Login | Register
The Engineer's Place for News and Discussion®

Previous in Forum: Weight of hourglass   Next in Forum: RO Plant
Close

Comments Format:






Close

Subscribe to Discussion:

CR4 allows you to "subscribe" to a discussion
so that you can be notified of new comments to
the discussion via email.

Close

Rating Vote:







17 comments
Member

Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 9

Difference Between Tear and Tensile Strength and Their Relation with Crystality

04/27/2012 11:02 AM

i read the usefull posts about difference between tensile and tear strength but i still have problem with their exact relation with crystality

__________________
"The highest form of ignorance is to reject something you know nothing about." Dr. Wayne W. Dyer
Register to Reply
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Comments rated to be Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive ratings to make them "good answers".

Comments rated to be "almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, rate them!
Guru
Hobbies - Automotive Performance - New Member Popular Science - Weaponology - New Member

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: 34° 34' 21.60" N, 92° 55' 42.28" W
Posts: 20929
Good Answers: 785
#1

Re: difference between tear and tensile strength and their relation with crystallinity

04/27/2012 11:09 AM

The higher the crystallinity, the lower the tensile and tear strengths.

__________________
Luck comes and goes. Skill is forever. Intelligence either is, or it ain't. lyn
Register to Reply
Member

Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 9
#2
In reply to #1

Re: difference between tear and tensile strength and their relation with crystallinity

04/27/2012 11:18 AM

but for example HDPE has got high crystallinity,but the film that is made of it has goft good tensile strenght

doesnt it mean that orientation in HDPE causes its crystality and thus higher tensile strenght ?

__________________
"The highest form of ignorance is to reject something you know nothing about." Dr. Wayne W. Dyer
Register to Reply
Guru
Hobbies - CNC - New Member Hobbies - DIY Welding - New Member Engineering Fields - Electromechanical Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 8731
Good Answers: 100
#3

Re: difference between tear and tensile strength and their relation with crystality

04/27/2012 11:24 AM

their exact relation with crystality

When you talk about crystality, are you talking about Work hardening?

__________________
phoenix911
Register to Reply
Member

Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 9
#4
In reply to #3

Re: difference between tear and tensile strength and their relation with crystality

04/27/2012 11:32 AM

not at all

i mean crystality in polymers

__________________
"The highest form of ignorance is to reject something you know nothing about." Dr. Wayne W. Dyer
Register to Reply
Guru
Hobbies - CNC - New Member Hobbies - DIY Welding - New Member Engineering Fields - Electromechanical Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 8731
Good Answers: 100
#5
In reply to #4

Re: difference between tear and tensile strength and their relation with crystality

04/27/2012 11:35 AM

i missed your second post.

__________________
phoenix911
Register to Reply
Member

Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 9
#6
In reply to #5

Re: difference between tear and tensile strength and their relation with crystality

04/27/2012 11:40 AM

i totally mixed up !!!The polymer engineering is extremley confusing

__________________
"The highest form of ignorance is to reject something you know nothing about." Dr. Wayne W. Dyer
Register to Reply
Guru
Hobbies - Automotive Performance - New Member Popular Science - Weaponology - New Member

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: 34° 34' 21.60" N, 92° 55' 42.28" W
Posts: 20929
Good Answers: 785
#7
In reply to #4

Re: difference between tear and tensile strength and their relation with crystality

04/27/2012 11:50 AM

The more specific the question, the better the answer.

Crystallinity in Polymers

__________________
Luck comes and goes. Skill is forever. Intelligence either is, or it ain't. lyn
Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Guru
Hobbies - Musician - New Member Australia - Member - Torn and breading Engineering Fields - Nanoengineering - New Member APIX Pilot Plant Design Project - Member - New Member

Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Magnetic Island, Queensland, Australia
Posts: 3851
Good Answers: 75
#16
In reply to #7

Re: difference between tear and tensile strength and their relation with crystality

04/28/2012 5:15 PM

Thanks Lyn. You have no idea how handy that pdf came in. It saved me a lot of time and I wasn't even looking for it. That's serendipity for you.

__________________
The Twain Has Met
Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 5)
Guru
Hobbies - Automotive Performance - New Member Popular Science - Weaponology - New Member

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: 34° 34' 21.60" N, 92° 55' 42.28" W
Posts: 20929
Good Answers: 785
#17
In reply to #16

Re: difference between tear and tensile strength and their relation with crystality

04/28/2012 6:04 PM

Glad to help out. Even if I didn't know it.

__________________
Luck comes and goes. Skill is forever. Intelligence either is, or it ain't. lyn
Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 5)
Member

Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 9
#8

Re: Difference Between Tear and Tensile Strength and Their Relation with Crystality

04/27/2012 1:40 PM

this is the schematic of film blowing process

process can be controled to be long neck

Operation mode: long neck

" film of HDPE (high density PE ) produced by long neck method,cause if we produce it with short neck method its tear strength will be severly reduced"

i know that with long neck method ,we have Biaxial oriented film ..i think that this orientation causes high crystality in HDPE,and i do not know how it causes low tear strength... and if our polymer has got high tensile strength how is it possible not to have high tear strength? for example according to my studying, films of HDPE tear easily but they have good tensile strength

__________________
"The highest form of ignorance is to reject something you know nothing about." Dr. Wayne W. Dyer
Register to Reply
Guru
Hobbies - Automotive Performance - New Member Popular Science - Weaponology - New Member

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: 34° 34' 21.60" N, 92° 55' 42.28" W
Posts: 20929
Good Answers: 785
#9
In reply to #8

Re: Difference Between Tear and Tensile Strength and Their Relation with Crystality

04/27/2012 4:15 PM

It's all relative.

