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Member

Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 5

Weld Neck RF Flange vs. Weld Neck FF Flange

05/01/2008 11:29 PM

IS THERE ANY DIFFERNCE IN DIMENSIONS (LENGHT THROUGH HUB) OF WELD NECK RF & WELD NECK FF FLANGE.

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Power-User

Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Alberta Canada
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#1

Re: Weld Neck RF Flange vs. Weld Neck FF Flange

05/02/2008 2:50 PM

Yes.

The flat face flange is shorter through the neck by the thickness of the raised face which has been removed to make it into a flat face.

The thickness of the face removed depends upon the pressure class of the flange, as different pressure classes have different face thicknesses.

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Associate
Engineering Fields - Piping Design Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Bayonet Point, Florida
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#2

Re: Weld Neck RF Flange vs. Weld Neck FF Flange

05/02/2008 6:22 PM

The previous commenter is correct but in only some cases. This happens on Valves as well as Weld-Neck (and other) Flanges and it all depends on how the Flat Face surface on the object was created.

If the Flat Face Weld-Neck Flange (or Valve) was created by modifing an existing Raised Face item then he is correct.

However some items (Weld-Neck Flanges and Valves) are created as "Flat Face" in the factory during original manufacturing. When this is done then the Face-to-Face dimension for Raised Face Valves and Flat Face Valves is the same. This is because the creation of the raised face part of the flange face is a second operation (not a primary operation).

If the dimensioning is critical then to be safe you may wantd to check with your flange (or Valve) supplier to confirm the actual dimensions.

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Guru
Engineering Fields - Piping Design Engineering - New Member Egypt - Member - New Member

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#3
In reply to #2

Re: Weld Neck RF Flange vs. Weld Neck FF Flange

05/03/2008 2:13 AM

Yes PennPiper, you are wright.

Where from ASME B16.5, we find that:

1. The flat face is only available for lapped flanges, and not available for welding neck flanges.

2. The thickness tf of flange for any type (threaded, SO, SW, lapped, blind & WN) is the same for the same rating or class.

3. When you need to change any flange from RF to FF, only you have to remove the raised face height, and that will not reduce the effective thickness tf of the flange to resist the pressure and temp.

Note. Also, I'd like to add that for nonstandard flanges or tubesheets like those designed for heat exchangers, the raised face/or recessed thickness (if needed) have to be added to the calculated thickness of flange or tubesheet.

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Power-User

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#4

Re: Weld Neck RF Flange vs. Weld Neck FF Flange

05/05/2008 8:46 AM

In a bind I have turned down a raised face on the lathe to fit a flat face valve or another flat face flange. I think all flanges are forged to be flat and then machined into what ever they will be.(as been stated already)The difference in dimensions are so small that it can easily be made up by a little wider root gap on the next few fits. On allot of burner management pipe skids we make in the shop have the flat face cast iron FM rated valves so we have to be careful to not get the flanges welded to the wrong end of a spool piece. There is nothing worse to find out when it is time to bolt everything together after it has been to the paint shop that we did this. They make a spacer ring for raised face flanges so they will fit up to flat face flanges. If you use a raised face on a flat face cast iron valve you run the risk of cracking it when tightening the bolts. Same thing if you don't use a full face gasket with the flat face flanges.

pipewelder

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Abdel Halim Galala (1), PennPiper (1), pipewelder (1), Zaphod2Headed (1)

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