Fire Hazard Potential

Diesel really isn't that flammable (comparatively). Try this: ^{(usual safety disclaimer inserted here)} get a small amount of diesel fuel in a cup/glass/lid etc. Pull out your matchbook, light a match and toss it in the cup of diesel. I'd wager $50 the match goes out as soon as it hits the diesel. We used a diesel mix to burn down the forest, back when I worked for the forest service. We had to mix gasoline (the mixture depended on the person mixing it up, as some like it hot, and some do not(I prefer a 50/50 mix myself)) with the diesel in about a 1 part gas to 3 parts diesel mix just to be able to light it on the end of our torches. Sometimes if the mix wasn't hot enough we couldn't get the mix to light at all. Diesel is only really a worry for me when it is vaporised, then it will light up.

We also used to have open flame literally boil the 5 gallon cans of diesel we used to carry on the trucks (not on purpose) and never had any explosions(although this only happened twice while i was there)

I guess I'm getting long winded with nonsense which I'm sure no one wants to hear, so back to your question... I have no answer pertaining to any laws or regulations, but I do know, that I would not be worried if it were on my front porch, and my friends were using it as an ashtray.

I have seen an angry mechanic throw a lit cigarette into a pan of gasoline while smoking a cigarette and glower at the snot who told him to stop smoking.

Of course the guy was a killer and a smuggler, and you were a flat out dumb ass to f*** with him since he really didn't care one way or another about anything.

Why do you have a disguised truck?

These things are dangerous, especially if you let the water drain freeze up while open, and it melts out and dumps all the fuel.

I've seen that happen too.

Saw a fat pompous guy smoking a cigar walk across a very large puddle of JP4 completely oblivious to the fact that he was walking in a puddle of kerosene, and not water.

In the summer when it gets hot and vapors will be created, any open flame or spark will set this stuff off if it is in a vapor state, and it will blow you to kingdom come.

Bottom line is that kerosene and gasoline will burn explosively if they are in a vapor state. They are hazardous materials. It is illegal in my area of the woods to not placard such trucks with a warning sign. P.S. Every now and then I will use blunt language. I really am sorry, but I do not know why you need to ask if this material is dangerous. Plus I can't figure out why you would think anyone would tell you it wasn't. Further there are reasons that placards are required identifying that a truck is carrying hazardous materials. Do the wrong set of things and 3000 liters of gasoline ignited will blow about half a city block to smithereens.

"Why do you have a disguised truck?"

Last night after I posted I got hold of their Environmental Management Plan which states that their workshop depot should be some distance away from the residential area.

I grew up on a farm with a bulk diesel tank just about next to the house. I actually agree with RVZ717 that it is rather safe.

Maybe I would have done the same. A mobile garage and emergency repair shop actually make sense.

Hi bj,

Very good point.

GA to you Sir.

They were parked under a HT transmission line which passes across the street. (I will post another question later about something similar)

But they will have to relocate within hours.

I give greater attention to living immediate to "HT" lines than the truck

I apologize for using curse words.

As far as I know your going to get in more trouble for disguising it than if you just parked it there with a set big labels on it that said 'DIESEL FUEL' on its sides and back.

Right now if some drunk plows into it in the middle of the night and causes fuel spill your liable more than he is by far. Get the permits and proper placards in place and he can burn down the neighbor hood with your truck and you get a new house at his expense!

Getting a DOT certification for a fuel truck is easy and not that expensive and it will keep the safety Nazi's off your back. Around here countless farmers have their own fuel tankers and trucks. Its no big deal if you just follow the rules!

Just to put the record straight. I am not the culprit but a victim.

I am fighting the contractors building a road and now have a meeting scheduled with them to have them change their bad habits.

They were dumping road material after midnight up to about 4 on a few occasions and deprived me of my beauty sleep. Plus a few other crimes.

And you'll complain when the project takes long if they only work in the day time too

Keep the cap on the tank.

Same fire potential as that car in your garage

Parked vehicles rarely catch themselves on fire.

