Shock, Vibration and Noise Blog

Moving airports, doing landscaping around airports, or redesigning the air intake of the engineers are definitely all much more major projects then adding a 'bird repellant' part to the aircrafts.

It seems to me, a while back, there was some sort of device made for aircraft that would deflect missile lock on targeting.

Adding bird repellant is a great plan. It will cost less than redoing all airports or redoing the air intake on all airplanes. It will also take a lot less FAA approvals.

Now, I don't know enough about birds to know whether sonic waves will repel them or not. However, the idea of the repellant being on the aircraft is good also: it allows the plane itself to have the protection. Thusly, if the plane goes to any airport, anywhere, it still has its bird repeller.

Also, it seems that the birds will not be harmed - just repelled. That should make the bird lovers out there happy as well.

The part presumably could be added on to any make or model of aircraft, whereas the engines vary from plane to plane, manufacturer to manufacturer. Many older planes still fly so we could be talking about anything from Douglas (DC), McDonnell Douglas (MD), Boeing (7xx), Airbus (A3xx), to others I have forgotten, and even small planes like Cesna or ... etc (I don't know small planes as well). All planes hate birds because birds hurt all planes. Even if they miss the engine, they can hose up the skin, the cockpit, anything really. Heck! Birds even damage automobiles when they smack into them at highway speeds.

Maybe everything that moves should have a bird repelling device.

I know that "deer whistles" exist for cars in hopes of repelling them. (I am unsure if they are scientifically proven, or if they are just hopeful snake-oil).

Alternatively, Del the Cat could get his cat friends together, and airlines could hire them to be on the front of the plane, hissing at the birds. Of course, they would need something to keep them from freezing to death...

Installing a aerodynamic grill in front of the intake would help.

how about something based on this technology?

Ottawa Boy's Invisible Invention Warns Birds About Deadly Windows

http://cr4.globalspec.com/blogentry/7957/Ottawa-Boy-s-Invisible-Invention-Warns-Birds-About-Deadly-Windows

maybe very bright ultraviolet landing (takeoff) lights?

The problem is though, the birds are in the air. They know the plane is coming - they can hear it. They can probably even see it.

They just don't care - because they are birds. Then, they collide with the plane, and both plane and bird become unhappy. Like this:

I over hauled jet engines in the USAF. Have seen what a bird or even a cigarette butt can do to an engine. I have always been thinking of ways to deter items from entering the engine while in flight, but then so have many others. If one person could come up with a solid workable idea, they would be a billionaire. It's not that the bird flies into the engine, but the engine sucks it in if it gets anywhere near the inlet.

possum

Not that I would like to become a billionaire (by now the whole world has found that it counts for Effing all) but I would suggest strong laser guns. If laser guided missiles can be built to surgically remove any thing larger than a mobile phone then building just a radar controlled laser gun to take out some bird should be possible.

In bad weather (fog, rain etc.) it would not work, I know. The day that plane came down though it seemed to be quiet good climate conditions. It could have worked and saved the pilot (What a man!!) and his passengers a lot of stress. If only one plane or engine could be saved it would be worth while doing.

We have some very noisy birds here. They come out at dusk and can be very annoying. I have this infra red digital thermometer and if I point that at them, just that little red light, they don't like it and go somewhere else. If I had a strong laser we could have fried birds for brekki.

Don't worry about sending any money I'm pleased to be of help, even if my idea is not applicable. Ky.

Roombas......... made to be like hawks .......self docking...........prop driven........positioned on periphery of airport and strategic locales around a/port ...programmed to avoid flight paths....radar actuated.

It's already being done at Fairchild Air Force Base near Spokane WA.

They have a fellow with dogs (Ausies I believe) to keep the flocks off of and around the runways. He uses Falcons in the air.

Bird strikes have gone down to almost zero over the last 5 years.

not surprised Shadtree that you have mentioned a regular sort of solution, along with something actually being done. Last I knew LGA was supposed to send some guys out with Shotguns to scare the birds off when it was known they might be flock flying. It is weird how stupid people get sometimes. Remember how they wanted to test the strength of aircraft cockpit windows and fired frozen chickens at them? How many frozen chickens or ducks for that matter, fly?

I have been told that many airports maintain a Falconer. The down side of that is the neighbors that don't want to see any of the birds harmed. Fort Lauderdale Airport has a bunch of portable propane cannons that are relocated all around the airport property. I am not sure what causes them to fire, but they are not timed, because they will fire close together at times, and almost never at other times. The cannon always causes any birds in the area to take flight. The feeling is that the birds will not stop long enough to set up house. We do have a group of burrowing owls that have set up house on the fields. They are federally protected as an endangered species. The good news is that they do not seen to fly much.

Some problems to the ideas so far.

The plane is flying at over 150 mph by the time it is clear of the runway. Even if the bird sees and hears the jet, it can not get out of the way in time.

Placing a screen, or deflector over the engine air inlet. What would you make that screen out of that would stand up to a 5 lb bird hitting it at 150? And if you did stop it, what about the engine that now would not be able to suck in enough air to supply thrust?

