVD and Blu-ray market to me still very much is a specific type of consumer--the videophile. These are the same people who won't settle for iTunes and XBOX movies, even if they do "claim" to be 720p--they aren't on par with HD-DVD and Blu-ray--not even close.

I am in that category, and while it's convenient to use Unbox or iTunes to get a movie, I want it for the plane ride, not the living room and I don't need HD for that. Think about the true arguments Blu-ray vs. HD-DVD people are having...DTS HD Master Audio and HDMI 1.3 uncompressed LPCM audio. These are not people who are going to setting for 720p iTunes downloads. A DTS-MA audio sountrack for a longer movie alone probably won't fit in the space of DVD today.

As a matter of fact, even if we did get to the point of under-20 hour downloads someday of full-bandwidth movies and sound, right now it's just not possible today. For right now, your best option is renting Blu-ray, and even more convenient, DIRECTV PPV who offers full-bandwidth Dolby Digital 1080i movies without having to download--traditional methods are still winning out for now for the true videophiles.

In the meantime, I made the investment in Blu-ray as soon as the "war" was over even though I put my backing in HD-DVD to start. So now I just rent Blu-ray instead of HD-DVDs from Netflix and I'm done "converting".

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#7

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/26/2008 9:54 PM

Being a neutral supporter I agree with all of your points. I also have to say that my Blu-ray movies lack quite a few special features that are found on their HD DVD counterparts. The BEST thing Sony does is copy some one else and do so half assed. I just hope that Warner Brothers, Universal, & Paramount force Sony and other studios to produce higher quality Blu-ray disks and players.

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#8

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/26/2008 10:00 PM

regarding HD download, just take a look here

http://www.ilounge.com/index.php/articles/comments/13347/


Apple HD VOD even look worse than upscaled DVD, so I'd say there are no way that HD Download will beat Bluray

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#9

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/26/2008 10:10 PM

Kaplin,

I understand that you where a supporter of HD DVD and that you wanted it to win over blu ray but this has happen before. When DVD first came out touting 500 line resolution with new technology that was expensive it still beat out old technology that was close to the same resolution of DVDs that being super VHS tapes. They where cheaper then DVD but consumers like to purchase media that feels on the cutting edge. That is why I purchased Blu ray it felt more High tech plus 50 gigs on a disc is unbelievable. As for digital downloads it will never happen I hate DRM so I download MP3 or gasp buy CD so I can do whatever I want with my media. Soon you will be able to rip your blu rays and when that day comes I will be there with the proper infrastructure waiting. Also I have a 20-30 MB internet connection and it takes between 10-30 minutes to download a Standard Def 30 minute (180 MB) video file, so how long is it going to take to download a 30 GB file, how many hard drives will my house have since TB hard drive aren't taking of right now and will I have to lean my friends the whole HD so that they can watch X-Files 2? Blu Ray is here to stay get used to it.

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#10

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/27/2008 7:21 AM

I personally see no reason to change to either format from DVD at this time.

I am also waiting on better technology for large TV screens as well (OLED maybe in a few years?). Not enough HD TV broadcasts is one reason as many HDTVs do a bad job of showing the "normal" broadcasts generally available today......many forget this important point!

The two really go together for me personally, one without the other is just stupid.

Once I have a 40" or better OLED (maybe!) Wide screen TV, at a reasonable price (around$1000 or less) then I may need to consider HD DVD or BluRay.....not before.

My present 16:9 CRT TV with an 82CM Diagonal has outstanding quality considering the old technology.....on all broadcasts!!! And normal DVD!!!

After reading the excellent summaries on CR4, both part 1 & 2, I am sad for HD DVD as it appears to be better in may ways as well as possibly being cheaper than BluRay....but by the time I am in the market for a newer DVD format, 5 years may have passed and there may be something much better and cheaper......

I am not someone who has to have new technology instantly it appears on the market, I like to get my technology at the best time for both quality and price.....also I am prepared to wait and read such articles as this to increase my knowledge!!!

