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hangwaiter
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: South Africa
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combining solar water heater with heat pump

09/06/2009 5:04 PM

Hi Folks

As I'm not familiar with mathematic equations specific to energy conversions, I would be happy to see some realistic comments on the following.

Say I can cover the roof of my house with 100 sqm of solar panels to have enaugh energy to heat my house and provide hot water.

On the other hand, I could alternatively use a heat pump which extracts the energy from ambient air of Minus 15 ( or even less) degrees C temperature, ( google up " Golden Energy" ) and just use comparatively little electricity to achieve the same heating.

What if I would combine the two systms?

Heat the intake air of the Heat pump system by means of a small ( maybe 10sqm) solar panael and a heat exchanger ( radiator), thereby increasing the temperature of this intake air by x - degrees, which would in turn require a lesser amount of electric power by the heat pump system, to achieve the same prime cycle temperature.

Does this sound like an eficient idea? Without proper calculations it remains guesswork, if this is a viable option. Is such a small solar panel enaugh to heat up the intake air of the heat pump to such an extent that it really makes a difference, or would I need just the same huge roof area covered with solar water heating panels, to make any notable difference.

Alternatively, or in addition to such a system, I could possibly run the compressor and fan motors of the heat pump with power from PV panels andl/or buffer batteries.

But how to calculate those options before unnecessary money is spent on trial and error tests?

Looking forward to your comments

Hangwaiter
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lynlynch
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#1

Re: combining solar water heater with heat pump

09/06/2009 5:18 PM
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  1. CR4 - Thread: combining solar water heater with heat pump1 post - Last post: 4 minutes agocombining solar water heater with heat pump. 09/06/2009 5:04 PM. Hi Folks. As I'm not familiar with mathematic equations specific to energy conversions, ...
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JohnDG
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#2
In reply to #1

Re: combining solar water heater with heat pump

09/06/2009 5:51 PM

Dang, recursion!

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YWROADRUNNER
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#3
In reply to #2

Re: combining solar water heater with heat pump

09/06/2009 7:33 PM

Hello John:

Don't do that....... do that...... do that.. It's Labor Day weekend over here and I was happily working on a hangover for tomorrow when I had the misfortune of clicking your link, again and again.

Enclosed is an approximation of the inside of my head after encountering recursion.

PS: it was supposed to be an animated twisted circle, but apparently it will not work in this window.

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JohnDG
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#5
In reply to #3

Re: combining solar water heater with heat pump

09/07/2009 1:43 AM

Hi, YWROADRUNNER, sorry if I mucked up your potential hangover.

So you've found the immobile animation problem - I've commented on this elsewhere.

Regards,

John.

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ffej
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#6
In reply to #1

Re: combining solar water heater with heat pump

09/08/2009 12:26 AM

That amount of work has to be worth a GA.

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Mark Stockman
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#4

Re: combining solar water heater with heat pump

09/07/2009 12:13 AM

Mother Earth News had plans for passive solar air heaters many years ago. The heater is an insulated box with double-pane glass on it, set below a window at the proper angle for collection. In the box is a piece of corrugated metal roofing, painted black. The air enters under the roofing, travels down, and then is drawn up the sunny side by convection. That type of unit would work for your application- you'd just need to scale it up. Build a test unit, and figure the temperature rise with different air flows and temperatures. Then figure out how much air your heat pump will be moving, and figure out how big you want to build the collector. To get the same temperature rise with double the air flow, you need to double the surface area of the collector. You could also use solar to boost the temperature of the source water for a geothermal heat pump. You'd probably need to use antifreeze as a heat exchange fluid, and would need some sort of temperature sensitive valve so the solar collector wouldn't work against you at night.

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bwire
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#9
In reply to #4

Re: combining solar water heater with heat pump

09/17/2009 1:52 PM
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Guest
#7

Re: combining solar water heater with heat pump

09/11/2009 1:26 AM

Yes Dear,

Your idea is great.

Just to share with you what ever little knowledge I hav eacquired during my Ph.D. in Solar Air Heating systems (SOLAR DRYERS), the thumb rule is that roughly you add heat equivalent to 1000 watt electrical heater by using a flat plat solar collector of area 1 sq meter, if you put solar collector on roof top you need to have a fan/exhaust fan. Solar air heaters /collectors give good efficiency if you operate them in suction mode compared to forced circulation mode. ( I am not sure if you know the differenc between the two mode: Suction mode means the fan will suck the hot air from collector and supply to the space you want to heat. In case of forced circulation the fan will force the cool air in and hot air will come out from the out let of collector that can be lead to the space being heated)

Regards-

Dr N P Singh

I am available at npsdhillon@gmail.com
vicini
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#8

Re: combining solar water heater with heat pump

09/15/2009 8:01 PM

there is no way to extract energy from -12 C air eficently. Once you go below 0 C, your coils will freeze off with water on the outside and the power use will increase exponetially. At about 5C, straight resistive heat is more economical.

Heating air with solar is difficult because of the low heat capacity. You could heat the water and store it and then chill it with the heat pump during the night, but it's the same energy and as the laws of thermo go, every time you exchnage or change energy forms, you lose.

Just use the water from the collectors to heat the system.
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