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Saving Water Damaged Vehicles By Freeze Drying

09/23/2017 3:39 PM

Would it be possible to freeze dry waterlogged cars?

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#1

Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/23/2017 4:33 PM

Getting over the obvious damage that would result when residual water expands when it is frozen, and the unaffected silt deposited in every horizontal surface in the flooded vehicle (electrical connections, carpet, seats, under-dash, trunk, frame, etc. and the garbage, dead animal carcases, mold, etc. etc. etc, You could remove the residual water, but nothing else.

So, in addition to being illegal (that won't bother the criminal element) is would required a complete tear down and replacement of the vehicles major components, engine, transmission, rear end and the list goes on.

So, if you are a criminal, you may be tempted.

I think it's a stupid idea!

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#3
In reply to #1

Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/23/2017 5:17 PM

Oh, but there's nothing better than seeing the magic smoke appear when you power that peice of junk back up!

Glad you're back with us!

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#5
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Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/23/2017 5:26 PM

Thanks. It's good to see some of you. Other's, not so good.

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#26
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Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/26/2017 1:48 PM

Hey Lyn: Why is it illegal to fix a flooded out car? If it is your car, you can do whatever you wish with can you not?

I know, I know, the thing is you just can't offer it for sale (without putting that right out there on the sales tag).

Personally, I would submit it to the insurance company, and be shed of the thing, and back in a different ride.

Nice to see you again, old man. Surely, we can kick around some of the great questions of our time, without being too surly about it? Right?

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#2

Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/23/2017 5:15 PM

I'd be tempted to use a large heated vacuum chamber.

Put the vehicle in minus the battery, window wash fluid and possibly coolant, preheat it up to ~ 140 - 150F then put in under a moderate vacuum for 24 hours.

Pretty good chance any water would be driven out without damaging anything with that method.

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#7
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Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/23/2017 6:06 PM

And what about the silt deposited in every horizontal surface in the flooded vehicle (electrical connections, carpet, seats, under-dash, trunk, frame, etc. and the garbage, dead animal carcases, mold, etc. etc. etc?

Do those magically disappear too?

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#31
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Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/26/2017 11:27 PM

And you figure freeze drying would remove any of it how?

Heated vacuum evaporation is basically the same process as freeze drying but done at different temperature and without the likely ice expansion damages as well. Plus it would be far quicker and cheaper to implement too.

Also it could possibly do a bit of slit removal/loosening given the phase change process of the water in the debris would loosen its attachment to whatever surface it was on.

It might not do a lot but it would do more than freeze drying would.

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#4

Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/23/2017 5:17 PM

Freeze drying, at least for items that might be damaged by expansion of ice crystals, is performed with a very rapid reduction in temperature to avoid formation of large crystals and move quickly to a point where volume is similar to what it was in the liquid state. This is followed by a reduction in pressure.

Your idea involves a lot of expense to cool a whole vehicle down that quickly and then significantly reduce the pressure over that sizeable volume. Even if you can cover that, the benefits of freeze drying would be minimal. All the contaminants would still be in the vehicle, in the cushions, in the apholstery, in the intake, in the exhaust, likely in the fuel system, in all kinds of assorted filters, in the bearings, all over the electronics.... everywhere.

There is no need to freeze. If you want to dry a car out, just circulate air that is kept warm and dry. You would still have the contamination problem.

Perhaps you could reflood the car with clean water to rinse it prior to drying. Still would be a lot of expense. You would then need to get approvals of regulating authorities to get any resale value.

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#14
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Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/24/2017 2:28 AM

Hello,

All the freeze drying that I've seen done involved reduced pressure before temperature change was achieved.

The reduced pressure increases evaporation rate of the water. The temperature reduction is to stop the water "boiling" as the pressure is reduced.

The water should never become ice, just as it should never boil, since both those conditions are what cause irreversible damage of the cell walls in organic materials being dried.

I agree however that the idea is not a feasible method to recover a flooded vehicle. Residues, especially in electronics might dry, but the failures will return once the vehicle is returned to normal environmental conditions, not to mention the pong from the actual debris and detritus that would be deposited.

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#17
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Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/25/2017 10:50 AM

Not sure why you got so many off topics on that. It seems to me you did a fine job of describing, in brief, the process of freeze drying and why it would not work.

Reality check or business opportunity; Currently in America, we do not have enough freeze drying capacity for the amount of products we are trying to freeze dry. My plant is building its own freeze drier facility since Oregon Freeze Drying, Anteco and a few others we try to use, can't keep up with our output.

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#19
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Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/25/2017 5:56 PM

He received 5 off topic ratings for the same reason your comment did...the same reason this comment also receives 5 off topic ratings.

The box stating 'Yes, this comment is very likely to be considered off-topic' was left checked when the 'preview comment' button was selected.

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#21
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Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/25/2017 6:06 PM

LoL useful tool.

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#24
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Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/25/2017 8:17 PM

Thanks (I think). This actually isn't the first time someone has called me that.

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#27
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Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/26/2017 1:51 PM

I think I have, only not so much on the useful (projection?)

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#30
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Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/26/2017 2:35 PM

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#25
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Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/26/2017 8:04 AM

Do not be concerned about the off topic score. It was me that set it that way since it didn't relate specifically to the topic at hand. It was not done by others.