In the US a truck carrying 3000 l of diesel would have to have place markers on it showing the type of fuel its carrying. DOT(Dept. of Transportation) regulation. So fire fighter and other are aware of the hazard if the cargo the vehicles carrying.

If its disguised they maybe in violation of similar laws you have there.

It's actually 378.5 liters or 100 gals and you are required to have placards saying "flammable #3" or "1993 #3" plus diesel fuel and how many gallons. You should also have no smoking signs, and a fire extinguish with sign. This are in accordance to OSHA, DOT, and EPA requirements. Don't forget you will also have to check with your local and state agencies.

I dont see any hazard with it as far as flammability is concerned. As mentioned, and as I'm sure you know, diesel has a higher flash point and lower vapor pressure than gasoline and is much harder to ignite with just open flame. Also, as was mentioned, here in the US ther require safety placards with UN ID numbers on them indicating flammability, corrosivness, what type of material etc. That seems to be the greater hazard here than anythign else, an unmarked truck is extremely dangerous. Id be more worried about some idiot snapping one of the valves and causing a fuel spill before I worried about fire hazard. Good luck with your battle!

Call the Fire Department.

They know why people get killed from this sort of thing.

They know why their friends have died.

The Fire Department in any locality suppose to have the handouts of Safety Rules and Regulation pertaining to Fire Hazard Materials.

Chemical properties of Diese fuel is not higly flammable in nature. Unlike the gasoline if evaporized in the air even if small quantities is enough to ignite even a lighted-cigarette butt and the like.

When I worked in ARAMCO(Saudi Arabia), Jubail Industrial City (Petromin Shell Oil Refinery). In compliance with the protocol of Ministry of Transportation(Comformity with the Global standard) that any transported materials either health hazard chemical such as Asbestos Containing Material,ACM,(OSHA Rules), etc) or Fuel Materiasl has to be identified and marked/labeled clearly/visible to any delivery truck/s. Every single delivery truck departed from our oil refinery compound especially those loaded with benzene/gasoline is labeled in two sides and back as " FLAMMABLE NO SMOKING WITHIN 50ft (radius).

The truck that parked near in your house and not marked as "flammable"...then its not extrememy life threatening... but I suggest any speculative suspicion beyond your comprehension about that truck, call the local authorities to assist you.

Hello Hendrik,

When you say the 3000 L tank is "disguised" as a normal truck, do you mean it has no hazard labels on it?

This is against the law in just about any Country, but especially in the 'west'.

Of course apart from the issue of fire safety which with diesel is low, that is if it is diesel only in the Tank. But there is the smell and any damage it may do if it leaks or if the diesel is used carelessly and spilled. Diesel in asphalt will leave it slightly melted.

Take care and you can loose nothing by phoning the local police or fire brigade?

Good luck.

Hi Hendrik,

Why put yourself in the front? to fight directly against construction guys or people is more hazardous than 3000l Diesel parked across your house. If I were you I will just file complain to the following; Police station, fire department, local official and even to their general contractor, let them do their job as you are taxpayer. There were some contractor workers very crazy especially you are identified as complainant.

If you can't find any reason relevant SA or any law pertaining the matter, Probably risk on your family health or (tell them one of your family member is having asma and alergy with diesel) as being closely exposed to Diesel could be used as reason why you want it to be parked in the appropriate distance from your house.

Kind regards

Roman

Hi everyone

I am in Africa where normal rule of law does not count for much.

The Authorities seems to create "law" fit for that moment.

The 1987 Act was repealed and replaced in 1998.

That part of the 1998 Act was repealed and replaced in 2003.

Nobody got around to replace the 1981 regulations yet. And they don't seem to be consistent with the current Act.

I went to the fire department and rung the bell for service. After a while I placed my finger on the security fingerprint scanner and the door opened. I walked in but could not find a soul.

On the way out I saw the notice that trespassers will be prostituted, pressed the button and left after pulling faces at the security camera and waved goodbye in sign language.

