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Guru

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Too Much Ice?

10/13/2017 10:02 AM

interesting but sad story out of Antarctica.."Scientific Research, said it had been caused by a record amount of summer sea iceThe unusual extent of sea ice meant the penguins had to travel an extra 100km to forage for food

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/oct/12/penguin-catastrophe-leads-to-demands-for-protection-in-east-antarctica

why are we continuously fed the story that all the ice is disappearing? these little birds make their living diving into water and consuming fish, can't do that if the water freezes over!

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Guru
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#1

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/13/2017 10:36 AM

Let me think. What could be the root cause of excessively rainy (not snowy) weather and greater than normal glacier calving during an Antarctic winter?

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Guru

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#2
In reply to #1

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/13/2017 10:51 AM

no amount of rain made for a 100K to get to the ocean

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#4
In reply to #2

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/13/2017 11:34 AM

Did you read your own cited article. Paragraph # 6:

The unusual extent of sea ice meant the penguins had to travel an extra 100km to forage for food. And the rainy weather left the chicks, which have poor waterproofing, wet and unable to keep warm.

I think something related to the difference between and and snow accelerated the amount of glacier calving to make the extra sea ice, too.

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Guru

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#5
In reply to #4

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/13/2017 12:41 PM

Trying to pry open a closed mind is a difficult thing. In some cases, impossible.

Beam us up, Scotty. There is no intelligent life here.

Remember, you can lead a horse to water, but you can't change his spots.

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#10
In reply to #5

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/13/2017 3:49 PM

Yes, closed minds are difficult to pry open. But closed minds should not be allowed to spread faulty analyses unchallenged.

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#3

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/13/2017 11:30 AM

"The link between climate change and the sea-ice extent around Antarctica is not very clear. Sea ice has been increasing in recent years, which could be attributed to a rise in the amount of freshwater in the ocean around the continent caused by climate change. However, over the long term, climate change is expected to cause the sea ice to shrink dramatically."

From your web article.

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Guru

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#6

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/13/2017 12:49 PM

Summer sea ice and rainy weather? Whether we call it summer or winter, the season that just passed in the southern hemisphere should be the coldest.

I'm no climatologist, but I could do a passable job of standing in for an avuncular weatherman. Excessively rainy weather in Antarctica during the season that should be the coldest, doesn't sound good. Excessively rainy weather ok n Colorado during the winter would be bad news and it is way closer to the equator.

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#7

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/13/2017 1:42 PM

As deep ocean temperatures around Antarctic rise, they increase ice shelf melt, according to a study led by Richard Bintanja. This meltwater is creating a cool layer near the surface of the ocean that promotes sea ice production. In addition, the meltwater is fresh, or much less salty and dense than surrounding saline ocean layers. So fresher meltwater floats upward, mixing with the cold surface layer, lowering its density. As this fresh layer expands, it forms a stable puddle on top of the ocean that makes it easier to produce and retain sea ice. This growing fresh puddle changes the ocean heat flux. Zhang also studied this change, and his models showed that warming would increase sea ice, up to a point. “If the current warming continues, the increase in ice may continue for some time,” Zhang said. But, the increase will likely not continue indefinitely. “If the warming gets stronger, there will come a point when ice growth is smaller than the ocean heat flux available to melt ice,” he said. Under those conditions, sea ice extent and volume will begin to decrease.

Why is there so much Antarctic sea ice? | National Snow and Ice Data ...

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#8
In reply to #7

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/13/2017 2:07 PM

Sounds like a moderating influence...warmer temps leading to greater sea ice...yielding greater abledo...

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#24
In reply to #7

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/16/2017 1:42 PM

As the cited article says:

Ropert-Coudert said the region had been severely affected by the break-up of the Mertz glacier tongue in 2010, when a piece of ice almost the size of Luxembourg – about 80 km long and 40km wide – broke off. That event, which occurred about 250km from Petrels Island, had a big impact on ocean currents and ice formation in the region.

Glacier calving is making localized areas of the Antarctic sea ice more likely.

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#9

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/13/2017 2:56 PM

There are supply ships to the many out post down there. Many are escorted by ice cutters. Have the ice cutter cut a path by the island. To shorten the distance these penquins need to walk to open water.

