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### Concentrated Solar Power Plants

12/15/2009 7:14 PM

From economical view is it feasible to build 5 concentrating solar power plant with capacity 10 MWe for each , or building one big plant with maximum capacity of 50 MWe . Consider I use central receiver solar tower.

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#1

### Re: csp

12/16/2009 12:14 AM

What is the insolation value? I'm taking a wild stab here, but maybe 5W/ft2? If so, it will take 2,000,000 ft2 for a 10 MW collector, and 10,000,000 ft2 for a 50 MW collector. Assuming the heliostats are mounted in a square, in the first case it would be a 1414 ft square; in the second a 2236 ft square. How far away can you get from the tower and still have accurate enough aim--economically, that is? This is more questions than answers, but maybe something to think about. Who gets the job(s) of washing dust or squeegeeing raindrops or shoveling snow off the mirrors? And then let a hailstorm hit!

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#4

### Re: csp

12/17/2009 5:16 PM

In São Paulo State (Brazil) at near 23°S we have 600 W/m² (55.2 w/ft²) insolation average day. For solar projects we can assume 20% thermal efficiency. This means 120 W/m² (11W/ft²). In North and Northeast of Brazil we have over 14 W/ft² for all day long all year. As aditional information the average temperature at night is only about 8°F bellow. I can not understand why people likes to talk about expensive solar projects like central tower, hundreds heliostats array (parabolics solar collectors) and thermo mechanical equipments. Sure, it is ease to project 10 MW "solar chimney" power plants, more cheapest and ease to build and to operate also. A educational site for 200 MW solar plant shows what I mean (Indeed, i dont know if some one is building it? I hope so!): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0tWlP0knKQU but If spanish engeneer can do a solar chimney in Manzanares region (Castilla de La Mancha State – 39°N) where it is snowing today, the Australian engeneers can do it very much easily in a dry and high temperature regions.

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Fernando
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#5

### Re: csp

12/18/2009 3:25 AM

I might be old fashioned but I don't really believe that those solar chimney's are worth the money.

We block wind turbines due the influence on nature and the look of them, but would build these massive structures, which really are taking enormous space that can't be reclamed by nature after the construction job?

And what is their influence on the higher air layers when we inject a column of hot air up?

The concentrated solar systems have the benefit that they can generate very hot steam (upt to 600°C) which improves the total efficiency.

In fact all the improvements made over the last decades on traditional and nuclear power conversion (mostly turbine related) can be used in the "new" concentrated solar plants.

+ they can be fired with tradiditonal fuels when the sun is gone for to long or other reasons. (the heat is stored for night and an occasional cloudy day but as in each system this has limits)

Just google a bit on concentrated solar and read those reports from the DOE, DLR and EC on alternative energy shedules, they come up with real figures and realistic systems.

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#7

### Re: csp

12/18/2009 10:04 AM

I agree with you! A solar chimney could not be more efficient than parabolics solar collectors array feeding "Rankine Thermodynamic Cycles" at 600°C (1,112 F) as a "Hot Source", like as usual thermoelectric fired by coal, diesel or other kind of fuel. Thermoelectric power plants also requires "Cold Source" that leaves for environment a large mass of hot stream for "condenser" cooled! The solar chimney leaves for environment only a mass of air at same temperature of air layer. For 10 MW the high of chimney would be about 200m (656ft) and no more than 20m diameter (65.6ft). It´s very close any common industrial chimney. It´s difficult for me to understand how a solar thermoelectric could works with practicable area (m², or ft²) from 54 W/m² (5 W/ft²) insolation only. By the other side in several words places there isn´t quick access by soil, or river and also able people to maintain critical mechanical systems, its spare parts, devices, and usual measuring field tests. Otherwise, it´s urgent to find news kind of technology for electric clean energy generation. The Planet can´t not goes on with "Greenhouse Effect" and worse, a layer of "black carbon" in atmosphere (Ref. NASA up to date photo). Nuclear conversion improvements equipments could be a wise way to generate clean energy at least. We (my Firm) are working in "R&D" for a new kind of equipment for electric clean energy generation. We hope, after next 04 months have "nice" results for costs and efficiency. We hope so!

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#2

### Re: Concentrated Solar Power Plants

12/17/2009 12:09 AM

I have come across reference to the "world's most powerful solar power plant", with 60 hetares of sun-tracking mirrors focusing the solar energy on a tower, expected to generate 2.3 MW on average, which works out to about 3.8 W/m2. 3.8 W/m2 works out to about 0.35 W/ft2...

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#3

### Re: Concentrated Solar Power Plants

12/17/2009 3:21 AM

Do you have a location where you can implement a 50 MW installation?

How high will the tower be?

From exploitation I would go for 5 plants, if one goes down for a reason the others are still delivering.

You can also test the design with the first, adapt in the second, and improve while the series build up.

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#6

### Re: Concentrated Solar Power Plants

12/18/2009 8:51 AM

My project is feasibility of building concentrating solar plant on sudan (in north of Africa ) the temperature in my country reach 43⁰c at summer and range of (28_36) on winter . I agree that solar chimney's are not worth the money ,the problem in the solar tower is that high capacity is not commercial building ,in case of sudan it seems to me it's best to building this plant with large capacity because of our condition is properly the best

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