Is it something wrong here?

In fact, those guys will suffer not any losses from this little transaction.

Im afraid they may be more laze than me that will not amend my sentence wrong and take time to point it out.

cnpower, your English is quite good enough for most of us English speaking people to read...

I just wish I good say the same for my Chinese, or in fact any other language!!

John.

Thank you very much for your encouragement words.

It might be award for me to study a languge. I know you are speaking by courtesy.

I wish my threads can be understand by others who need help and give out help.

I wish anyone can point out my wrong expression in english directly.

In fact, sometimes after I post and then read my words, even me cannt know what I was saying.

until now only PetrotoPople pointed out my misunderstand for one sentence.

I know most of our oriental like to save his face. but in side of study. it neednt. it will resist on your learning and harm your program.

I also welcome everyone in the word learn chinese. In this room I can be a very good chinese teacher. However I know more chinese culture, history etc.

Chinese word is very interesting, wonderful, art and marvelous.

Agreed, you are doing quite well. English is a difficult language. I studied German for a few years many many years ago and recall next to nothing of it. I am about to take some Korean lessons. I just got my very first taste of word structure. I have a looooooooooong way to go before I am as proficient in Korean as you are in English.

I know german is more difficult than study english.

like russia, it has very complex grammar. its verb is more difficult than english verb using.

Why do you learn korean? may you work in korean now or their staff?

in fact, you can lean chinese. there are lots of korean in china. and more and more korean move to bejing for job.

I work for a Korean owned company and study a Korean form of martial arts.

Oh, I see, Thats why you study Korean.

Now I can guess your age.

Now I can guess your age.

In February I will celebrate the 17th anniversary of my 21st birthday.

It seems none or company out there like to study chinese.

in fact, there are always existing chinese in the world. everwhere have.

Hello China Power! Any relation to Austin Power?

Here is the help with English. Where the words are underlined, that means take them out. Where they are bold-faced, that means add them in. I will wait while you complete your lesson.

Yesterday I tried to post to an interesting thread yesterday after found an interesting thread of in which some young guys wrote about copying from this forum for homework on the forum. I said to them, that if you can they would help me on with English, I can would help you them with your their homework in either physics, or math, and software, etc.--whatever because I might hvnt yet forgotten I can still remember about these those classes. I think did not really intend this thread my post hasnt got to be taken any business tendency seriously; I only meant to show the guys but filled with a little humor--no to those guys and dont harm to them at all intended. Bbut after sending it, I haven't yet seen saw this that my post was never added to that thread. So I think it must wonder if be something might be wrong with the that bbs room; and I came here to ask you, wWhat's up?

Here it is again without proof reading attributes--

Yesterday I tried to post to an interesting thread in which some young guys wrote about copying from this forum for homework. I said to them, that if they would help me with English, I would help them with their homework in physics, math, software, etc.--whatever I can still remember about those classes. I did not really intend my post to be taken seriously; I only meant to show the guys a little humor--no harm intended. But after sending it, I saw that my post was never added to that thread. So I wonder if something might be wrong with that bbs room; and I came here to ask you, What's up?

Mr. Power, now you owe me help with my homework; but there is one problem. If I copy what you write and hand it in, what will my teacher think? Hmm! Maybe we better stay with only math.

Now, about your problem with your post. Maybe someone stopped it because you did not pay duty for an imported English lesson? Or maybe they took your humor to be writing s____t messages in code? I suggest that when you export humor on the BB from now on, you should add the statement, "I'm just kidding" or "That was a joke." Because humor is not always taken with the same humor. See?

Yes, that was a joke and I've only been kidding

You are helpful with english.

I take in your critique. not bad.

I can teach you a chinese word as repay.

" zuo de hao, xiao xiong di"

(well done, guy.)

But I really havent got such ideas to fire at someone. only but a humor.
How much will you judge the words score? can I get 50 score?
If it were wrote by you and hand in your teacher, he would beat you.
Now I can return you a math problem as payment.
1+1=3
1+1=0
Its absolutely right.