There are some people that might object to someone pointing a Lazar at birds that are flying near airports. The first ones that come to mind are those pilots. FAA is another group.

Keep thinking though, there has to be a good idea out there somewhere.

Hi Bob

If you were referring to my suggestion (laser), I was more thinking on the lines of having the laser on board the plane. Taking out the culprits mid air. Like they do in Star Wars. Automated, like the rockets they fire to take out any thing of any size at any time any were in the real world. Or is that footage all computer animated propaganda?

For the people that worry more about birds than humans I would even suggest white phosphorous. In big fat clouds.......

I wonder what the pilot would have done if he had that choice of weaponry. I believe he saw the poor critters coming? He would have pushed the button, I bet!

Hope all goes well. Ky.

Both Bob C & Shadetree mention Falconers, or Falconering as effective. Of solutions so far mentioned this is reported as effective. Bob C mentioned that some don't like the solution because Falcons may hurt the other birds. Why such an objection would be allowed to hold sway is nearly impossible for me to understand. There have been a number of instances in science and technology when it was discovered that a simple solution was way better than some outlandish technological solution. I remember hearing that for Astronauts they tried to make vacuum equipped electric shavers, and eventually discovered regular old shaving cream worked better. Pump action ball point pens were designed to work in space, but pencils were just as good, if not more reliable. Those are two examples I remember off the top of my head, and I am sure that there are many more.

Regarding bird strikes, I take it the author is referring to the aircraft that came down in the river in New York, I regularly go to a RAF station near me, where they train pilots on Hawk aircraft, planes are taking off and landing throughout the day, they employ a man in a 4x4 who tours around the perimeter, regularly playing the sound of bird distress calls, he will also scare them off with a `very` pistol shot, I am not aware of any bird strikes on this station, however if a plane is at a higher altitude at take off, then it will merit a different technique, If I could think of an effective way of dealing with this, I reckon I could be very wealthy today, There is another way I read about recently, whereby they they were using birds of pray to control certain species, but then who is going to protect the bird of pray if he should get tangled up with a jet intake!

how about a redneck and a 12ga????

That would be a fine job for the airline personnel being laid off.

Birds belong in the sky like everything else we intrude in the air and the ocean we don't belong, yet we see the birds as a problem whereas we ourselves are the problem, what must be done is to find how we can safely without harming the birds, maybe the plane should emit sub sonic sound that is audible to the birds and somehow deter them out of the way.

With all the scientist in the world doing studies someone must have an answer of how by means of sound to get birds out of the way.

The have sonic devices that keeps insects which by the way regarded as pests out of the house, but yet birds who forms vital part of nature we want to kill, typical American mentality just kill the problem bugger the conscequence

Killing the birds is used as a last choice most times. But the choice between bird s living, and my grandchildren is easy for me. Below is information I read recently.

More than 200 wildlife strike incidents happen at DIA each year. The airport spends more than $260,000 a year on its wildlife mitigation program.

Duck does make a great meal. As back to the solution for the airport interests for mitigating the possibility of bird strikes, your and Shadetrees report, reported Falconers were effective. Ben Franklin tells the story of how he started eating fish again after a long period of vegatarianism. He smelled Fish being cooked in a resturant. Thought. "That smells good. You know, fish eat fish. I think I'll have some fish." Then wrote- "It is a great thing to have a mind to come up with a reason to do what we want to do." Making up a reason is one thing. Finding the reason is another. We find that the bird population has rebounded near LGA. Must have been a very large flock to knock out both engines. What is to be done? Bird bodies wasted. No humans died. Feel sorry for birds. Would Falconers have prevented crash? Would Duck dinners be better than crashed airplane? Yes I think. Don't those Falcons bring the bird back to the Falconer?

It was my understanding, from the clip I saw on the news, that just the presence of the Falcons in the air caused the other birds to scatter and hide. I doubt many are taken.

Works for me either way. You and Bob C pointed out it worked. I thought it was simple and tried and true. About dinner, well, Duck is good.

I do believe I saw a report that the birds in question were actually Canadian Geese.

So, we have traced the birds back to their place of origin. Could this be a Canadian Conspiracy?

Do you realize that the Canadians have amassed 90% of their population on our northern border?

Do you realize that Ottawa sends wave after wave of Arctic air swooping down across the US, causing untold misery, and very cold feet at night?

Should we wait for yet another attack from the frigid, and well armed, (reports indicate that there are 10's of millions of Geese prepaired to fly south at a moments notice), north? How much provocation can we take?

It may be too late. Hollywood Florida has been invaded by the overweight,overage Speedo wearing commandos. They have taken over our restaurants (during the early bird specials) and they are starving our waitresses to death.

Just today there was another bird strike at Fort Lauderdale Airport. A turkey vulture hit a twin engine Cessna today. It shattered the windshield, and cut the pilot's head. Luckily he landed the plane safely.