John Deere L-130 Automatic Rider Mower

Hello, Just a though here. The oil could come from several sources. Although you have not said how old the mower is other than you bought it new. Also you have not told us if mower does this every time you start or if only first time on cold engine after sitting over a period of time say from the last time you mowed.

First it could be the oil that has gotten by the rings into the cylinder after use. It would only be a few drops. Sec, oil past valve guides into valve area. Same thing as before after use. Although can cause smoking during use.

Third, The crank case vents into the carb filter area or intake track past carb to pull vapors or blowby gases to be consumed in the running of the engine. So a little oil vapor residue builds up then after sitting unused on startup the oil is pulled into the engine on startup and you see the puff of blue smoke.

Last thing is the air filter oil impregnated like the type you wash and reused after oiling. If a reusable filter is over oiled the excess will be sucked in and can cause blue smoke but with time the excess oil will stop being released.

My take is if JohnDeere is OK with it and you see no oil lose and it only last a few seconds at start and it is only small puff then. I would not worry about it. When oil consumption starts being seen or smoking alot then I would look further into it's cause.

Charles

Thanks for your answer.

It happens everytime the mower starts cold, it is consistantly each time the mower starts cold. As stated it only last for 3 to 5 seconds after startup, never any other time while running.

The mower is 3 years old and I am not really worried about it, I'm just a person that would like to know what makes it happen.

I have talked to several different repair shops and they said the same thing,

' it will not hurt it, they all do it', but I would like to know if someone has figured this out before.

Thanks,

jhunter

Thanks for the reply, Most likely cause "IMO" is a small amount of oil is pooling past the rings into the cylinder. When the motor is running the rings scrap some of the oil from the cylinder wall and the rings keep compression gasses in the cylinder. After running and parked for time the small amount of oil on the back of piston and in the oil scraper ring collects on the low side of the cylinder wall and can get past the rings into the compression side of the cylinder. Then on start you would get a puff of blue smoke.

Also the other main way is oil in the intake pooling of case vapors.

you could park the mower with the spark plug side of the engine raised instead of normal angle. EX; if spark plug is in front raise front a few inches like setting on some blocks. Then let sit for the normal amount of time till next usage. If oil in cylinder the cause it should be reduced considerably on startup. If the oil is in the intake it would most likely be the same on startup.

Just some off the wall ideas for ya.

Charles

jhunter1972,

Turn the radio up, man.

"John Deere said this is normal and will not hurt anything."

I think it's normal, too. Take care of it and it will take care of you.

Cheers.

Thanks Lyn, it is such a great rider that the kids can handle too. Other than the smoke it has been great, I'm just curious about it.

Hey by the way, Green Bay is having wonderful weather up here, I thought I would be headed back to winter but have been fooled.

See Ya!

Jhunter

Did anyone mention what the blue smoke smelled like?

Kuduk

Hard to explain, kinda like a vehicle that you get behind on the highway that has blue smoke blowing out but not as rank. I guess you could say a little on the side of a small engine that is a little flooded, such as a push mower or a older style 3 wheeler.

jhunter

JH

I was thinking if it smelled like gasoline it could be a mix of raw gas being ejected through the exhaust when it fired up. Priming does that on my lawnmower.

Kuduk

Excess gas makes black smoke!

Chew some anti acid tablets, that helps me a lot!!!

I have never looked to see if I make black smoke, the next time it happens I will take a look, like this for example?:-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqCfVVkT2KI

Check to see whether the engine has horizontal cylinder(s) these are a very common cause of start-up smoke on an otherwise sound engine. it has been a problem for many manufacturers of flat engines.

If it only does it from cold its the automatic choke that enrichens the mixture when starting from cold, thats why shops say they all doit

Is the motor a Kawasaki motor?

I remember reading that it is common for oil to get into cylinder when sitting.

This as I remember has been going on for a long time and will not hurt anything.

Just remember to check oil level often.

