CR4 - The Engineer's Place for News and Discussion ®
Login | Register for Engineering Community (CR4)


Previous in Forum: Interview for Engineering Assignment   Next in Forum: Too Early To Switch Careers?
Close
Close
Close
15 comments
Guru
Popular Science - Cosmology - New Member Technical Fields - Technical Writing - New Member Engineering Fields - Energy Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Electrical Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Electromechanical Engineering - Old Member, New Association

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Lexington, KY
Posts: 1484
Good Answers: 71

Asking an International Engineering Management Question Here

11/08/2016 12:58 PM

I recently ran across some information that stated that some civilized countries have passed legislation to make it illegal to use bullying tactics in management. I'm talking about a crude and negative form of motivation that is likely to become a civil rights issue finally in the USA. Can anybody confirm corrective actions taken to eliminate or at least curb this form counterproductive thinking?

It is not just an annoying behavior being used as a shortcut for effective leadership. I think the only reason it has not become civil law in the USA is because the lawyers are still arguing over how much money they are going to make.

Common sense? What is that?

__________________
A great troubleshooting tip...."When you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth." Sir Arthur Conan Doyle
Register to Reply
Pathfinder Tags: Bullying style management
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Comments rated to be "almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, rate them!
Guru

Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 4833
Good Answers: 457
#1

Re: Asking an International Engineering Management Question Here

11/08/2016 2:08 PM

Maybe I'm fortunate, but I don't recall in my career ever having been bullied. I've maybe had a difference of opinion and worked for a boss who micromanaged, but never "bullied".

Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Guru
Popular Science - Weaponology - New Member Popular Science - Cosmology - New Member

Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 6859
Good Answers: 207
#2

Re: Asking an International Engineering Management Question Here

11/08/2016 2:31 PM

you can't teach or legislate class.

Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Lubbock, Texas
Posts: 8573
Good Answers: 111
#3
In reply to #2

Re: Asking an International Engineering Management Question Here

11/08/2016 3:54 PM

Teddy Roosevelt is spinning in his grave! Some of the great engineering achievements are simply, Bully!

No one is seriously advocating bullying tactics in management. Some people may think it works for them, but I would expect their organization to exhibit the loyalty of a fruit fly.

How long before it is illegal to use bullying tactics in the interrogation room? Is it already a big no-no? At least lying is popular in certain government circles.

__________________
If it ain't broke, don't fix it. Just build a better one.
Register to Reply
Guru
Popular Science - Cosmology - New Member Technical Fields - Technical Writing - New Member Engineering Fields - Energy Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Electrical Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Electromechanical Engineering - Old Member, New Association

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Lexington, KY
Posts: 1484
Good Answers: 71
#8
In reply to #2

Re: Asking an International Engineering Management Question Here

11/09/2016 7:57 AM

Not sure what you mean regarding "class". It seems to me that any sort of negative behavior is now under extreme scrutiny, unless you run for president and win.

Behavior is now legislated with severe punishment for having a voice of significance.

The natural response will be to get on board with the cliche, "Leaders who do not listen are soon surrounded by people who don't speak!"

Such is life.

__________________
A great troubleshooting tip...."When you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth." Sir Arthur Conan Doyle
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 39041
Good Answers: 1532
#4

Re: Asking an International Engineering Management Question Here

11/08/2016 4:54 PM

As uncivilized as the US has become recently, I can't imagine professionals acting this way.

Joe six pack who runs a ditch digging crew, may use intimidation.

Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Hemet, Land of milk and honey.
Posts: 887
Good Answers: 20
#14
In reply to #4

Re: Asking an International Engineering Management Question Here

11/09/2016 10:02 AM

" Joe six-pack who runs a ditch digging crew may use intimidation ".

Funny thing happened the other day, I just happened to be talking to Joe,

and he said the exact same thing,,

about Suits.

Go figure.

Register to Reply
Guru
Hobbies - DIY Welding - Wannabeabettawelda

Join Date: May 2007
Location: Annapolis, Maryland
Posts: 3819
Good Answers: 202
#5

Re: Asking an International Engineering Management Question Here

11/08/2016 5:13 PM

It's so hard to definitively and clearly define bullying that any attempts at this kind of legislation will either be totally toothless or it will become a 'tool' for lawyers to extract all kinds money from corporations (and the People). Either way, it's a waste of time and potentially a colossal waste of money.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_know_it_when_I_see_it

Register to Reply
Guru
Popular Science - Cosmology - New Member Technical Fields - Technical Writing - New Member Engineering Fields - Energy Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Electrical Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Electromechanical Engineering - Old Member, New Association

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Lexington, KY
Posts: 1484
Good Answers: 71
#9
In reply to #5

Re: Asking an International Engineering Management Question Here

11/09/2016 8:07 AM

I think the lawyers are lining up for all kinds of lawsuits regarding this bullying problem. It is not yet illegal in the USA to use bullying tactics in order to create a hostile work environment. It is at least four times more prevalent than sexual harassment and now we have a president elect that won using both sins.