They may not need the help every year. Satellite footage if monitored would tell if and when. All the research is funded by the tax payers. Whats a little extra fuel now to the amount we will have to pay when some one decides we need to do something to keep them from going extinct.

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#11

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/14/2017 8:00 AM

Also see: "... Overall, Antarctica has had a record low amount of summer sea ice, but the area around the colony has been an exception." (From the linked Grauniad article)

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#12

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/14/2017 8:25 AM

It's been quite a year for ice-related news at the bottom of the world: One of the largest icebergs — estimated at 1 trillion tons — ever recorded broke off from an ice shelf in Antarctica in July. And this week, a paper in the journal Geophysical Research Letters found that warming oceans are dramatically undermining the integrity of an important floating ice shelf in West Antarctica, Quartz magazine reported.

Antarctica ice hole: How did it get there? - USA Today

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#13

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/14/2017 9:20 AM

I wish they would make up their un decisive minds.

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Guru

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#14
In reply to #13

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/14/2017 11:30 AM

90% of actual scientists on the world today believe that the climate is getting warmer and oceans are rising. Could that be fresh water from melting glaciers? The cause may be in question by some, but only Luddites believe it is not a real problem.

Even the military accepts this!

Rising Seas Threaten Coastal Military Bases : NPR

The US Military on the Front Lines of Rising Seas (2016) | Union of ...

Rising seas threaten to swamp U.S. military bases by 2050 - USA Toda

Try as I might, I could NOT find any articles on the lowering of coastal sea waters, just more of this:

US military bases at risk from sea level rise: study - Phys.org

Coincidence, or real problem?

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#22
In reply to #14

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/16/2017 10:19 AM

What constitutes an "actual" scientist? Is it they have to believe?

Throwing in "believe" and "scientist" in the same sentence is all it takes to discredit all the warming/sea level rise talk.

But you know that, right?

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#15

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/14/2017 5:23 PM

Maybe if we take up all of the hungry penguins and put them in zoo's now and when someone post's the next interesting blog, we won't have to worry about it degenerating into a global - anti global warming fusillade.

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#16
In reply to #15

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/14/2017 5:38 PM

empirical data always disturbs those with emotional beliefs when the data clashes with what they've held as fact after repeating their mantra incorrectly for years

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#17
In reply to #16

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/14/2017 11:26 PM

Well rest assured there is too little water in the Mississippi River... What's that about?

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#18
In reply to #17

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/14/2017 11:46 PM

I find that hard to believe after Harvey and Nate. Literally, I looked and found your claim hard to believe.

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#19
In reply to #16

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/15/2017 11:22 AM

Rathery why they always stick with open ended future claims that continually have less and less defined points.

Every major claim they have made has not came even remotely true or even shown plausible correlation to imply even a basic conceivable trend in the directions they claim so far.

It's why every report made speculates that in X - XX decades something will probably happen. Timelines based on assuming absolutely zero civil and or general socio technological improvements/changes/renovations/advancements or whatever will have taken place by then.

The reality they don't like the fact that the past is the only factual thing we have to work with and so far the future predictions of the past becoming the present has pretty much disproved the believers agendas and claims of the time every time.

What-if and weak speculation/false flage claims is all they have and the world is waking up to it.

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Guru

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#20
In reply to #19

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/15/2017 1:17 PM

Yes, and based on the newest insanely vindictive, backward government regime in place, we are guaranteed that we will see "absolutely zero civil and or general socio technological improvements/changes/renovations/advancements or whatever will [never have] taken place."

The climate isn't going to stand still due to wishful thinking and denial on the part of the people who control the purse strings and policy.

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Guru

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#21
In reply to #20

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/15/2017 10:19 PM

"The climate isn't going to stand still due to wishful thinking and denial on the part of the people who control the purse strings and policy."

And yet that's exactly what the enviro nutters are wanting to make happen, at all costs to everyone today despite a continually dismal trend of never having their claims and justifications prove they have a damn clue about how our climate and environment truly works.

The world and humankind in general (especially outside the US) has far bigger issues to deal with today right now than concerning ourselves over half wit imagined claims about what's going to happen tomorrow and how bad it supposed to be.

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#23
In reply to #20

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/16/2017 10:21 AM

I want warm, because it was cold long enough!

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#25
In reply to #23

Re: Too Much Ice?

10/16/2017 8:15 PM

If yellow blew or asteroid struck some latent heat would be great luck.

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