That is somewhat the point of my question - how can one separate the mechanic from the tech?? I fully understand the certification is like a set of rules, it can allow you to say what you cannot do rather that what you will do.

Just wished there was a simple way to measure curiosity!

Problem with labels. To me a "service technician" is the guy with all the training certificates who sees himself as a specialist and somewhat elite. A "mechanic" is the inquisitive guy who is mostly self-taught and driven by curiosity and a willingness to take a shot at finding out what is wrong and how to fix it. He doesn't mind risking his status by jumping in. He also recognizes the value of services manuals and knows how to do an info search. The old term "grease monkey" still fits. I'm an engineer and a tinkerer. I understand the application of advanced mathematics to describe a physical process but I also like to take things apart and put them back together. I can't stand to throw a malfunctioning device into the trash un-meddled with. I think the first response nailed it.

I ran a mechanical contracting business for years...The only way I ever found to test a troubleshooter was in the field...There are just too many variables...starting with customer relations, ego, ability to problem solve in related areas, reliability, cleanliness, organisational skills on job, preparedness, and the list goes on....I can tell you this, they are scarce, few and far between, you may only run into a handful in a lifetime, that are really good....

I think I would figure out your test, and then I'd show you the finger, I have no time for such an unwelcoming of a stranger.

Can't take a joke, huh? Seems to me the test would work perfectly given your response.

Then you'd not be welcome would you?

You haven't seen the purpose of that little test.... if you can get it solved, great, but that's not the point.

If I now have to explain the point to you.....

Mike..

I worked it out.. can I come drink with you guys?

Training classes are necessary, especially in high tech fields, but a service technician (troubleshooter) needs more than just training before he can be of any value. He needs to have manual dexterity, be able to understand basic engineering concepts and have a curiosity of how things work. Long before I became an engineer, I built my own electronic devices, fixed everything that was broken, fixed cars, ran lathes and mills. That was because I grew up at a time when, if you wanted something and you couldn't afford it, you had to build it. Over the years, those skills were lost, so it will be very difficult to screen applicants for the jobs.

I think a topic I would bring up during an interview would be hobbies and interests. During my own interview years ago, I put on my resume' "I built a live steam locomotive". The interviewer was impressed. I know my description was way over his head, but it indicated to him my ability to perform complex tasks. I got the job by-the-way. I know you would hire me if I applied for a job, but unfortunately I'm retired and still building locomotives.

As others have already mentioned and the Dilbert cartoon clearly shows, the only way the knack can be revealed is by a tempting problem that can be fixed. Unfortunately the high stress situation of a job interview can stifle the urge to touch, let alone fix anything a prospective employer owns.

One test I was subjected to many years back, came when I was asked to demonstrate my surface mounted chip soldering/de-soldering skills in an interview. A "dead" circuit board was handed to me that had a smoked surface mounted tantalum capacitor. I immediately noticed that the remains of this capacitor showed that the capacitor was installed backwards. I noticed that nothing else on the board was damaged so I mentioned that it might be a nice to see if the rest of the board worked once the capacitor was replaced. I threw the power switch to turn ON the solder station and nothing happened. While maintaining a conversation on the function a good board should accomplish I verified the power outlet as working and identified the fault was the 3AG style fuse of the soldering station was open. I swapped out the dead fuse with a good one and palmed the dead fuse for later use. Replacing the capacitor permitted the board to operate for at least the preliminary tests. When I went back with the interviewer to the front offices I was asked the almost obligatory question of my impressions of their facility. I told them that I was very impressed with the cleverness of the people working here as I brought out the failed fuse. I now pointed out the flux stain on the outside of the end cap of the 3AG fuse and the intact fuse filament down the center. Somebody had heated the end of the fuse with the soldering iron so that the intact filament was no longer touching the end cap. I then told the interviewer in the privacy of her office that I didn't care if this was an employee on the floor playing a practical joke or part of the interview testing. This was a very clever setup. I like working with smart people.

This test was more for a production tech, but you provide the tech with two highly oxidized pieces of copper wire and ask him to solder them together. If he asks for flux he passes... don't even need to turn on the iron.

If you are looking for a good FE, look at the production test department. These guys have experience with the equipment... and a work history with the company. Also. I would place military schooling as a high priority. A friend of mine has a computer repair shop. When a customer asked him where he learned about computers he replied "In the Coast Guard... When you are at sea for 90 days and something goes wrong, you have to fix it... and there ain't no Radio Shack around the corner".

So... If I were going to make a good FE, I would take military experience (the more the better) then put him into production test for a period of time (to learn the products), then slide him over into a FE position. During the "period of time" you can find out if he is a "people person". If not, leave him in production test or whatever. Note! I have not mentioned any sort of college degree.

In my case, I got out of college and discovered I did not know Sh*t from Shinola. I put in about 3 years in production test and also did a bit of FE... I think I was the only one who knew how to tie a tie. As the company expanded, I shifted over to Engineering, and got into trouble once or twice for helping out the FE dept. "Damn it Bill... that is not your job... get back to upstairs to Engineering". Funny thing is that for the next ten years (and over several companies) I put on my FE hat again... for the same boss who chewed me out in the original company.

If you don't have the above options, get someone with FE experience. More than that I cannot offer.

Bill

Interesting thread.

I have a small business and employ about 25 people. My business is Fire Alarm, Fire Sprinkler, Special Hazards Fire, Security, Camera, Access Control, Data Cabling, etc. Anything "system" related. I am always looking for candidates who are problem solvers, independent thinkers and logic inclined.

I have found a few traits to look for and some to "look" for. Good technicians are techies, computer geeks (can build their own system) and people who have had to make do when growing up. The latter need training usually, but will prove to be the best eventually.

What I don't want are....well let's just leave it at that.

I think an ability to "see" the whole system rather than getting bogged down in the details is key. The test with the fake phone call presents a very large picture that has many clues that "lead" to the fan belt. I used to test my students in a "Programming for Technician" class (when we had computers not laptops ) by setting up a "problem" on our test machine with non of them around. Then I would ask each individual to find the problem. (sometimes I even unplugged the machine!) I then observed how they went about solving it...the best usually got hired by my company.

try this.. give them an electrical drawing and ask them to tell you how it works!

That reminded me that the boss of a maintenance crew did just that when I applied for a job. He got me when he asked how a two-way switch worked for hall lights. I remembered way back in 6th grade when a girl (I still remember her name, quite hawt) brought a demonstration model in for show and tell. It was clear magic to me, and that's what I told the boss.

He pressed me more for an answer, because he really needed help, and apparently wasn't getting good applicants.

I told him that I just hadn't had any experience with the switches, but when I needed to, I would just look on the package for the instructions. That worked for him. At least I knew to look for instructions, and expected to understand them.

I got the job, it was a lot of work, but fun.

Yes, there is software designed to teach and to test one's electrical and PLC troubleshooting skills anyway.

See ..

V4 Electrical Troubleshooting Training Software

Advanced Industrial Troubleshooting Simulation Training Software

and

Troubleshooting PLC Control Circuits
hope this helps