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This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/06/2017 9:32 PM

Most of us will be dead before the really bad stuff happens. Our grandchildren won't be.

Global Warming's Worst-Case Projections Look Increasingly Likely ...

More here: Global Warming s Worst-Case Projections Look Increasingly Likely

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#1

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/06/2017 10:58 PM

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#2

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 12:09 AM

We could take all our plastic waste and make a solar shade for the Earth...

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#6
In reply to #2

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 8:18 AM

This solution is not likely to be popular with solar astronomers...

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#12
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 10:06 AM

To move all our plastic waste to that orbit, (and keep it there) would require more carbon footprint than we emit on a yearly basis for a number of years. I think we can safely put that idea in the 86 file.

Besides, we aren't supposed to solve the problem by starving out humanity by freezing them in the dark. Solution is worse than the perceived problem.

I expect bit progress in aquaculture of algae, which is by far the greatest tonnage of any plant species per area cultivated. This can replace the entire transportaiton fuel demand of the United States with an area (floating on the ocean somewhere perhaps) one seventh the area of the State of Colorado. I think that might turn out to be sustainable and renewable. If the area were increased, the tonnage of CO2 net removal would start to mount.

This still says nothing about methane introduction into the atmosphere, and volcanic sources still release more than all of human activity by far, so I suppose we will all need to move inland, wear sunshades, drink fruity alcoholic beverages, and wear Hawaiian shirts. Cool.

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#43
In reply to #12

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 4:10 PM

Oh I don't think there's any rush....

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#46
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/08/2017 7:48 AM

...(and keep it there)...

That's a good point. There are five Lagrange points (L1 - L5), and of these, only L4 and L5 are "parking places". The other three are of interest only in that a three-body solution exists for an object exactly at one of these three locations. Objects are attracted to the L4 and L5 points but repelled from L1, L2, and L3.

"The L4 and L5 points lie at the third corners of the two equilateral triangles in the plane of orbit whose common base is the line between the centers of the two masses, such that the point lies behind (L5) or ahead (L4) of the smaller mass with regard to its orbit around the larger mass.

The triangular points (L4 and L5) are stable equilibria, provided that the ratio of M1/M2 is greater than 24.96.[note 1][6] This is the case for the Sun–Earth system, the Sun–Jupiter system, and, by a smaller margin, the Earth–Moon system. When a body at these points is perturbed, it moves away from the point, but the factor opposite of that which is increased or decreased by the perturbation (either gravity or angular momentum-induced speed) will also increase or decrease, bending the object's path into a stable, kidney bean-shaped orbit around the point (as seen in the corotating frame of reference).

In contrast to L4 and L5, where stable equilibrium exists, the points L1, L2, and L3 are positions of unstable equilibrium. Any object orbiting at L1, L2, or L3 will tend to fall out of orbit; it is therefore rare to find natural objects there, and spacecraft inhabiting these areas must employ station keeping in order to maintain their position."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lagrangian_point

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#3

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 2:07 AM

This report is hard to reconsile with the consistently high temperatures predicted by models ...or perhaps failure of observed temperatures to meet the projections of models.

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#4

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 2:22 AM

Well, I don't trust UN-affiliated organizations. That said, this study/model/projection may have merit. I just think that, while global temperatures are rising, economies all over the world are going to collapse, and the ensuing social upheaval is going to do us in first.

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#7
In reply to #4

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 8:34 AM

Well, based on the op's opinion,... you're ignorant.

any consolation ... you're not alone. but then again,... that would be consolidation.

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#18
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 11:07 AM

Thanks phoenix911. Because of my conservative views, I will always be considered ignorant by a lot of the left. It's nice to not be alone - thanks!

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#20
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 11:33 AM

You will be treated by the left for the witch that you are. enjoy...

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#21
In reply to #20

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 11:50 AM

But if the scales by which one weighs the witch are skew, then an ordinary woman would weigh the same as a duck. Precisely what is going on here, someone has their thumb on the pan with the duck in it.

I say we burn the reports, and save the witch.

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#22
In reply to #21

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 12:21 PM

I say we burn the reports, and save the witch.

Left: ... we have a heretic in our mist...

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#23
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 1:13 PM

Ignorance | Definition of Ignorance by Merriam-Webster

Definition of ignorance

: the state or fact of being ignorant : lack of knowledge, education, or awareness

One CHOOSES to be ignorant. There is a cure, and that is knowledge.

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#24
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 1:22 PM

Presenting information does not necessary remove ignorance. If someone ever presents disinformation, it ensures ignorance, at least for a time.

Yes, people can be "well-educated", while retaining their preferred state of ignorance.