Many, many thanks, well done. It was a good article.....forget the unfriendly comments from others, they have no manners at all!!!

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#11

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/27/2008 7:39 AM

is part II of your article also reasons for why HD DVD should have won the format war? If they are, I do not see how these points lead you to that conclusion and ask for more clarification on your points to that matter.

is bigger is better? - It is always nice to have more/extra space for more features/futureproofing. Since 30Gb is sufficient, why need for a higher capacity spec? Just so that bluray can't claim higher capacity? how does this show that HD DVD should have won the format war?

Blue Ray needs protection - It would be bad if there was no scratch protection since bluray data is stored 8% from the surface. But it does have a protective layer that keeps the data safe. does it not work? How does not needing scratch protection a pro for HD DVD, or needing scratch protection a con for Bluray.... if it works as intended?

HD Downloads are coming - Since the average consumers doesn't want to pay $25-30 for a Blu-ray disc when they can get a DVD for $9.99, how is this a reason for why HD DVD should have won the format war since HD DVD movies are/were set at the same price points as Bluray movies? How would the arrival of HD downloads lead to HD DVD winning the format war?

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#13
In reply to #11

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/27/2008 10:02 AM

I tried to go over the advantages of HD DVD in Part 1 while Part 2 focused on a few other topics such as the benefits that Blu-ray does have and the future of HD.

Even I must admit there isn't much of a future for HD DVD, which is why they weren't mentioned in that part of the article.

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#12

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/27/2008 8:32 AM

If HD-DVD should have won this fight should beta have won the tape format war? When you are talking about a consumer product it's not about technology as much as it is about ease of use and marketing. It would seem Sony has learned their lesson.

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#17
In reply to #12

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/27/2008 10:41 AM

That is absolutely true, but it's also true that Beta was the technically superior format and is still used in broadcast today because. So while it failed as a consumer product, it was the better format and that was the point of the "part I" post.

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#14

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/27/2008 10:06 AM

I can't imagine (actually I can) the frustrating results of tieing up my system bandwith downloading a movie for 20 hours. What if everyone on your block was downloading movies for 20 hours at a shot. Now it would take you 40 hours. You have to be out of your mind or some kind of diehard download junky, which jeopardizes your whole argument, to think that anything that takes more than an hour to do on the internet is worth doing when there is a Netflix alternative.

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#18

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/27/2008 1:11 PM

I just wanted to let you know this is the best summary of the format war that I have read. In my opinion, the readers comments of factual inaccuracies, when examined, are little more than varied interpretations of (varying) data sets. I think the point of your post is to present a review of the format war, and point out what is going to be missed due to this "victory". It does read as though you are choosing the HD side, but so what? Your article is articulate and thorough.

MY point is that you've done a good job educating me to the issues and aspects of the format war, and what may happen in the future (price of hardware, download vs BR, etc).

I didn't purchase either format, and probably won't. DVD is fine for my family and our entertainment budget. -So from someone with no opinion formed, thanks for a well written and well documented summary.

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#19

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/27/2008 2:16 PM

Uncompressed 1080p HD require lots of room. For each frame of 1920x1080 32 bit color, 8294400 byte is required. Its 7.91MB. 30 frame per sec is 237.3MB for each sec. Or 13.9GB each minute. A 2 hours movie require 1668.5GB.

Now we can see why disc capacity is important. The larger it is, the less compression is required and the better the picture is. 50GB is 3% of the original HD quality.

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#20
In reply to #19

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

02/27/2008 2:28 PM

Right, so eventually that just becomes an argument of CODECs and bitrates really quickly.

Anyone care to start another controversial topic of MPEG2 vs MPEG4 (H.264 and AVC) vs. VC-1?

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#21

Re: Why HD DVD Should Have Won the Format War: Part II

03/13/2008 10:49 AM

Well it looks like not even a month has gone by and Blu-ray player prices are increasing just as I had said.

Lack of competition sends Blu-ray player prices upward

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