Are you a film blower? Or, a student?

__________________
Luck comes and goes. Skill is forever. Intelligence either is, or it ain't. lyn
Register to Reply
Member

Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 9
#12
In reply to #9

Re: Difference Between Tear and Tensile Strength and Their Relation with Crystality

04/27/2012 5:43 PM

student...

__________________
"The highest form of ignorance is to reject something you know nothing about." Dr. Wayne W. Dyer
Register to Reply
Guru
Hobbies - Automotive Performance - New Member Popular Science - Weaponology - New Member

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: 34° 34' 21.60" N, 92° 55' 42.28" W
Posts: 20929
Good Answers: 785
#13
In reply to #12

Re: Difference Between Tear and Tensile Strength and Their Relation with Crystallinity

04/27/2012 5:50 PM

Student. OK.

Polymers are different than metals or solids in lots of ways.

Crystallinity may have a different meaning, depending.

Are you asking if stretch blow molding is better?

__________________
Luck comes and goes. Skill is forever. Intelligence either is, or it ain't. lyn
Register to Reply
2
Guru
Hobbies - Musician - Engineering Fields - Chemical Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Instrumentation Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Kennewick, WA, USA, Thulcandra - The Silent Planet (C.S. Lewis)
Posts: 2808
Good Answers: 102
#10
In reply to #8

Re: Difference Between Tear and Tensile Strength and Their Relation with Crystality

04/27/2012 5:15 PM

Do you remember the polyethylene 6-pack rings?

If you fold them over themselves enough, you can get 1 ring x 6.

Grab each side of the 1 x 6 ring with the middle finger of each hand.

Now, try to break the rings very quickly and with as much force as you can. If you had enough strength, the rings will be torn open.

With another 1 x 6 folded 6-pack ring, from the same starting position, slowly pull the ring apart. This time it stretches more and you may not be able to get it to break at all.

In the first case, pulling quickly before appreciable stretching has occured, will cause the polymer to break because it does not have as high a tensile strength as the stretched film. When the film is stretched, polymer chains are becoming more parallel to each other in the direction of the stretch thereby gaining tensile strength.

The stretched film should also have more tear resistance, but comparing tear resistance of the two cannot be done directly because the stretched film is now thinner than the unstretched film.

The only other thing I can say is make sure that you are using the correct tear resistance method and on the same thickness of the different (long neck vs. short neck) materials.

__________________
"I am enough of an artist to draw freely upon my imagination. Imagination is more important than knowledge. Knowledge is limited. Imagination encircles the world." -- Albert Einstein
Register to Reply Good Answer (Score 2)
Member

Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 9
#11
In reply to #10

Re: Difference Between Tear and Tensile Strength and Their Relation with Crystality

04/27/2012 5:25 PM

Thank you so much for all your help I really appreciate it
"but comparing tear resistance of the two cannot be done directly because the stretched film is now thinner than the unstretched film "
I did not pay attention to this point at all
and about your example,it was awesome
Thank u again and also others for great help..

__________________
"The highest form of ignorance is to reject something you know nothing about." Dr. Wayne W. Dyer
Register to Reply
Guru
Hobbies - Musician - Engineering Fields - Chemical Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member Engineering Fields - Instrumentation Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Kennewick, WA, USA, Thulcandra - The Silent Planet (C.S. Lewis)
Posts: 2808
Good Answers: 102
#14
In reply to #11

Re: Difference Between Tear and Tensile Strength and Their Relation with Crystality

04/27/2012 7:06 PM

You're welcome Melody.

P.S. We do have a post rating system here ;)

__________________
"I am enough of an artist to draw freely upon my imagination. Imagination is more important than knowledge. Knowledge is limited. Imagination encircles the world." -- Albert Einstein
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: "Dancing over the abyss."
Posts: 4768
Good Answers: 237
#15
In reply to #10

Re: Difference Between Tear and Tensile Strength and Their Relation with Crystality

04/27/2012 9:26 PM

Sounds like you are describing true stress true strain as the material elongates and thins. Milo

__________________
People say between two opposed opinions the truth lies in the middle. Not at all! Between them lies the problem, what is unseeable,eternally active life, contemplated in repose. Goethe
Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Register to Reply 17 comments
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Comments rated to be Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive ratings to make them "good answers".

Comments rated to be "almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, rate them!
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

ky (1); lyn (5); melody (6); Mikerho (2); Milo (1); phoenix911 (2)

Previous in Forum: Weight of hourglass   Next in Forum: RO Plant