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Anonymous Poster #1

Removing Salt From Water

11/29/2011 1:29 AM

We have installed a cement bricks industry in which well water is used for preperation and curing. But unfortunately the water has a little salty taste. How can we remove the sodium chloride from the large quantity of water?

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#1

Re: Removing salt from water

11/29/2011 1:43 AM

Pour it over a bunch of French fries, which will absorb the salt. Opportunity knocks for a joint venture with McDonald's.

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#2

Re: Removing salt from water

11/29/2011 3:13 AM

Oh, any number of techniques: reverse osmosis, ion exchange, electrodialysis, evaporation....

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#3

Re: Removing salt from water

11/29/2011 5:55 AM

Blending...

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#4

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/29/2011 7:28 AM

Does it affect the quality of the bricks?

The problem is, that by the time you remove the trace amount of salt, you will have the most expensive bricks in town.

A certain amount of sodium is common in all water from natural sources.

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#5

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/29/2011 7:28 AM

De-ionization least costly of most.

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#6

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/29/2011 10:07 AM

You might explore this technique...

"The team used decanoic acid as a solvent to mix with the water. 'Upon slight heating, our solvent dissolves the water out, leaving salts and impurities behind. Then, upon cooling, the mixture separates into two layers by gravity, releasing pure water. "

http://www.rsc.org/chemistryworld/News/2011/March/18031105.asp

http://www.chemspider.com/Chemical-Structure.2863.html

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#13
In reply to #6

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/29/2011 11:07 PM

Interesting concept but I fear some of the byproducts may create a disposal problem. I suspect that the waste stream will have to be treated as a hazardous waste product and thus add to the cost. It may have applications in some areas but I fear the unknown and would defer the OP from going too exotic in removing salts. I posted my own thread on " The Theory of Water by John Pollard". It too was of interest (not only for potential water treatment) but most of us would like to see more practical systems before we approach the exotic. Thanks for the information, much appreciated.

For treatment of removing salts at an industrial type cement factory, I would opt for DI as recommended by OZZB.

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#7

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/29/2011 6:11 PM

When I was a kid(77 now) we lay brick in Mich. winter with salt in mud to lay them

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#8

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/29/2011 6:50 PM

Salt in bricks may cause efflorescence, which is a cosmetic problem , not a structural problem - it does not affect the soundness of the brick.

However, the efflorescence produced by salt in clay is commonly addressed in industry according to this page:

"...in the present day manufacture of these products, the highly soluble salts are washed from the clay, and a barium salt such as barium carbonate is added to the product, to react with the calcium sulfate which may be present. In this reaction, the product is two fairly insoluble compounds-barium sulfate and calcium carbonate. When produced in this manner, clay products exhibit little tendency to efflores­cence."

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#9
In reply to #8

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/29/2011 9:14 PM

Yeah ruins a job..

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#19
In reply to #9

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/30/2011 8:35 AM

acid will make that a good job

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#10

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/29/2011 10:36 PM

Boy, y'all are fine highly trained engineers...... First, just because it tastes "salty" does not tell you what you are really working with. May I suggest a good analysis of your water first. Then you will have a better idea of what you may want to do to it.

:-)

Bill

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#17
In reply to #10

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/30/2011 7:09 AM

As a finely trained engineer ;-) I do recall the professor telling us that taking a sip of the water you are going to use for concrete is common practice of testing it because you do need surprisingly clean water to make good concrete. So if it is good to drink it is usuually good for making concrete. [\p]

a common problem with water when making concrete is effectively salt as it acts as a retardant for the setting. In other words, you do need to clean that water out if you want to be working at a reasonable production rate. [\p]

Like others here I would go for reverse osmosis: it doesn't put any new agents into your water and it can deal with large amounts of water as it is common,y used in water desalination.

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#18
In reply to #17

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/30/2011 8:17 AM

Not to mention that Chloride ions in the water (from NaCl2.....ie, salt) used to make concrete can attack the steel reinforcement bars and cause corrosion, which can cause concrete spalling and "popped" concrete.

In the 3rd world, possibly the most efficient way to remove salt from the well water is to employ solar evaporation.....

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#22
In reply to #18

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/30/2011 12:55 PM

I believe Sodium Chloride is Nacl , not NaCl2....

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#23
In reply to #22

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/30/2011 1:30 PM

You're correct....my mistake.

I guess that I didn't have enough coffee this morning! LOL

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#24
In reply to #18

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/30/2011 1:42 PM

Chloride ions... yes.

Also, the following may be more info. than is needed for this discussion, but nonetheless, interesting, as far as the process goes.

"Comparison of water and saltwater movement in mortar based on a semiempirical electromagnetic model."

Abstract: http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/xpls/abs_all.jsp?arnumber=1316008&tag=1

full paper: http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/stamp/stamp.jsp?tp=&arnumber=1316008&tag=1 (for those who have access)

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#26
In reply to #18

Re: Removing Salt From Water

12/01/2011 6:25 AM

<...possibly the most efficient way to remove salt from the well water is to employ solar evaporation.....>

Actually, it tends to remove water from the salt - unless there's some form of condenser handy...

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#11

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/29/2011 10:41 PM

Maybe you start trying with small plant of RO (Reverse Osmosis) of desalination water treatment plant, with the basic principal/applications of apply high discharge pump pressure through membranes, in reducing the salt contain.

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#12

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/29/2011 11:03 PM

Installation of water treatment plant adds your production cost. If you can locate another source ( nearby to production unit) for chemically free water sometimes it may work out cheaper.

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#14

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/29/2011 11:25 PM

Solar distillation, evaporation, salt and mineral filters , in line--IT's out there--I knew the guy that first came up with the high pressure misting systems that are now common place in the hot , desert areas of the world--The orifices of the misters were so small, that any hard water minerals salts, and other pollutants in the local water delivery systems would calcify, salt, or in someway clog the system--He found an inline filtering system that can employed around the world, for all types of water--Now, you have these systems , not only on Las VEgas, misting the tables of the loud and obnoxious, but all the way to Dubai, Saudi Arabia etc, where he commands mega bucks to drop air temperatures by 30 degrees, for outdoor activities--Start looking at this technology, and I am sure you will find your answer--

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Anonymous Poster #2
#15

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/30/2011 1:15 AM

What are the adverse effects of the salty water on your brick quality., if any .?? Have you started production..?? and what makes you believe that the salty taste is the result of Sodium Chloride and not other mineral salts....as the team says : send a water sample for chemical analysis..

Thank You

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#16

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/30/2011 3:59 AM

Road tankerage from another source...

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#20

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/30/2011 8:56 AM

I have added liquid glass (25 wt.% sodium oxide and 75wt% silica) to fill crack and only thing I have to do is to wash after two years to remove excess salt which was not bonded in the crack in the area I filled the hole.

If you know chemistry of water and is salt then I am of opinion use it and then wash brick after few years when you see dry salt on the surface of brick same way we wash of salt from the surface of glass in our house eith by high pressure wash or by water or solvent based window cleaner.

If it is sulfer and in particularly calcium sulfide or sulpghate then we need to fix it. At the end of day you need to know water chemsity and you will be okay to take proper action

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#21

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/30/2011 12:43 PM

Be careful before you taste your water for mixing concrete. Most water in the field is not potable. You do not want to contract cholera or ecoli as a result of "testing " your water.

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#25
In reply to #21

Re: Removing Salt From Water

11/30/2011 1:59 PM

Testing is done in lab using wet chemsitry of ICP are most common methods. I have seen SEM and TEM also used for this purpose

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