At least now we have all been informed what is being said in the reports.

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#25
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 1:36 PM

Truth keeping false reports and fake news at bay...

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#26
In reply to #25

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 1:59 PM

https://climatechangedispatch.com/tidalgate-climate-alarmists-caught-faking-sea-level-rise/

And when conclusions from the climate change fanatics are found to be based on compromised data numerous times, it makes it difficult to trust the fanatics or the data the next time a report or study comes out.

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#27
In reply to #26

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 2:30 PM

So...

In this corner,... weighing I don't know,... so, i'll say... 247 3/4 pounds... '

(3) time heavyweight liberal champion

LYN 'the fanatic fantasizer'

And in the opposite corner... weight again unknown so I'll say weighing at a buck 27.

a person, even the mongols fear

JBTardis 'The Ignorant'

Now you know the rules.... I make them up as I go along.... now go to your corners until the bell rings.

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#29
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 2:32 PM

well i am quite a bit more than a buck 27.

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#30
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 2:35 PM

We know,... I saw your Not Welcome Posters at most chinese buffets...

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#31
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 2:38 PM

That must be for someone else. I don't eat Chinese food (much).

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#32
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 2:40 PM

Of course you don't, you're no longer allowed...

I warned you I make the rules up as I go along....

And with that said....I now have a strong urge to vote for Hillary.

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#33
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 3:02 PM

She's not on the menu today, no wanton Clinton for you.

Tardis has not gone a buck 27 since the 3rd grade.

More like a buck 127.

At least no one is facing off with Ivar the Boneless today!

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#34
In reply to #33

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 3:03 PM

She's not on the menu today, no wanton Clinton for you.

So your telling me... The fish is bad...

got it.

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#35
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 3:07 PM

Shrimp either.

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#36
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 3:17 PM

You leave Biden out of this... he means well. ineffective, yes, but means well.

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#37
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 3:23 PM

OK, I won't Gore there.

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#40
In reply to #37

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 3:38 PM

HEY ... this thread ain't big enough for 2 bad comedians.... so I'll bid you adieu.

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#41
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 3:44 PM

Have a nice weekend. I plan to get a lot done on a readout and logger this weekend.

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#42
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 3:48 PM

Thanks... good plan... We have a company Christmas party this weekend.... haven't been to one for the past 3 years... hopefully it'll cheer up my girlfriend... we lost our little daschund 'Tucker' last Saturday...

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#54
In reply to #41

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/08/2017 10:28 AM

I'm camping with my son's Boy Scout troop this weekend...and it's going to be a cold one for Florida.

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#53
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/08/2017 10:24 AM

In 3rd grade I was more like 85, buck 27 was 10th grade, haven't made it to buck 127 yet, and i'm working hard not to.

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#28
In reply to #26

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 2:31 PM

In all fairness and seriousness... yes, that is the point I was making. And that goes to James post also.

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#8
In reply to #4

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 8:56 AM

And secondly,... if Trump would push to pull out of the UN... the UN cash supply will become a fraction of what it is now.

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#19
In reply to #8

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 11:08 AM

How true!

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#5

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 7:17 AM

Oh, geeeez. Here we go again with the warm-mongering.

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#39
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 3:37 PM

You win the pun award, sir, nicely done!

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#9

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 9:22 AM

You know, projections, forecasts, and predictions generally have a way of looking increasingly likely, otherwise whomever is doing the prognosticating would be boxing the air, yes?

By the time this alleged stuff "happens", NK will have already made it happen using their idiotic threats as a means to warm up their own backyard by several thousand degrees.

There is my projection for this morning, December 7, 2017, a date that in 1941 became a date forever locked in infamy.

I do appreciate you legitimate concern for the generations following us, as misplaced as it might be.

In spite of what you believe about me as a conservative leaning individual, I have devoted all of my education and career to science, conservation of our natural resources, and devising better ways to access energy. As far back as 1982, I was advocating loudly for wind farms in West Texas. How about that. So blame me for stupid grid instability this may cause.

I am also advocating loudly for improved energy storage far and above what some paltry lithium batteries could ever provide. I have always believed that a far better use of petroleum is as lubrication, plastics we need, medicine, and fine chemicals.

Burning up the petroleum reserves has never made sense in my mind when uranium is a far denser source of energy. Fusion power seems as far out of reach now as it did during the 1980's. I am still going to experiment with what some will term "cold fusion", although there are some experiments where there is nothing "cold" about it at all. I don't call an electric arc under water cold in any sense of the term.

That is just an example of how associations get stuck in our minds, and we cannot seem to think around or over them.

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#10
In reply to #9

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 9:30 AM

Jimmy... based on the title... you're ignorant... and there's no excuse for it. sorry.

