2004 Honda Civic - Gages Don't Work, But Carpet is Clean

How did you check your fuses? The only way to positively check fuses is to confirm continuity through each with a multimeter.

In my experience when I have inconsistant electrical failure in a vehicle it is usually either fuses / breakers, loose wire or bad pigtail connection. Double check your fuses, find out which one corresponds to your problem and switch it for one you know is good. If that doesn't help, it could be the wires in the fuse panel (but that is very rare).

Exorcising electrical demons from a vehicle can be tough. Good Luck!

Drew

I removed every fuse from the panel and checked them with a multimeter. I switched suspect fuses with other fuses of the same rating.

I have not troubleshooted any wiring. I also don't know if any wiring is under the carpeting.

There usually is some wire under carpet, either along the center, or more commonly along the door sill. It should be sealed well enough to handle even a good dunking.

Has there been any aftermarket stereo equipment added? Many people don't seal up the wires going t their amps.

Is the car completely dry yet? If not, leave doors open in a warm garage (with ventilation or in the sun with doors open.

Also, check for continuity between fuses and a known ground to see if any are shorting out.

Drew

The carpet felt dry a couple hours after cleaning it. I thought a bead of water may have been shorting 2 wires together, so I have been running the fan on maximum to further dry our everything. It has now been almost a week with no change. Everything is original in the car (no new wiring). I'll probably try to unbolt the carpet next to check for wiring connections.

I would pay to have someone run a computer check. The car is five years old, anything can happen. Under the seats are plugs for the seat wiring, check that. On a lot of cars the brake lites will work even with the key out, I would definitely check out that circuit, or did you mean the brake warning lite..

You know, this is sounding like a bad ground. The cleaning could have compromised a ground wire for the dash circuits. Find all ground wires and refresh the contact. Get a good manual schematic to show where they are. Think like a factory robot, the dash was put in as a unit, and the ground wire was connected to the inside of the car. Look behind the glove box, sometimes you can release the catch to let the door drop further.

How much time do you want to spend on this? (aksing us for help that is). The first thing you need to go with your multi-meter is a wiring schematic.

After that, assume that a feedback loop of some type has been created since dash and tail lights are normally on the same fuse. Instruments are on different fuses.

The fact that the brake lights are on all the time makes me suspicious of that particular switch since it tends to be down low and in an area where it could easily get wet. It will not be the only problem and I do think either a wiring connector is damp or a ground is corroded as well.

The best advice I can come up with is to start tracking errors down by disconnecting the brake light switch and seeing what happens. After that, you will have to check connectors for damp and or corrosion. Then you need to make sure the grounds are good.

Once all that is done, hopefully the problem is gone. If not, more of the same; check and check again.

There is a good chance that this will take quite a few hours to sort out.

Good Luck

I tend to generally agree with the posters that a ground is defective somewhere, it would explain a lot of your problems....

But you should also consider (when strange problems appear in ANY car, but probably not in this particular case) the possibility that there is an extra fuse somewhere, that only the manufacturer knows about....

Unfortunately, I didn't get to try your suggestions yesterday. I left home at 6:00AM for work and returned at 11:00PM. I will check some things at lunchtime today. The BRAKE light that is on is the one in my IP (the light that comes on if you're low on brake fluid, etc.).

Assuming you're talking digital gauges, is it possible that while vacuuming the carpet (before washing/shampoo-ing) you raised the tool off the carpet and upward toward (or in conductive contact with) the dashboard...where static charge accumulated (from rubbing the carpet) on the vacuum (hose end) tool discharged into and ruined a critical instrument panel component?

Perhaps inputting a low voltage directly into a gauge will tell you whether the gauges themselves have been compromised...or something upstream (in which case the entire panel might need repair or replace).

My gages are analog, so I don't think it's static.

I received this information from another source:

if all of the warning lights work but the gauges do not then the problem is either with the gauge cluster or the ground. The gauges are controlled by a CPU built into the instrument cluster. that CPU processes the signals from the separate sensors or from the PCM and powers the driver for the gauges. The driver has a separate ground that is located under the front passenger seat.

if the CPU doesn't output a signal the gauges won't work. If the driver gets a signal from the CPU but doesnt "push" the signal out to the individual gauges the gauges won't work. if the ground is loose or corroded the gauges won't work (high resistance).

something is going open circuit after you start the car to stop the gauges from working. open cirucits usually result from temperature as the current flows through the device it produces heat and breaks in the circuit or circuit board open up to stop the flow of current through the circuit. if the ground is good then the problem is in the gauge cluster. There are no repairs for the CPU or the driver; they entire gauge cluster has to be replaced.

if the warning lights work and if the car will come out of gear once started then all of the fuses are good.

I am definitely checking the ground under the passenger seat next.

G551 for the Hatchback under the passenger seat grounds fuel gauge sending unit, fuel pump, driver's seat belt switch, passenger's seat belt switch, and OPDS unit. Clean it all you want but unless those are malfunctioning I'd concentrate effort elsewhere.

The CPU is static sensitive whether the dash is digital or not. That said the enclosures are usually made static resistant since static in cars is common.

There is another odd device in this diagram that may help. The dash CPU translates the following exclusively: fuel gauge sending unit, washer fluid level, and oil pressure switch. The dash CPU receives information from some sensors through a Multiplex Control Unit in the under hood fuse/relay center under left side of dash: EPS control unit, VSS, Immobilizer control unit, and parking brake switch + brake fluid level switch. All other sensors come through ECM data lines.

Just throwing it out there, but does this car have a body control module (BCM). The body control module is usually located within the dash panel or surrounding areas. As this part is located inside of the vehicle and not designed for wet climates it could have easily shorted out if it got wet. If the car does not have a BCM then its most likely a loose ground connection. If all else fails bench test the instrument panel.

I was unable to repair the problem and ultimately took it to a service shop. They verified that the instrument panel CPU was dead. I am now waiting on the refurbished unit to come in and get programmed. The service personnel said there have been several Civic IP CPUs replaced in my area recently.

Thanks for updating us with the conclusion, always helps in case we run across a similar problem.

Drew