I could have stolen 5 years worth of fire.

I think I am going to burn a bit of rubbish to draw their attention.

Well, seems like you set your own trap, they've got your fingerprint and your face recorded; in fact you are now in risk of becoming a prostitute. You spoiled it out, please abort your complainting strategy.

As per the construction guys, you look sucidal trying to mess with them in an under legislated country, specially when they don't represent a real risk by parking their diesel tank by your house.

And about the noise, have you tried ear plugs? they're cheap, even the contractors could give you half a dozen for free.

Go have a beer with them, talk about sports or hot ladies, and voila!.

You'll see that just by showing your face like a man and having some fun with them will get you out of trouble; and maybe gain some tough, almost friends that will be on your side if you ever are in real trouble.

Yahlasit

The vapor space in an oil tank can easily exceed the the LEL. You have a potentially dangerous situation here.

Edmund

Dear Hendrik, I believe in this case I have been right, and wrong. I am chagrined that I originally partly misread your post.

On the correct, it is proper for obvious reasons that Fuel Trucks be placarded for safety reasons. Typically Firemen do want and need to know what they are dealing with.

Obviously I do not know enough about South Africa. The Construction Crew may well have a motive in your part of the world to not make it clear that there is a large quantity of fuel available however. It could be that they weigh out the risks of not marking the truck and determine that it is better that way, so as to not attract theft of the fuel.

Why the crew would leave their truck with tools and fuel on the street at the end of the working day, is a legitimate question if their motive for not marking the truck is a concern about theft, but maybe that's just the way they do things around there.

Sometimes most of use will get wound up over an issue to the point where it gets the better of us. Sometimes there is simply only so much one can do.

Possibly about all you can do is have the police and fire departments phone numbers handy, so you can quickly call if you see thieves or vandals around the truck. Possibly about all you can do is regard the threat as temporary and look forward to the end of it.

I do feel that again I must apologize again for using bad language in my post, plus not reading the Original Post more closely, plus not factoring in your location.

P.S. Typically there is a sump drain on fuel trucks so that condensed water can be drained out. If I was wanting to steal fuel from a fuel truck, this is the first place I would go to do so, in general. I'd be curious if that is the case with this particular truck, and whether or not this sump drain had a lock on it.

Hi Transcendian

I am protecting the interest of the community as best I can using the protection afforded by law (by using only lawful methods).

The contractor is actually the 3rd on the job and I actually pity them because they inherited a huge penalty clause.

Maybe I should allow them not to comply with law. But since they woke me at 4:00 in the morning with a noise nuisance that exceeds the ambient noise level by more than 40dB I cannot see why.

I am actually at war against bad governance. (and I aim to win)

Wow your guys are tough ours is 60dB which is about the same of a normal conversation and I thought that was tough. 40db about the same as a whisper, how can they work under that.

I don't complain at 60dBA.

The ambient as measured in my house at night is about 45dBA. 40 above that would be 85dB.

85dB in your house yeah that diffenently would get me wound up? What are they doing outside jack hammering? Normal truck and equipment operations is usually around 100dB at a distance of 100 ft. or 30 m. Your walls and insulation in your home should be offering you some protection. I've had road crews outside my place before only reason I knew they where there was because of the flashing lights. Are they doing structly night work because of traffic restrictions during the day or trying to beat the heat? Our noise regulations are set up by the local government does yours have anything set up?

I am one stand away from the road under construction (max 50m)

The sounds that woke me up was the back flap of ther tipper slamming when they lowed it.

One night they had a burst tire. (Imagine that for size)

The banging of the tail-gate is definitely unwarranted. The road inspectors if any are there should be handling that one, it's a big no-no here in the States. Most of our night work around PA is on major highways so there isn't a whole lot of traffic and homes aren't that close.