Thank you for the compliment. I would ask for a phonetic spelling of zuo de hao, xiao xiong di, so I would be sure to pronounce it correctly. But what good would Chinese phonetic spelling do? I still might get beating from teacher. So I must pretend to be "Chinese guy" and say it as good as I can…then cover my head or go under my desk…maybe honorable Teacher won't find me?

You wanted a grade of 50, but I think you did better than you think. Here is your grade score:

• 110010 ≡ 32 .............. Base score
• 101 ≡ 05............... Extra credits (EC) for Improvement
• 11 ≡ 03............... EC for Humorous/witty remark ("…teacher beating…")
• 10 ≡ 02............... EC for Flattering teacher
• 101 ≡ 05................ EC for total responses received (add 1/ea.)
• 11 ≡ 03................ EC for no. of responders (add 1/ea.)
• 10 ≡ 02............... Bonus for flattering responses rec'd (add 1/ea.)
• -1001 ≡ 09-.............. Penalty for unresponsive/answered wrong question/answer incomplete
• 111101 ≡ 3D................ Net grade for cn power

I hope this answers all of your questions? Did I pass?

Is very disappionted to get a low score. It seems that I hvnt yet graduated from primary school. My god. maybe never graduate from it. work hard, study hard and make a good prograss again. I only hve to encourage myself in this way. But on the other side, 3D is a very good word, means I hve got a space, to live, to study, to work and to make money. I like it. of cause hope to get 6D, 9D, nD...

My dear Sir,

You asked for 50 and I gave you 61. Where is the shame in more than what you expected or asked for? I congratulate you on wanting to shoot for 78; that is surely within grasp. But 113 will be problematic to the (as you say) n^th degree; since 100 is perfection! You would want your English to be more perfect than perfect?

And still be welcomed in conference room 4?

What's up, exactly?

CA

oh, today most of test is score more than 100

for example, in 300, 600, 700 etc,

If you like to open back door ( chinese words), I may achive more score.

As soon as I read cowanon's passage, I find there is a loong long way to go at english study. I seem to have to go to primary school again

I aways thinking in chinese instead of english way.

I know there is much redundance massage in any language. but only native speaker can understand a foreigher's speaking. just as same as I read a foreigher writing chinese.

dnt laugh at my skill. pls help me with it as above thread.

thanks for your encourage

Hello again, Power. (I took China to be your (on-line) "family" name, so I say Power as your familiar name. Please correct me if I have taken too much liberty or caused any loss of face.)

I'm writing to let you know I have seen your reply above, and that I am thinking about, and working off-line on, my reply - including the grade score you asked for.

In the meantime (American English, meaning: between now and later when some future event will happen), I have thought about your interest in language improvement, and some ideas have come to mind which you might find useful...and not have to go back to grammar school (which is an older term for primary school except that, originally, it meant only the first 3 years of school--the time in which American children were once (another idiom, meaning in the past) expected to have mastered basic reading & writing and arithmetic.) This thread seemed like a good one in which to impart those ideas to you.

Here are some steps you could take - along with rationales - to improve your mastery of English.

It is important to recognize the distinction between spoken and written English. Yes, some people - even those who ought to know better - might try to persuade you that you only have to write what you would say conversationally, but such advise can be misguided because it does not take circumstances into account. While hearing English with the ear and speaking English with the mouth can be a good way to increase vocabulary, if you wish to write (and speak) well - that is, with good diction and grammar in order to make your ideas understandable - you might not have enough opportunity to converse with those who have the English skills you would like to emulate. (Emulate, in this instance means: to follow after the way someone else writes and speaks English.) Such being the case, a very good way for you to learn both the vocabulary and the grammar (how to form sentences), diction (how to choose and use the words), and syntax (the mechanics of how to interpret and express ideas) of English is by extensive reading. By reading I don't mean just reading conversations that people post on bulletin boards. (Many who can express themselves in speech cannot do so well in writing; but virtually all who can express themselves well in writing can also do so in speech.) I do mean reading better forms of published literature. The more you read, the more your mind will begin to absorb how published writers express thoughts in English. You will gradually come to understand grammar, syntax, and diction (those subtle complexities of the English language everyone talks about) by seeing it (seeing recurring patterns ) again and again in different ways. You will come to find yourself borrowing from what you read until it becomes your own.

