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Power-User

Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 106

Cogeneration and Chimney Gases

04/13/2009 1:06 AM

Dear all Gurus,

I am working in Glass container plant with few waste gas chimney - the waste gas is exhuast of the Natural gas combustion which comprises with Nox and some other residual of glass making materials. The waste gas temperature about 350 to 400 deg C. with volume of 200Nm3/min at SP 400mmH20.

My question is can i use this waste gas as renewal energy to run steam boiler or other mechanism to drive turbine generator ?

Thank you very much and best regards

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Guru
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#1

Re: Electric power generation of Chimney waste gas

04/13/2009 1:52 AM

Yes, it's called co-generation. The exhaust is used to heat or even boil the water. Naturally, the exhaust gas after this is much cooler than before, so your plant design must take this in account.

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#2

Re: Cogeneration and Chimney Gases

04/13/2009 6:38 PM

I would think that a well-designed Horizontal Thermosyphon Reboiler should give a reliable steam flowrate that should also support stable operation of a turbine.

Of course, you have to first filter the exhaust to remove some of the combustion residue if such might have adverse effect on the tube materials. Smoke - if any - in the exhaust might also cause some fouling problems in the Tube side.Otherwise it should be okay.

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#3

Re: Cogeneration and Chimney Gases

04/13/2009 11:36 PM

you can by using HRSG ie heatrecovery Steam generator which comes with a divertor valve ,contact steam boiler manafacturers in your area.

crm

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Join Date: Feb 2009
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#4

Re: Cogeneration and Chimney Gases

04/14/2009 12:05 AM

This energy can be definitely utilized in number of ways as suggested by Gurus.

You may describe the energy used by the process and the plant in the poocess flow digrams.

You will definitely find best techno-commercial solution of using the part of energy back.

Active Contributor

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#5

Re: Cogeneration and Chimney Gases

04/14/2009 1:31 AM

Any heat recovery project is definitely worth the effort...because it conserves natural resources and adds to profits.

It is possible to recover the heat from the exhaust gases through a waste heat recovery steam generator if you require steam for process applications. The volume you indicate appears too less for a steam generator to be economically viable. alternately it can be an air-air heat exchanger if you need hot air for process applications.

The key input here is to have cleanest possible exhaust entering the HE. The glass material have a tendency to coat the tubes on the heat exchanger and thus reduce the coefficient of heat transfer over a period of time.

Best way forward is to talk to heat exchanger manufacturers or a consultant if you have one.

Satish

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#6

Re: Cogeneration and Chimney Gases

04/14/2009 3:28 AM

In addition to the above, the hot exhaust can be used to warm the incoming cooler air used for combustion, thereby raising the efficiancy of the boiler. It won't have to burn so hard to transfer the same amount of heat to the utility fluid.

Make sure that the final exhaust gas temperature is above the dewpoint of sulphuric acid or corrosion problems at the exit of the flue gas heat exchanger might ensue.

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#7

Re: Cogeneration and Chimney Gases

04/14/2009 6:01 AM

Hi,

Like so many good ideas the real problem comes down to return on investment being achieved and in this context I think your existing scheme may well struggle. The first issue is the relatively low temperature of the exhaust gas stream which requires a larger than normal surface area in the heat exchanger and then limits the steam temperature and pressure to a simple expansion simple cycle; this will limit the electrical conversion efficiency to perhaps 25% overall.

You do not mention what the excess oxygen content is in the flue gas stream because it may be worth considering refiring the flue gas by adding more fuel (gas or oil) to raise the temperature to a point where a superheater can be included in the boiler to enhance the steam cycle efficiency.

However this will increase capital costs and add to the overall plant complexity. I would reckon that you've probably got enough plant maintenance issues to deal with already and starting to play at power stations is not on your agenda.

My recommendation is to keep it all as simple as pos and use the available heat either as a thermal fluid i.e high temperature hot water, on the plant or convert it to another energy form such as chilled water and again use it domestically or sell it to third party users nearby either way you will be getting far more useful energy than from the electrical version. First costs will be much lower than the generation option with lower costs of ownership and ultimately a better return on investment.

Good luck which ever way you chose to go.

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#10
In reply to #7

Re: Cogeneration and Chimney Gases

04/22/2009 8:23 PM

Dear Massey 726,

Thank you very much of you reply and points of view of this cogeneration. The excess oxygen is about 3.5% at the flue tunel.

Please advise how to convert from heat to cold water ? ( As we dont need hot water in our South East Asia area)

Regards

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#11
In reply to #10

Re: Cogeneration and Chimney Gases

04/23/2009 7:06 AM

Hi Aikhh,

You will need to produce either hot water or steam from your exhaust gas stream this energy will then be used to heat an absorption chiller. Crazy as it sounds the heat produces the cooling effect through making changes to the concentration of a strong solution of lithium bromide which is circulated between several vessels on the unit. Unlike the vapour copression cycle machines there is very little electrical energy used 'on board' the unit as only a small solvent transferr pump is employed.

You should understand however that the COP is sub- unity ( unlike the vapour comression m/cs) ; typically 0.70 for a single effect m/c or 0.85 (ish) for a dual effect version The choice of which is really dictated by the available supply temperature. As you will easily have more than 100C I would suggest the dual effect version.

You will have to dissipate the absobed energy (from the chilled water load plus the applied heating effect; some for a 1000kW chiller your air blast coolers will be dumping 2250 kW. This cooling water will be leaving the machine at around 35C and should be returned at 25C therefore the delta T is quite small and the Q will be correspondingly high; therefore largish pumps and pipes! You could always consider aidiabatic assistance to the air blast cooling unit but where this is cost effective will depend upon your prevailing ambient air conditions.

'Thermax' (India) produce an excellent absorber and you should visit their web site.

Best wishes.

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#12
In reply to #10

Re: Cogeneration and Chimney Gases

04/23/2009 1:28 PM

Hi Aikhh,

As a follow on to my last comment and with due reflection to the contributor who mentioned Organic Rankine Cycle as an option it would be possible to combine both the absorption machine and ORC in what would become a CHP installation. Much would depend upon the thermal fluid used in the turbine circuit as the temperature of the condenser cooling circuit could be raised to say 90C by reheating from the thermal flud source and then used to heat a single effect absortion chiller. In this way you would benefit from some electrical energy plus the cooling effect you desire.

However as I said in my first response you will be wanting to achieve best return on capital and the ORC kit is expensive so you will still be more comfortable concentrating on the production of chilled water in the first place. You could always add the CRC at a later date!

You quote your excess oxygen level as 3.5% and at this value there is no chance of refiring the flue gases so you will be limited to an output temperature as dictated by the hot gas stream.

Good luck.

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#13
In reply to #12

Re: Cogeneration and Chimney Gases

04/24/2009 2:38 AM

Hi Massey 726,

Thank you very much of your reply.

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#8

Re: Cogeneration and Chimney Gases

04/14/2009 12:14 PM

Nooter Eriksen HSRG's Give them a google!

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#9

Re: Cogeneration and Chimney Gases

04/22/2009 3:30 PM

the best thing would be an ORC system. Ormat makes smaller system, you are looking at 300 kw.

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