Why don't you mind your own business instead of meddling in that of others who are legitimately trying to make a living. The 'diguised' truck is a common vehicle used in the construction industry to service and maintain the equipment used on construction sites, and it is no more dangerous than the lawn mower or the gas can to fuel it likely found in your and all of your neighbor's garages. In fact, those conditions are actually more dangerous than the one you are fumed about.

If I remember correctly, you have previously posted regarding quarry activities in your area. Perhaps you should join some activist group and find other miscreants in your region. I'll bet there are many of them, at least in your eyes.

Comment deleted

Come on guys, and I thought I was out of line!

Take your High Blood Pressure Meds and calm down.

Just because there may be a terrible disaster any minute it is no reason to be upset!

If any real incident were to occur the op likely wouldn't become aware anyway...

Guest

On CR4 we don't do personal attacks. Shame on you.

"Why don't you mind your own business instead of meddling in that of others who are legitimately trying to make a living"

As long as they comply with law I won't argue with them.

Regarding the quarry . Would you accept 15kg rocks coming down at 400 km/h on a parking space and buildings of a crowded mall? (They admitted their mistake and we are still friends)

I noticed a typo - The sidewalk on the other side of the road is 27m and not 7.

Hi all,

As the 'sound level' was mentioned in post number 27 (I think) I have put a few details about the way sound is measured in Pa (Pascal's) and dB (Decibel's).

=

The 'dB' (decibel) is used to quantify or measure the magnitude of sound (pressure) levels relative to a '0 dB' reference point. The other frequently used unit is Pa (Pascal), but in this instance I refer to the decibel....... BTW A 'decibel' is one tenth of a 'Bel' a unit named after the Bell Telephone Company.

Any 'sound' is simply a 'localised pressure wave', and the decibel is the unit of force of this wave in the air or water which we perceive as a sound. The reason for the use of the decibel is, the ear can detect many sound levels, and the reference point is usually the threshold of perception of the average human and, common comparisons can be seen further down the post. ....................

[0 dB ~ 20 µPa] = 2x10⎺⁵ (Micro-Pascal's) this threshold is roughly the sound of a mosquito flying 3 metres away.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Sound pressure in air]:]

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Source of sound]

[Sound pressure]

[Sound pressure]

level]

[SI Unit]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Sound in air

[pascal]

[dB re 20 μPa]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Shockwave (distorted sound waves > 1 atm; waveform valleys are clipped at zero pressure)(peak-to-peak)>]

[101,325 Pa]

[>194 dB]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Krakatoa explosion at 100 miles (160 km) in air[dubious!]

[20,000 Pa] (RMS)(Root Mean Square)]

[180 dB]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[.30-06 rifle being fired 1 m to shooter's side]

[7,265 Pa]

[(peak)]

[171 dB]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[M1 Garand being fired at 1 m]

[5,023 Pa]

[168 dB]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Jet engine at 30 m]

[632 Pa]

[150 dB]

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[Threshold of pain]

[63.2 Pa]

[130 dB]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Hearing damage (possible)]

[20 Pa]

[(approx.)]

[120 dB]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Jet at 100 m]

[6.32 – 200 Pa]

[110 – 140 dB]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Jack hammer at 1 m]

[2 Pa]

[(approx.)]

[100 dB]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Major road at 10 m]

[2×10⎺1–6.32×10⎺1 Pa]

[80 – 90 dB]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Hearing damage (due to long-term exposure)]

[0.356 Pa]

[78 dB]

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[car at 10 m]

[2×10⎺2–2×10⎺1 Pa]

[60 – 80 dB]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[TV set at room level )at 1 m]

[2×10⎺2 Pa]

approx. [60 dB]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Normal talking at 1 m]

[2×10⎺3–2×10⎺2 Pa]

[40 – 60 dB]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Very calm room.]

[2×10⎺4–6.32×10⎺4 Pa]

[20 – 30 dB]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Leaves rustling, calm breathing]

[6.32×10⎺5 Pa

[10 dB]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Auditory threshold at 1 kHz]

[2×10⎺5 Pa (RMS)]

[0 dB]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I hope this is understandable.

Good luck.