The next question would be: what is best - what should I, China Power, select to read?

To answer, first let me talk about newspapers. While many people have learn reading and writing from daily newspapers, this is not the best, or even a good, source for learning standard (or educated) English...for learning how to express complex ideas and nuances.This is because English language newspapers are written in a short-hand, and somewhat distorted, form of English called journalese. The idea with journalese is not so much to give meaning as it is to standardize and condense the way something is said; and doing so in a way that every reader (with money to buy a paper) can at least understand the basic points of a story. For the latter reason, daily newspapers are written and edited to about a sixth- or seventh-grade education level.

The better kind of reading for learning English is that to be found in books, academic or trade journals, and "serious" periodicals (magazines such as National Geographic, Scientific American...and so on). These can be non-fiction or fiction; both is best. Academic journals are a good source for learning grammar and expressing thoughts with precision. Fiction is best for learning different ways in which people (characters) express ideas in spoken words. Popular periodicals fall somewhere in between. Reading so called classics, including English and American ficton, is a good choice.

The next step I would suggest for you to look into involves a study "tool" known as sentence diagramming. It is one of the better learning methods, if not the best, for mastering grammar. Sentence diagramming was once used universally in American primary schools but not so much, if at all, in recent years. This is not because sentence diagramming does not work well or because students find it too difficult, but because (more and more) teachers have found it too difficult. (Ironically, many who could not learn the skill as students, turned out to be teachers. So the teachers' guilds began to press for removing the teaching technique from primary school curricula.) With sentence diagramming you would be doing largely what you are already doing - trying to figure how to put words together in coherent sentences - except that it gives a kind of road map, a set of rules for doing so. While you would be exposed to the various "parts of speech" while doing sentence diagramming, remembering the parts of speech is not the important thing. It is the visual "mapping" of sentences according to a small set of rules that will stick in your mind whenever you compose a new sentence...until gradually the maps are forgotten and the grammatically correct way of writing, and speaking, becomes second nature. (Second nature: doing something without needing to think about it.) Once you learn the sentence diagramming technique, you can use it to analyze sentences that you read - to see how others compose writing; or use it to help map out your own sentences - to find a best way to compose your own writing.

I cannot as yet point you to a good reference about sentence diagramming. It is a lot like bicycle riding. Something you learn...but might not easily find instructions written in a book. But, I will let you know if I come up with something.

Hope this was helpful; and see you, later, on the other thread.

CA

Its very kind of you to waste so much time to guide how to study english well.
It took me about a hour to read. Its very detail and instructive. I seem to go back to class again.
sentence diagramming was provalent in 70's last centure in taiwan school. it was good but now was dissappearing.I dont know why.
Just like other students I hv ever studied grammer very hard, but now, I really forget almost them all.
I forget many words as well, becasue they are no use to us in our working. I come to the room here because I recieved invitation of advertisement of the site again and again when I wsa testing a power supply. At last,I try to use this alias, means china power. As you know cn means china in url of internet.
Speaking to chinese name, its opposite to your west countries. you may familiar with it from your massage. Our family name, surname will be put forward at the first place and then their name. For example, Zhao Mengfu, Qian changyou, Li shimin, Sun zhongshan, etc. where Zhao, Qian, Sun, Li etc are their family name, surname, the later are their name, last name. But you always put you family name as last name.
In fact, Our chinese has about a thousands of surname, but we always name it as a hundred surname. very regulation.
However, you act as a teacher, I think you mmust be a good student even in school.
pls amend my passage if you would have time and see my thread in the room. I try to reply any question as long as possible. anything could be forgotten, if you dont use it for a long time.
you are a good editor of some magzine. You can come china to teach English

Okay, here it is. Some things were not totally clear in your "manuscript," so I had to guess your meaning. Let me know if I "guessed" correctly. Again, delete underlined letters and you will see the final, edited result.

It was very kind of you to waste [?} expend [?] so much time to guide me how with good ways to study English well. [omit return]

It took me about an hour to read and study your passage. [Editor's note: Almost perfect so far!] It was very detailed and instructive. It seemed like to going back to class again. [start new paragraph]

Sentence diagramming was prevalent in as recently as the '70's—last century—in Taiwan schools. It was good effective, but now was has since been disappearing; .I don't know why.