You did the right thing first when you asked the dealer. It may be nothing just like they said. But if it had shot craps when just out of warranty you had a history established. Many times you can use that history to get repairs done as if still under warranty, but it must be documented. I have learned that when someone says "They all do it" then most times there is a problem they do not want to fix ($$$) or don't know how. I have a 2000 Chevy Silverado 4WD truck. I bought it used with 19,500 miles on it from a Chevy dealer. It pulled to the right. I asked for an alignment. They did it and it still pulled to the right but not as bad. I was told they all do it. A year later I put new tires on and it drove straight. I now have over 150,000 miles on it and still driving straight.

I am assuming this is an overhead valve motor as most are today? I think the most likely cause is that a bit is oil is sitting in the head and seeping past the lowest valve stem, usually the exhaust. When you fire it up it burns this residual oil out then it's good to go. My 27 HP Kohler does that on occasion. You might want to google the problem. I recall reading about the very oil burning problem you have.

I thank that the piston rings in the motor just have not setted yet. If your mower does now run more then 30 min to an hour at a time it may not be running long enough to get the piston rings to seal. Therefore a little oil seeps into the cylinder and burns off till the rings heat up and expands to make the seal.

This could also Just be from unburnt fuel when you start the unit and it has to burn thru the fuel. This would also cause a smoke cloude for a few seconds.

jhunter-yes the L130 with a Kohler eng. does blue smoke for a couple of seconds upon starting only. They do not know why. I do not know for sure but it seems to only happen on the engines that have an actual oil pump and not just splash oiling. Mine is 2 yrs old and right after the warranty ran out , the clutch blew out, then the blade on/off switch burned up and shortly after the bearings on the 3 vertical housings shelled out. On each one as I was purchasing new parts their sales guy said the replacement parts would last longer because the clutch had been redesigned, both mech. and elect., the bearing housings now had grease zerts vs; sealed bearings and I went to radio shack and purchased a SPST toggle switch and so far everything is still working fine. Summary, I am very disappointed with JD for what it costs. That was the reason I had changed was I believed them to be the Best. Oh, almost forgot- changed to full syn. oil and can't remember it doing it again! AFarmer

Go figure huh?

Thanks for the info, I might try syn oil.

Sorry for your problems, I had Cub Cadet before the John Deere and had nothing but trouble, so I switched and other than the smoke I can't complain.

Cheers,

jhunter

jhunter,

I own a 2004 Toro 1744Z with a 17HP B&S. I had the same problem with mine and service people gave the the same explanation you are getting.

I noticed that the smoke did not have that "burning oil smell" but rather the odor of an engine running very rich.

On a hunch, I started turning off the fuel supply valve after the last run of the day letting the engine run the gas out. With the fuel valve off and engine running, I wait until it just about dies and then I apply the choke to get the last bit of gas burned.

Next time I use it, I open the fuel valve, crank her up and no smoke.

Being that the fuel tank sits higher than the carb on mine, I just assumed that gas was seeping past the float valve.

On an IC engine, black smoke is too much fuel, blue smoke is lubricating oil.

I actually find this to be a good thing, it proves that there is a tiny bit of oil somewhere around, probably in the combustion chamber. If it was in the exhaust tract only, I feel that it would take a few seconds longer to start burning up.....

So I feel that it probably works as an upper cylinder lubricant and probably reduces wear and tear at start with a cold engine, which is when most damage is done of course....

As long as the oil consumption is still low, I think personally that you will have a very long living engine!! Which is a good thing, don't you agree?

The other point mentioned first by someone else is simply that the engine is still running in and has not yet "worn" enough to be really "run in".....which is why some oil is getting into the combustion chamber. Which again will keep it fit for years to come!!!

Do you agree with #18? Should I try syn-oil or leave it along and enjoy?

Oils never darker or any noticable usage.

jhunter

I don't think synthetic oil is going to cure the problem of the smoking but I do use synthetic in all of my air cooled small motors. The syn oil handles heat much better without breakdown so I feel I get better protection. Alot of the manufacturers recommend the synthetic oil also and some even extend the warranty.

It sounds like your not going to get any help from the manufacturer so I would just go on and enjoy. My feeling is something is not quit right with the engine design and the manufacturer is not going to admit it. In my opinion the engine should not burn oil. There was a case with Mopar's PT Cruiser motor consuming massive amounts of oil, they tried to tell the consumers it was normal. Come to find out there was a serious valve seal problem, they still never admitted it was a defect.

