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% of Earth's Atmosphere Passing Through a Gate?

02/28/2011 11:33 PM

Presume a 100 foot high ten mile long American Football Goal post

located in the Sonoran Desert (about 30 degrees north) distant from any mountain ranges

at 4,000 feet elevation, oriented north/south,

with an average 10 MPH wind flowing west east.

What % of the Earth's atmosphere would flow through the "gate"

in one year?

=====================

I believe this is going to take some "guestimates", as I can find little to support

"calculations".

=====================

thank you.

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#1

Re: % of Earth's Atmosphere passing through a Gate?

03/01/2011 12:09 AM

The calculations are dead simple, but you do need the key datum of weight of the entire atmosphere.

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#3
In reply to #1

Re: % of Earth's Atmosphere passing through a Gate?

03/01/2011 12:38 AM

If WEIGHT of the entire atmosphere was given, one would also need the average temp and (static) pressure of the air passing through the "gate".

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#4
In reply to #3

Re: % of Earth's Atmosphere passing through a Gate?

03/01/2011 12:42 AM

True, but those are the minor data, for which reasonable estimates can be given without much specialized knowledge.

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#2

Re: % of Earth's Atmosphere passing through a Gate?

03/01/2011 12:23 AM

The answer is ZERO%. Because American football goal posts do not have any gates.

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#5

Re: % of Earth's Atmosphere passing through a Gate?

03/01/2011 3:07 AM

Not enough information.

At 4000ft my goalpost will be in a mine with no airflow other than what is pumped into the mine.

Are we assuming that the atmosphere is stationary and the post is moving past the air at almost 100 miles per hour?

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#6

Re: % of Earth's Atmosphere Passing Through a Gate?

03/01/2011 5:44 PM

Tweedledee and Tweedledum had such a dialogue, if my recollection is not faulty.

May we agree that the question will never be asked accurately enough to accomodate the wave function of quantum probabilities?

In other words, "what you get is what you look for", and if you look for flaws in the question, you will find them. Thank you Tornado.

The way the question is posed does not require the total mass of the atmosphere, although that could be A WAY to answer.

The variables referred to as "needed" for a "guestimate" are SWAMPED by the chaos attendent to air circulation patterns, particularly in the "horse latitudes":

thus, they are negligible for this matter, imho.

Anything not off by more than a factor of 5 would be genius, around my desk..

That's half an order of magnitude.

This pee's on "temperature" and "pressure" and adiobatic miscellanea.

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#7

Re: % of Earth's Atmosphere Passing Through a Gate?

03/01/2011 6:16 PM

The assumption of 10 mph average velocity cancels out the alleged chaos effects. One can look up or guess the average air temperature in the Sonoran Desert. The average pressure will be a bit less than one atmosphere, on account of the altitude. Simple arithmetic then gives the volume (and mass) of air through the "gate" in one year. Divide by the total atmospheric mass (the key datum) and multiply by 100 to get percent. This should easily be within a factor of 0.8 to 1.25 of the true value.

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#8
In reply to #7

Re: % of Earth's Atmosphere Passing Through a Gate?

03/01/2011 7:47 PM

As regards your comment,

"The assumption of 10 mph average velocity

cancels out the alleged chaos effects."

it (the assumption) may eliminate consideration of the matter in the calculation,

but it assuredly does NOT eliminate it as huge source of potential error

in the results achieved. To ask the question and specify INCLUSION of the data

relating to circulation models, would be exclusive of all respondents

except those with access to hours of mainframe time.

AND, given that the intent of the inclusion of the statement regarding chaos

was to "dis" the adiobatic variables, by comparison,

it is my current position that you are wrong, and I am right.

on that point.

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#9
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Re: % of Earth's Atmosphere Passing Through a Gate?

03/01/2011 8:37 PM

The 10 mph average velocity was your assumption, in the OP (in which there was no mention of chaos). Get a dictionary and look it up. Since you started with that assumption, I am entitled to use it.

Throwing in chaos later on simply changed the subject, rendering your subsequent posts OT, if not just plain ridiculous.

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#10

Re: % of Earth's Atmosphere Passing Through a Gate?

03/03/2011 12:20 AM

.003+/-.0002% of the Earth's atmosphere will go through the "gate" in 1 year.

At 10 mph, the volume through the 100 ft tall by 10 mile wide gate in 1 year is 16,603 cubic miles.

The equivalent sea level volume is 85.7% or 14,228 cubic miles, using density at 4,000 feet elevation to correlate the volume of a static compressible fluid.

99.85% of the atmosphere, by density, is below 100,000 feet (Thomas J. Glover Pocket Ref, 3rd Ed.) and by 4∏(ro3-ri3)/3 the volume is 3,748,321,777 cubic miles. 50% of the atmosphere is below 8,000 feet (Mechanical Engineers Handbook) at 75% of the average density. The approximately full equivalent atmosphere volume at 75% density is below 16,000 feet.

At 30 degrees Latitude, 4000 feet, the average annual temperature is 65oF, or 525oR. The planetwide average is 74oF, or 534oR. PV=nRT. n, R and Pav are constant, so V1T2=V2T1. The equivalent global volume is T2/T1 or 534/525=1.017 larger. However, normalizing to sea level at 2.7oF per thousand feet, the temperature difference is 1.8oF, therefore less than the estimated % accuracy of the temperature, and may be neglected.

Volume by density estimates and temperature accuracy are estimated to be 6% + 2% = 8%.

The approximate ratio of the atmosphere that will go through the "gate" in one year to the total atmosphere is 14228cu miles/(.16x.75x3748321777cu miles) = .00003. Estimated error: .08x.00003= +/-.0000024.

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#11
In reply to #10

Re: % of Earth's Atmosphere Passing Through a Gate?

03/03/2011 8:27 PM

Thank you very much.

I really appreciate the assistance. It will be used for good purpose.

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