Now me on the other hand, I'm just challenging how this viewpoint is presented.

If you go and look at where these are coming. Not MIT or Space and Science News they are are just basically reporting and are only messengers, but where and who is financing the studies... it can reveal a storyline in its self.

But these help support ones platform,... and then calling everyone that disagrees or challenges it, 'ignorant'.

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#13
In reply to #10

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 10:12 AM

I was actually stating the obvious: "the best models are the ones that fulfill our agenda". Instead of looking at this for the obvious bullshine that it is, why not look at this as the money-making opportunity it really is, and dive in with both hands?

The smart money is investing in all the "renewable" and "sustainable" technology that is supposed to save us from ourselves, while government entities lean further and further out there toward regulating beef hearts. Don't you get it? It is a means to the end of controlling all the money, all the power, and all the credit...are you saying you are going to miss out on your share?

Frankly, I do not care one beef heart what the end of all this climate chicken-little hype will be. I do care whether or not I pass on millions and millions of dollars to my grandson, and that is about all that matters. Capitalism is wonderful, and it always thrives, and always finds ways to make money and fool the traditional, that mostly sit in their mangers and growl at those attempting to take their share of the hay.

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#15
In reply to #13

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 10:16 AM

That is an excellent attitude as well as a great addition to this discussion... but it still hasn't lessen your ignorance that this thread imposes on you...

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#16
In reply to #15

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 10:34 AM

which is worse, ignorance, or gullibility?

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#17
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 10:41 AM

can't say... I find both.... entertaining.

But hypocrisy,... THAT I find as hilarious.

Go ahead... say something hypocritical.... I dare you... you'll have me rolling on the floor with laughter.

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#11

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 9:39 AM

"global temperatures could rise nearly 5 °C .... That’s 15 percent hotter than the previous estimate".

Previous estimate must've been 31ºC colder than present. Calculating a percentage change using ºC is pretty much meaningless.

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#14
In reply to #11

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 10:14 AM

Since when do you expect media geeks to know about numbers and math?

I could say if I get 5 points smarter, it would be an increase of 20%, but that would make me a moron, now wouldn't it?

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#44
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 6:20 PM

If it was projected that you would get 4 points smarter, and in fact you got 5 points smarter, would that be an increase of 20% or 25% above projections? Inquiring minds want to know....

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#65
In reply to #44

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/11/2017 1:26 PM

25% I think, but it might have to be verified by a 5th grader.

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#38

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 3:30 PM

I won't bash anyone's beliefs, nor their political views. With all due respect, I freely admit that I am ignorant in regards to Lyn's original post.

Take it for what it is.

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#45

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/07/2017 10:28 PM

Global Warming? I'm freezing my ass off here in Saint Helens Oregon!

If NK doesn't do us in, Yellowstone or any other Volcano will. Mother Nature does a pretty good job at check and balances. Not'n better than a Volcanic Winter to set things right again.

Fire and brimstone, I say

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#56
In reply to #45

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/08/2017 2:55 PM

..... and to think 50 years ago scientists were trying to come up with a way to warm the planet.....

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/discovery-of-global-warming/

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#47

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/08/2017 8:47 AM

What is really going on?

You have so called media/fact checker battling it out.

Once saying the IPCC Climate models are wrong.... with a scientific paper, authored by Myles R. Allen, Richard J. Millar. Who are these guys....

Or others reporting the models are running too hot....

And you have fact checkers saying otherwise... never had confidence in fact checkers...

That they are in fact the Projections are in line....

I was really disappointed when this Global Warming Climate Change became political... if for one reason only... its the politicians making money off of nothing. It basically polluted everything. And now you could basically order anything you want off a menu.

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#48

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/08/2017 9:27 AM

Oh no, the sky is falling......again! Remember the doomsday predictions from top "ecologists" or whatever they were on earth day 1970. We should all be dead a long time ago according to them. I have heard so many predictions that turned out totally wrong I no longer pay any attention to them. Most are politically skewed to show the results that fit their agenda.

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#49
In reply to #48

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/08/2017 9:33 AM

Politics does obfuscate the issue. Note that it isn't just politics from one side...that would be far easier to deal with. Unfortunately people on different ends of the pitical spectrum are distorting and distracting. It isn't even clear of the opposing sides somewhat cancel each other out, or just make it so much less likely we will be lookiing at the right things, predicting with any accuracy, or able to take any necessary appropriate action.

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#50
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/08/2017 10:08 AM

Note that it isn't just politics from one side...that would be far easier to deal with. Unfortunately people on different ends of the pitical spectrum are distorting and distracting.