Clearly, I am feeling a little brow beaten. It isn't the first time and I learned the unwritten rules back then but I still don't care for it.

Dogs get better treatment than creative engineers.

__________________
A great troubleshooting tip...."When you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth." Sir Arthur Conan Doyle
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: at the beach in Florida
Posts: 16909
Good Answers: 963
#6

Re: Asking an International Engineering Management Question Here

11/08/2016 9:01 PM

Take control of the situation...don't be a victim...

http://www.workplacebullying.org/individuals/solutions/wbi-action-plan/

__________________
Life is like riding a bicycle. To keep your balance you must keep moving. A.E.
Register to Reply
Guru
Popular Science - Cosmology - New Member Technical Fields - Technical Writing - New Member Engineering Fields - Energy Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Electrical Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Electromechanical Engineering - Old Member, New Association

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Lexington, KY
Posts: 1484
Good Answers: 71
#11
In reply to #6

Re: Asking an International Engineering Management Question Here

11/09/2016 8:22 AM

Thanks for the link Solar Eagle. I have to recommend against any such action as it is extremely dangerous for a career in engineering. I was shocked to learn that most USA companies use lawyers as their head of personnel to cover their butt.

I don't like lawyers. They are the only profession where they get paid to lie. That places such a bias of skill against the workforce that it is overwhelming. Taking control of the situation is a sure way to become unemployable.

Better to be a victim than unemployed.

__________________
A great troubleshooting tip...."When you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth." Sir Arthur Conan Doyle
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Hemet, Land of milk and honey.
Posts: 887
Good Answers: 20
#7

Re: Asking an International Engineering Management Question Here

11/09/2016 1:54 AM

Can you post the names of the " civilized " countries, that way, the ones that aren't, will know who they are.

Register to Reply
Guru
Popular Science - Cosmology - New Member Technical Fields - Technical Writing - New Member Engineering Fields - Energy Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Electrical Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Electromechanical Engineering - Old Member, New Association

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Lexington, KY
Posts: 1484
Good Answers: 71
#10

Re: Asking an International Engineering Management Question Here

11/09/2016 8:16 AM

In my case the bullying is tied to a forty year old concept that has been taken advantage in some seriously ugly ways. We use "Goals and Objectives" supposedly to track performance and thereby justify the distribution of raises.

After being rated as a top performer for two years in a row, I have been subjected to additional work with no respect to the expected time frame causing repeated cases of just missing the goal. This manipulation goes unchecked and any rebuke is taken as a hostile response. It is just wrong, but it provides an avenue for limiting how much money the company has to shell out for raises. And, they think that we can't see it for what it is. What a scam.

__________________
A great troubleshooting tip...."When you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth." Sir Arthur Conan Doyle
Register to Reply
Power-User

Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 119
Good Answers: 4
#12

Re: Asking an International Engineering Management Question Here

11/09/2016 8:45 AM

Yep, follow the money.

Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Commissariat de Police, Nouvions, occupied France, 1942.
Posts: 2482
Good Answers: 76
#13

Re: Asking an International Engineering Management Question Here

11/09/2016 9:20 AM

There's no need to outlaw come-uppance either, then.

__________________
Good moaning!
Register to Reply
Guru
Popular Science - Cosmology - New Member Technical Fields - Technical Writing - New Member Engineering Fields - Energy Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Electrical Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Electromechanical Engineering - Old Member, New Association

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Lexington, KY
Posts: 1484
Good Answers: 71
#15
In reply to #13

Re: Asking an International Engineering Management Question Here

11/09/2016 12:13 PM

Not sure what that means. Solar Eagle hit the nail on the head with his link. I actually found it 3 nights ago.

Perhaps you are referring to the attitude displayed more often by royalty or wealthy people who thinks their poo has no odor?

__________________
A great troubleshooting tip...."When you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth." Sir Arthur Conan Doyle
Register to Reply
Register to Reply 15 comments
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Comments rated to be "almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, rate them!
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

Brave Sir Robin (1); Crabtree (1); Fredski (1); James Stewart (1); lrsheldon (1); lyn (1); NotUrOrdinaryJoe (5); Rixter (1); SolarEagle (1); tonyhemet (2)

Previous in Forum: Interview for Engineering Assignment   Next in Forum: Too Early To Switch Careers?

Advertisement