Just like many other former students, I hv ever studied grammar very hard in school; but by now I have really forgotten almost them all much of what I learned.

I forget many of the vocabulary lesson words as well, because they are have no use to us me in our my working on the job. [start new paragraph]

I first came to this room here site because I received invitation of advertisements of about and invitations to the site, again and again, when I was surfing for information while testing a power supply. At last, Here I try to use this alias use the alias, cnpower, which means china power. As you know, .cn signifies China in url's of on the Internet. [start new paragrapsh]

Speaking to about the ordering of Chinese names, it is the opposite to of your western countries. You (CA) may seem to be familiar with it this, from judging by your message. For those who are not… In Chinese tradition, our family name, the surname, will be put forward, at the first place, and then comes their given name—that name both parents agree to—the name that distinguishes one child from his or her siblings. For example, with names such as Zhao Mengfu, Qian changyou, Li shimin, Sun zhongshan (etc.), where Zhao, Qian, Li, and Sun etc are their would be the respective family names (the surnames); after those would come the given the later are their names, last name, in this instance: Mengfu, changyou, shimin, and zhongshan.. But you in the West, on the other hand, always put your family name as the last name. In fact, Incidentally, in Our my chinese China [Taiwan??] the language has actually includes about a thousands of surnames, maybe more, but we always name it as only about a hundred surnames are officially recognized—it is very much a matter of regulation. [Start new paragraph]

However Finally, you act write as if you could be a teacher;, I even think you mmust have been a good student even in school. [not new paragraph] pPls amend proof read and revise my passage here if you would happen to see this, and have the time. and see my thread in the room. I will try to reply to any questions, as long as possible. But don't wait too long, because anything could can be forgotten—including this discussion—if you don't use it for a long time. [No new paragraph] yYou are could be a good editor of some magazine. You can could even come to China to teach English!

Here's the second draft (that's editor talk

It was very kind of you to expend so much time to guide me with good ways to study English. It took me about an hour to read and study your passage. It was very detailed and instructive. It seemed like going back to class again.

Sentence diagramming was prevalent as recently as the '70's—last century—in Taiwan schools. It was effective, but has since been disappearing; I don't know why. Just like many other former students, I studied grammar very hard in school; but by now I have forgotten much of what I learned. I forget many of the vocabulary lesson words as well, because they have no use to me in my work on the job.

I first came to this site because I received advertisements about, and invitations to, the site, again and again, when I was surfing for information while testing a power supply. Here I use the alias, cnpower, which means china power. As you know, .cn signifies China in url's on the Internet.

Speaking about the ordering of Chinese names, it is the opposite of your western countries. You (CA) seem to be familiar with this, judging by your message. For those who are not… In Chinese tradition, our family name, the surname, will be put forward, at the first place, and then comes the given name—that name both parents agree to—the name that distinguishes one child from his or her siblings. For example, with names such as Zhao Mengfu, Qian changyou, Li shimin, Sun zhongshan (etc.), Zhao, Qian, Li, and Sun would be the respective family names (the surnames); after those would come the given names, in this instance: Mengfu, changyou, shimin, and zhongshan.. But you in the West, on the other hand, always put your family name as the last name. Incidentally, in my China [Taiwan??] the language actually includes about a thousand surnames, maybe more, but only about a hundred surnames are officially recognized—it is very much a matter of regulation.

Finally, you write as if you could be a teacher; I even think you must have been a good student in school. Pls proofread and revise my passage here if you happen to see this, and have the time. I will try to reply to any questions, as long as possible. But don't wait too long, because anything can be forgotten—including this discussion—if you don't use it for a long time. You could be a good editor of some magazine. You could even come to China to teach English!

Editor's note: The distinctive custom, compared with western tradition, for ordering of Chinese names can sometimes give rise to an unintended "mini clash of cultures." It is possible that a native-Chinese speaker might apply Chinese custom when writing, or even speaking, a western person's name. Without realizing it, the Chinese person could give offense because, in many situations (in western countries), it is deemed to be rude, demeaning, disrespectful, or inappropriately familiar to either, address a person by his/her last name as if it was the first name, or address a person by only his/her last name without prefacing the surname with a courtesy title such as Mr., Mrs., Doctor, etc.]