Yes,... I would equate it to MAD ==>> Mutually Assured Destruction.

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#51
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/08/2017 10:19 AM

MIA---> mutually assured ignorance

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#52
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/08/2017 10:21 AM

MAI ---> mutually assured ignorance ---> MAIR ---> mutually assured ignorant reporting

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#55
In reply to #52

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/08/2017 10:45 AM

uhg. thanks.

MIA --> MAI TAI --> Mutually Assured Ignorance Totally Acronymized Incorrectly.

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#66
In reply to #48

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/11/2017 1:31 PM

Well, some of "them" or "us" died off between then and now, thus "they" cannot be 100% incorrect. This gets back to lies, damned lies, and the far worse, statistics.

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#57

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/08/2017 3:17 PM

Regardless of your opinion on climate change, isn't it better to err on the side of clean air and water?

Air pollution, particularly from fossil fuels, is not good for our health or lifespan.

http://insights.globalspec.com/article/6782/over-500-000-deaths-per-year-linked-to-air-pollution-in-europe

When Hurricane Harvey hit Texas, it created a huge chemical disaster from compromised facilities housing highly toxic chemicals used in the petroleum industry. People there will be dealing with those repercussions for decades. When Hurricane Maria hit Puerto Rico, the wind farm remained standing - and functional -- without adding to the environmental and health crises on the island.

Why is this a liberal/conservative issue? Clean energy should be the gold standard we are all striving toward. Why wouldn't we want the U.S. to be the world leader on this? (Well, I guess I know the answer to that.)

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#58
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/08/2017 4:33 PM

Nothing is ever so black and white....the answers must make economic sense and be practical...We could end air pollution tomorrow by just stopping everything, but that would inflict more pain and suffering than the air pollution ever will...no,, change must be gradual and economically viable to work....and that is what's happening now....the speed of change can only match the innovation that drives it...

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#59
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/08/2017 5:22 PM

I understand that and don't disagree. I don't think anyone is suggesting that we turn off the gas pumps tomorrow. But there seems to be a lack of motivation on the part of some to pursue that innovation. This is the only planet we've got, so why not put everything we can into protecting it?

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#60
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/08/2017 5:43 PM

Some, others, ... ?

Everything starts at home with I.

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#62
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/10/2017 3:17 PM

Everything starts with an 'e', at home or elsewhere.

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#63
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/11/2017 9:46 AM

I think home and elsewhere end with an 'e'.

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#64
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/11/2017 11:58 AM

....but nothing ends with a 'g'.

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#68
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/12/2017 4:44 AM

.... something does.

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#69
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/12/2017 9:42 AM

everything ends with a "g".

We are totally and irredeemably off course now.

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#71
In reply to #68

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/13/2017 10:15 PM

...it does not.

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#61
In reply to #59

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/08/2017 10:53 PM

Global warming is hardly the only threat we face as humans on this planet....there are many more immediate needs that must share the resources we have available...

http://www.iflscience.com/plants-and-animals/five-biggest-threats-human-existence/

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#67
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/11/2017 1:41 PM

Some of us do not have the luxury of seeing this or any world in black-and-white, but we do see gradations of luminosity, and we see in living color.

The bigger picture: when someone outside the system (of say economics and general public well-being) starts to perturb the system, they better damn well know what the effects of those perturbations will be, because some of these dynamic systems far from equilibrium are keening sensitive to changing the critical parameters, and it can drive the system into complete chaos, or even collapse.

No one is knocking "renewables" (even though they are anything but). Other means of energy utilizable have a serious value to add to that system and should not be ruled out overnight. Urban sprawl is a great issue (and somewhat of a problem) where farmlands are being chewed up and turned into housing blocks or parking lots for multi-story business sites. This will eventually catch up to us all, if no better urban planning that eliminates sprawl is not put forth by leadership.

If fossil fuels are so evil and bad, how come life spans went up in the 20th Century?

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#70
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Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/13/2017 10:14 PM

"...This will eventually catch up to us all, if no better urban planning that eliminates sprawl is not put forth by leadership...."

This "leadership" you speak of; is this term a (sarcastic) euphemism for elected government officials?

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#72
In reply to #67

Re: This Isn't Going Away. Ignorance Is No Excuse.

12/14/2017 7:31 AM

Some of us do not have the luxury of seeing this or any world in black-and-white,

Unless one (normally (ex)politician) is about to make a buck off of it,... and if you are not 100% in or disagree in the smallest way,... well then, you're a NAZI, Basement Dweller, Birther, Christian Sharia, Conned, Conspiritard, Deplorables (I like that one) , Drumpf, Fascist,... you get the picture.

anyway to make a buck...

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