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#6

Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/23/2017 5:29 PM

...and, the TITANIC can sail again once all the water was pumped out, too.

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#28
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Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/26/2017 1:53 PM

Uh, wouldn't we have to make rusticles run uphill first?

Not to mention gathering up all those parts, and putting them back unbent.

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#8

Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/23/2017 6:15 PM

They're not flooded with clean, distilled water, but with dirty, nasty water. No way!

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#10
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Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/23/2017 8:04 PM

What? You worried about some BABY RUTH™ "bars" hiding in the carpet?

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#9

Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/23/2017 6:25 PM

It certainly is possible to freeze dry a car. I seriously doubt doing this to the whole vehicle will help in resurrecting a flooded vehicle. The forces from freezing step will damage many items. Now some removed items; carpeting, upholstery, etc. a freeze dry process might be a restoration method. However, it will likely be more cost effective to just scrap the vehicle.

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#11

Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/23/2017 9:43 PM

Possible yes....practical, no....helpful, no....advisable, no....

It's usually not worth restoration unless the car is special in some way....very special...of course it depends on how deep in the water it was....just the carpet got wet....or the car was nearly submerged....a thorough inspection will tell the story....

http://www.secondchancegarage.com/public/650.cfm

http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/how-to/a70/1272386/

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#12

Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/23/2017 10:34 PM

The grit gets into unprotected bearings and they fail very quickly.
The water also produces electrically conductive tracks in all sorts of places and these start to produce problems months later. Such as on PC boards, relays, connectors and you are constantly having problems with the electrical system. And don't forget, many items are just plain mild steel and will start to rust.
Maybe if you flooded the car with clean water and moved it around like a washing machine, most of the particle-deposits may be washed away. But things like window winders, door locks and tail light housings will all have bits of grit. TRUE GRIT

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#13

Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/23/2017 10:51 PM

So you have water that has gotten into the intake manifold and cylinders and you want to freeze it. This isn't going to crack up to what you are looking for!

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#29
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Re: Saving water damaged vehicles by freeze drying

09/26/2017 1:57 PM

More like someone is smoking crack, if they think this would restore the car.

Some parts might could be restored by final drying this way, but they have to be totally cleaned first. Bearings are one thing that will be toast (remark by Colin55).

It really is not worth the pain unless this is a 1932 Duesenberg, or a silver class Rolls.

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#15

Re: Saving Water Damaged Vehicles By Freeze Drying

09/25/2017 7:39 AM

Yes, though as ice occupies more volume than water, there is the risk of popping all the tack welds holding the things together as the water freezes.

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#16

Re: Saving Water Damaged Vehicles By Freeze Drying

09/25/2017 10:27 AM

I prefer to drip dry them.

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#18
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Re: Saving Water Damaged Vehicles By Freeze Drying

09/25/2017 1:37 PM

That would have made a great "Caption This".

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#20

Re: Saving Water Damaged Vehicles By Freeze Drying

09/25/2017 6:04 PM

I take it your talking about the interior cloth and the like... I would think that a high powered blow dry would be better... but it's not just water your dealing with in a flood, it's dirt, sand, oil, grease as well as excrement/sewage to name a few.

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#22
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Re: Saving Water Damaged Vehicles By Freeze Drying

09/25/2017 6:08 PM

Trust me folks, The next couple of years it would be best to avoid buying a used car unless you can document it's history.

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#23
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Re: Saving Water Damaged Vehicles By Freeze Drying

09/25/2017 6:14 PM

That's all I've been doing as of late... and when it hits 225,000- 250,000 I trade for a newer used car with 40,000-80,000 miles on.

but now... I need to wait a few years until these are sold, bought and removed from the market. As well as there aren't any more floods.

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#32
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Re: Saving Water Damaged Vehicles By Freeze Drying

09/27/2017 8:29 AM

Same here. I'm pretty much a 'end of life user'/'last owner' type.

Pretty much everything I own gets run until it's not worth anything but scrap metal due to at soe point the overall cost of major rebuild work being worth way more than the vehicle is at whatever age and or mileage it broke down at.

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#33
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Re: Saving Water Damaged Vehicles By Freeze Drying

09/27/2017 8:44 AM

in 2012, I had to scrap out my 2001 Oldsmobile Intrique with 225,000 on it, the only reason, it was rusting from the inside out, mechanically it would have lasted another 50,000 miles, (probably more)

And by rusting inside out, I mean, paint was prefect... but on the inside behind the sheetmetal holding the paint was reasoned I sold it... an example, I normally check the brakes by jacking the car up taking the tire off. the last time I put the jack under, and started lifing it, the whole frame and body started bending (crumbling) do the poor structural integrity of the body. Fortunately, I had already picked out the replacement (2007 Buick Lucerne), just had to buy it.

I drove the Olds to the scrap yard, and on the way there, I was at the stop lights, about 2 blocks from the yard. And the brakes felt funny, so I step on the brake pedal a little harder and rupture the line. Didn't know at the time but I knew, as I was going there... for brakes I had to pump.. good think I was close, otherwise I would had to the tow truck for the POS to haul it (2) blocks.

When I got there I look at the lines and that's what it was it.

When I went into the office to give them my keys, even then they gave my $600.00 cash for it... only because it had the original catalytic converter in it. I was surprise.

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