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Difference Between 3.5 C and 4C Cable

06/13/2012 1:28 AM

Where can 3.5C & 4C cable can be used ?

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#1

Re: Difference between 3.5 C and 4C cable

06/13/2012 3:09 AM

Anywhere they are deemed suitable within the provisions of British Standard 7671.

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#2
In reply to #1

Re: Difference between 3.5 C and 4C cable

06/13/2012 3:17 AM

Well thanks man for the reply but i want specific location or case which gives clear picture where these cables can be used.

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#3
In reply to #2

Re: Difference between 3.5 C and 4C cable

06/13/2012 3:23 AM

There are training courses for electrical design and installation. An internet search will reveal the opportunities.

<...man...> How abstruse.

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#4

Re: Difference between 3.5 C and 4C cable

06/13/2012 3:25 AM

20 or 30 years ago the electrical loads were much simpler and balanced. The current returning through the neutral was much reduced and it was the norm to supply a feeder cable with a neutral of reduced section to save costs. Early lighting circuits for instance were tungsten loads rather than fluorescent.

Times have changed and more so with the horrible inverter and computer type loads we place on the distribution system. The current returning through the neutral has increased. You say neutral is now the same size as the phase conductor but due to issues with harmonics and in particular triplen harmonics it is now sometimes necessary to make the neutral conductor larger than the phase conductors.

Schneider have some interesting papers on this where 1 MVA transformers have burnt out with 1000amps on the phases but 1400 ish on the neutral. Figures from memory but gives a flavour of where its going.

It is possible you could still quote a 3.5c but it would have to be heavily loaded with balanced 3ph loads.

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#5

Re: Difference Between 3.5 C and 4C Cable

06/13/2012 4:30 PM

Quote "Well thanks man for the reply but i want specific location or case which gives clear picture where these cables can be used."

We can not answer that question. There are hundreds of places these cables can be used. Is your question in regards to the reduced neutral?

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#6
In reply to #5

Re: Difference Between 3.5 C and 4C Cable

06/13/2012 11:58 PM

Yes my dear friend i mean why neutral core size has been increased from 0.5C to 1C

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#7

Re: Difference Between 3.5 C and 4C Cable

06/14/2012 1:00 AM

During the design stage Neutral current should be assessed properly and if necessary over-sized neutral should be recommended.

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#8

Re: Difference Between 3.5 C and 4C Cable

06/14/2012 3:36 PM

Quote sanketgoswami1986 "Yes my dear friend i mean why neutral core size has been increased from 0.5C to 1C"

It seems to me that the Fox in post #4 gave a good answered your question. In addition

1.the amount of single phase load connected phase to neutral will influence the neutral current. If you can balance this load, the current in the neutral will be small. No need for the full size neutral.

2. Triplen harmonics add to the current flow in the neutral. The designer must give this type load consideration when making this decision.

3. Fault current at times will require the neutral to be increased.

Excellent article on sizing the neutral

http://www.electrical-installation.org/enwiki/Sizing_the_neutral_conductor

You are welcome.

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#9

Re: Difference Between 3.5 C and 4C Cable

06/14/2012 3:52 PM

our man still doesn't have an answer.

On a system where there are only 3 phase loads there would be no requirement for a neutral.

On an old Motor control centre with many 3 phase loads it was usual to use a 3 1/2 core cable - the neutral was reduced. This type of cable was used simply to save costs - less copper.

The danger comes when you try to feed a distribution board / a building etc where there are many single phase loads. The worse case would be a single phase load where the phase conductor would be of sized ok but the neutral is undersized.

The issues with triplen harmonics must not be ignored.

If you have one of these cables, as I assume you must have, assume that the phase conductors are the same size as the neutral i.e. if its a 50mm² cable and the neutral is on 25mm² then assume all cores are 25mm².

Look to the single cables that come from the secondary of a large 11kV/433V transformer on an industrial site. Its usual to have 3 conductors per phase but only 2 for the neutral. This is your situation.

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#10
In reply to #9

Re: Difference Between 3.5 C and 4C Cable

06/16/2012 2:19 AM

I agree for 3 phase it will not matter much but for single phase neutral core size has to be same as phase core.

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#11

Re: Difference Between 3.5 C and 4C Cable

06/28/2012 5:04 AM

It depends neutral

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#12

Re: Difference Between 3.5 C and 4C Cable

06/28/2012 6:01 AM

depends on the neutral ???

No it doesn't.

Phase and neutral conductor must be the same size on a single phase circuit. The lowest size conductor determines the value of current that can be safely passed.

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pnaban (1); PWSlack (2); sanketgoswami1986 (3); silverfox (3); sridharganasen (1); wareagle (2)

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