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Engineering Fields - Systems Engineering - New Member South Africa - Member - New Member

Join Date: May 2007
Location: South Africa
Posts: 52

Buying & Installing 60Hz Transformer in an 50Hz grid

11/20/2007 5:56 AM

Hi all,

I have had a look at "Frequency Problem", posted on 03/04/2007 and "50 Hz and 60 Hz: Pros, Cons and National Standards" posted on 07/15/2007. <--- I did do some homework to check if it has been discussed previously. However, I have a different question.

I am in the process of setting up a scrap processing plant. In my search for cheap or second hand equipment I have found a second hand Induction Furnace based in America. The spec I got is as follows:

Manufacture ABB / 1994

Model ITM-6PA

Melt Rate 12,000 lbs/hr (5.4 mton/hr)

Holding Capacity 6000 lbs/hr (2.7 mtons)

Rated Power 2200kw / 2618v / 240Hz each

Configuration 2 furnaces each w/ independent power supply,

hydraulic systems, and controls.

Incoming Step down Transformer (2) By ABB

2400 KVA / 12,470 HV / 1150 LV

60 Hz each

Furnaces (2) Steel shell type

So here is the challenge. I am based in South Africa, and thus live in a 50Hz grid. I can get a transformer to match the incoming voltage of the Incoming Step down Transformer, but it will be at 50Hz. Can I just do that, or do I have to include a Frequency generator? Or as someone suggested in one of the above posts, revert to DC and reconvert to AC but at 60Hz?

Remember, I am a metallurgist and my extend of electrical knowledge stops just after V = IR. So keep it either very short, or explain in real layman's terms (maybe like you would explain to your 8th grade child).

Regards,

TC

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Power-User

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Hartwell Georgia N34* 56.770 / W83* 35.431
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#1

Re: Buying & Installing 60Hz Transformer in an 50Hz grid

11/20/2007 8:08 AM

I have spent several years overseas and know not everyone has deep pockets.

"adapt, improvise, overcome"... If my butt was in a crack and I had to do something,

I would set up the equipment, contact technical support of each sub-system I had concerns about and ask them what can I expect on 50HZ. When all had been inspected, power it up and see if it runs. Then you'll know for sure. One final comment, not for you, but the flack I'll take. Sometimes you have to get your hands dirty.

Good luck,

James

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Commentator

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Lahore Pakistan
Posts: 60
#2

Re: Buying & Installing 60Hz Transformer in an 50Hz grid

11/20/2007 11:18 AM

why to go for 60 Hertz equipment for installation in 50 Hertz system.

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#3

Re: Buying & Installing 60Hz Transformer in an 50Hz grid

11/20/2007 2:04 PM

Frequency is a linear component in the equation for turns ratio N,

Therefore, if the frequency changes, so must the voltage.

A Transformer designed for low frequencies can be used at a higher freq, if the input value is not changed then the peak magnetic flux would be less.

If frequency is reduced, voltage must also be reduced. Since peak mutual flux can't increase, the allowable voltage decreases with proportion

12470(50/600)=10391

Secondary is the same since volts per turn are same on primary and secondary

1150(50/60)=958

You probally will not get the V you need.

Hope this helps

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Engineering Fields - Systems Engineering - New Member South Africa - Member - New Member

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Location: South Africa
Posts: 52
#4
In reply to #3

Re: Buying & Installing 60Hz Transformer in an 50Hz grid

11/21/2007 1:58 AM

Thanks for your comments.

Hastingselectric: Is a good option to go that route, and it is probably the way we will go. Regarding getting my hands dirty, to me there is no other way to learn. So yes, I will be up to my elbows in this thing I will try not to electrocute myself trying to figure it out

Inayat: Well is easy to answer that one, I have limited funds, this equipment is available at a price I can afford. I asked the question to find out if it would be a deal breaker.

T Man: You are THE man . Thanks, you have told me exactly what i want to hear without cluttering the issue with technicalities. Yes, I realise that running at lower Hertz will have an influence on the power. My calculations took into account that I will not have a "good" and "efficient" system, so my assumptions and cost calculations are based to be 75% effective. Thus 958/1150 = 83% well within my calculations.

Looking at previous threads, I am also preparing for a hotter transformer, so my cooling system have to be able to handle that. I might have to put a dedicated cooling fan on the transformer to assist the airflow and thus increase cooling.

So all in all I think that the system can work. I will keep you posted on the results of the installation.

Regards,

TC

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Anonymous Poster
#5

Re: Buying & Installing 60Hz Transformer in an 50Hz grid

11/21/2007 2:17 PM

Someone should correct me if I am wrong here.

I think the biggest problem with using a 60 Hz transformer on a 50 Hz system will be overheating of the transformer if attempted to run at the transformer rated primary voltage.

The reason being is that the 60 Hz transformer will not have sufficient iron core (for operation at 50 Hz) to generate the required back emf which will result in excessive primary current being drawn at rated voltage. The transformer primary (and secondary) impedance will be much lower at 50 Hz than at 60 Hz.

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Anonymous Poster
#6

Re: Buying & Installing 60Hz Transformer in an 50Hz grid

07/29/2008 4:32 AM

50 hz will saturate the core of a 60hz transformer

so if we reduce the frequency you should also decrease the volt of tr to maintain the v/f ratio

yours truly

chintan.navin.panchal(be 3 student of electrical engineering)

email; chintan.n.panchal@gmail.com

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