If it is blue it is not burnt. Probably just vaporized from initial combustion and like the OP said, it smelled like gasoline.

Blue smoke in the exhaust means oil is or has gotten into the combustion chamber, burnt or as you say vaporized it's oil.

Let's get some and analyse it.

All I can say is that I have run all my cars (private & company) on Synthetic oil since 1989 with brilliant results, some have achieved very high mileage (several to 200,00 miles) but with very low oil usage, no damaged engines in any way shape or form, very few problems and all were easy to find and cheap to repair....and NOTHING to do with wear or the oil path areas.....

So I would plump for synthetic oil as it is also very forgiving of extra miles, in fact I run my present car on one filling for 20,000 miles approximately, twice as far as on good multigrade...it uses only about 1 liter (approx 2 pints) in that time.....and its a Diesel, so its quite hard on the oil!!

Just as an aside, one of the important points about Synthetic oil is that if it overheats, it evaporates without leaving a residue, providing extra cooling as it evaporates....especially important for engines with Turbos as the main reason for Turbo failure is the oil burning, leaving hard deposits in the bearings AFTER SWITCHING THE ENGINE OFF!! Turbos glow red hot in operation.

There have been some good points and suggestions so far. But I am curious if you have had to change the spark plug(s) more often. Have you pulled the spark plug(s) lately? If so how do they look? Any build up from oil deposits? I am thinking there will not be much if any as it only smokes briefly.

Sorry if this has been asked and I missed it while reading your thread. Just curious.

I am interested in learning how a spark plug (even a damaged/worn out one) can cause oil burning.

(Leaving aside using a sparkplug with the wrong heat range or nose length actually physically damaging the engine!)

Please be so kind as to inform me further...thanks in advance.

I don't think he was was saying the plugs were causing the oil burning but was just wondering how the plug looked since the mower is burning some oil on start-up. That's how I read the post.

Ah!! Could be.....it was not very accurately written!!! Misunderstandings can then happen!! Thanks.

it was not very accurately written!!!

What?

Sorry, I evidently got my question across to a few people. I have a problem with details. Either too many and it comes off looking like a term paper or not enough and expect you to be able to fill in what I consider common knowledge. Your post just helps remind me that we all come from different backgrounds. I'll try to do a better job next time.

I think he's looking at the plug as an indicator of excessivs oil consumption, not the cause.

I already answered that a couple of minutes ago, and you are right, that could be exactly what he meant.

But an engine that burns oil, 99% of the time it burns it all the time, eg. oil consumption goes up. THEN you can see it on the plugs.

An engine that only shows a puff or two at the start, will not show oil on the plugs, even if you stopped the engine within that time when the blue smoke is appearing......

I have owned/worked on car engines years ago that were similar (you never see this today because of the Cat./Diesel filter burns it up, till its clogged from too much oil. You only have the consumption to go on), with a few puffs of blue when starting, an old mechanic I knew said it was due to the engine when cold, allowing a few drops of oil to slip down past the seals mainly on the inlet valves.(Exhaust valves also leak, but the exhaust pressure blows up into the engine.....but excessive leaking can still eventually cause deposits on the exhaust valve too...)

He even showed me how to identify which valve leaks, as that valve has a build up of oil deposits under the stem, covering the back(?) of the valve.....On the engines we worked on at the time, you could see through the inlet and outlet ports for such contamination with a torch or bright light source....we changed only those seals if the customer was really picky.....some seals leak even when brand new....then anyway....today those things seem to work far better, but I don't build engines anymore for a hobby either, for extra cash....the RN paid badly in those days......

You are correct. I'm not disputing anything you say. Just trying to clarify.

Cheers.

Sorry I have not responded sooner. Work keeps getting in the way. I did not mean the plug was causing the problem. It was intended as an indicator. Lots of carbon means oil burning. If the problem is with a multi-cylinder engine you can see which cylinder is the culprit by this simple check. On multi-cylinder engines the other cylinders can keep the engine running long after the plug fouls completely. Then you will have wet oil on the dry carbon. Lots of information by looking at the plugs and all easily searchable so I will not list them here.