Hussh........ so big ... may be our friend gets it quicker

Incidentally, in my China [Taiwan??] the language actually includes about a thousand surnames, maybe more, but only about a hundred surnames are officially recognized—it is very much a matter of regulation.

---

There are about a thousand of surnames in our chinese society actually,( taiwan is only part of China) but we generally call it as hundred surname. Our chinese address a person by this costom, if he would be elder than you or you are colleague in a unit, you can preface their name with "Lao", if he is a younger or a boy or a girl, with "Xiao", fir example, Lao Li, Lao Zhang, means you are all adult. have almost same ages. Xiao Li, Xiao Chen means they are youngers or boy or girls. In the old convention, most peple call each other "master" as respect. If he is a leader, you can call his title as repect, but now sir is going into fashion. like your west people, call Mr. Ms. etc.

Hello cnpower

No language is easy to learn if it is not your first language , you try to understand word by word in sentence format and compare your origin language with it and manupulate through your brain for response through writing , typing , speech . It is quiet natural you refere with your origin language for better understanding , but as you keep on learning till you can hear , write , speak for your self it becomes more dificult you have to leave your mother tongue from interfering , you tend to miss grammer ,and start thinking in that perticular language .We used language interpretor when communicating with chinese guys in china , they used to simultaneously hear ,speak in english and china without any error , that interpretor knew 16 languages completly , some of these dialacs were ancient tribals that is not used now and she was of chinese origin that makes a point for you now . thank you

You are right, any educator would say so. But if you would live in a circumstance where none only but you study foreign languge, it would be very difficulty for you to think to understand in foreign languge. Most of us forget almost of our baxsis. Some of our friends have a little kowledge at firest, but now they are all speak fluent.as they live in a relative good circumstance and use it very often.

She is not simple to speak in 16 languages. I dont thnk I can do as same as she does even if I live in a harbour. However I m interested in engineering. foreign language is only a tool of my work.

I try to improve this skill. thts why I still stay in this room. I hope to understand others and can be understanded by others.

CA lists too many reference. its too hard for me to read. but I try to do. I know much of theory, I nneed practice. Thank you all.

It just like an engineering, when you start at it in practice, you will find its will difficulty, not as simple as theoyry. if none amend your sentence, you will get wrong forever.

I remember your words and pay attation to it.

The main difficulty in language learning is that the original language each person learns, actually hard-wires their brain connections.

It is not possible to remove the original language connections, as they are they are write once/read many times, type of connections.

Any further language, as it is learned, adds additionally to the original language connections.

This means that for each person, the original language they learned, all other languages and thinking are modified in the pattern of the original language.

So, for a person whose original language is Chinese, they will never be fully fluent in English or another language, sad to say, although gradual improvements can be made with effort.

The same goes for a person who tries to learn Chinese. With effort there may be improvement, but the hard-wiring remains, and the new language is interpreted through the nuances of the language first learned.

Responsibility for the multi-languages goes back to the desire of people long ago, who started to build the Tower of Babel.

Basically true, but only with some corrections. To say that a person will never become fluent in second (etc.) languages is not correct. One need only look at international-current-events broadcasts to verify.... What is correct, is that one's native language or languages acquisition is more or less finished (as a biological imperative) during the period of primary brain development--before the age of around six years. The import of this is that any language acquired after that age will invariably not be spoken conversationally with that language's indigenous inflections (accent). Knowing this, one can readily discern whether or not a person speaking any language actually acquired that language as one (or more) of his/her "native" languages--i.e., before the aforementioned age. On the other hand, the presence of an improper "accent," is the immediate "tell tale" that a person learned a language, whether to the point of fluency or not, only after the age of 6 (+/-)--i.e., after the age of primary language acquisition.

Much like musical-instrument language (...playing muscle training instead of speaking muscle training) acquisition, the earlier in life...the better.

CA

There, you now have the whole story, in one mouthful.