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Vaccine Mania

11/25/2019 3:14 PM

More polio cases now caused by vaccine than by wild virus

apnews.com/7d8b0e32efd0480fbd12acf27729f6a5

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#1

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/25/2019 3:32 PM

The Do-gooders strike again...We'll cure these poor people of Polio if we have to paralyze half the population to do it....

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#2

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/25/2019 3:58 PM

How many cases of polio, out of how many million doses?

"Do gooders" are the reason you two clowns are probably still alive.

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#3
In reply to #2

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/25/2019 5:41 PM

Read the first line on the OP until you understand it, then try to say something intelligent.

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#4

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/25/2019 7:10 PM

This could have been a meritorious thread, if not for the propagandistic title.

Nowhere in the article is "vaccine mania" mentioned, even though such a thing might be possible.

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#5
In reply to #3

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/25/2019 7:21 PM

You piece says also, "In rare cases, the live virus in oral polio vaccine can mutate into a form capable of sparking new outbreaks. All the current vaccine-derived polio cases have been sparked by a Type 2 virus contained in the vaccine. Type 2 wild virus was eliminated years ago."

So, follow closely now, if the virus were ELIMINATED YEARS AGO, if a single case were reported, that would be enough to justify your outrageous claim that, "More polio cases now caused by vaccine than by wild virus."

DO try to keep up!

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#6
In reply to #5

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/25/2019 9:34 PM

Good try to be intelligent, but you failed. There are 3 types of polio. It wasn't my claim, it was the title of the article. Here's some more information:

"According to the latest update from the GPEI today, Afghanistan has two new WPV1 cases this week, and Pakistan has 4 new WPV1 cases. To date, there have been 94 wild poliovirus cases reported in 2019, compared to 33 in all of 2018.

In addition, several African nations reported single cases of vaccine-derived polio: Chad, Benin, the Democratic Republic of the Congo, Ghana, Ethiopia, Togo, and Zambia. Many of these cases are linked to the Jigawa outbreak in Nigeria.

In 2019 so far, officials have reported 102 cases of vaccine-derived polio. Last year saw 104 cases."

cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2019/10/world-polio-day-wild-poliovirus-type-3-declared-eradicated

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#7
In reply to #4

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/25/2019 9:43 PM

Perhaps "Vaccine Lunacy" would have been better. Using a live virus to vaccinate when there is a better choice is not smart. In either case propaganda is irrelevant. This is not a political thread.

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#8
In reply to #7

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/25/2019 11:18 PM

No, "lunacy" would not have been better. Your article doesn't mention that, either. Nor does the article discuss differences among live, killed, attenuated, or other viral statuses. You are just throwing stuff at the wall now.

Thus far there is nothing of medical or statistical value in your comments, and so of course they are entirely political.

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#9
In reply to #1

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/26/2019 3:00 AM

That scenario is not credible at all. Instead, it is some of the most desperately incompetent nonsense ever put forth.

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#10
In reply to #9

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/26/2019 11:13 AM

Would you infect your family with live polio viruses?

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#11
In reply to #8

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/26/2019 12:37 PM

Nor does the article discuss differences among live, killed, attenuated, or other viral statuses

From the article: "

"In rare cases, the live virus in oral polio vaccine can mutate into a form capable of sparking new outbreaks. All the current vaccine-derived polio cases have been sparked by a Type 2 virus contained in the vaccine... To eradicate polio, more than 95% of a population needs to be immunized. WHO and partners have long relied on oral polio vaccines because they are cheap and can be easily administered, requiring only two drops per dose. Western countries use a more expensive injectable polio vaccine that contains an inactivated virus incapable of causing polio."

Thus far there is nothing of medical or statistical value in your comments, and so of course they are entirely political.

Huh??? Tell me which political party is this supposed to benefit?

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#12
In reply to #2

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/26/2019 1:36 PM

After DDT was banned because it was thought to cause the thinning of California Condor egg shells, fancy name for buzzard, later proven to be wrong, it was the result of drought, millions of people died from Malaria...This was the work of one do-gooder, Rachel Carson...

..."After DDT was banned, malaria reemerged across the globe: In India, between 1952 and 1962, DDT caused a decrease in annual malaria cases from 100 million to 60,000. "..

In an effort to save one butt ugly bird, she sacrificed millions of human lives....

https://www.thedailybeast.com/how-rachel-carson-cost-millions-of-people-their-lives

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#13
In reply to #12

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/26/2019 5:07 PM

THE DAILY BEAST is your credible source? You are just plain ignorant of the facts, by choice!

You are knowingly spreading lies.

Along with the passage of the Endangered Species Act, the United States ban on DDT is a major factor in the comeback of the bald eagle (the national bird of the United States) and the peregrine falcon from near-extinction in the contiguous United States.[11][12]

Eggshell Cracks | National Geographic Society

.

A Troubling Snag in the Comeback of the California Condor ...

Banned Pesticide DDT Is Still Killing California Condors ...

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com › extinction-countdown › banned-pest..

DDT, the California Condor, and a Decades-Long Battle With ...

https://www.onegreenplanet.org › environment › ddt-the-california-condor..

DDT in food source tied to condor reproductive woes - SFGate

https://www.sfgate.com › science › article › DDT-in-food-source-tied-to-c..

Biologists suspect residual DDT for thinning egg shells in ...

https://www.mercurynews.com › 2010/07/15 › biologists-suspect-residual-..

DDT contaminants in marine mammals may threaten ...

https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com › ddt-ocean-california-condor

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#14
In reply to #13

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/26/2019 5:25 PM

Yeah blah blah blah,,, I don't see anything about humans there...? Oh that's right, humans are evil, we don't care about them....right?

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#15
In reply to #13

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/26/2019 8:25 PM

DDT wasn't used until 1947

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#16
In reply to #14

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/26/2019 8:52 PM

You said, After DDT was banned because it was thought to cause the thinning of California Condor egg shells, fancy name for buzzard, later proven to be wrong,

By whom was it ,"proven to be wrong"?

You two are very trying.

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#17
In reply to #16

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/26/2019 10:06 PM

..."VI. EGG-SHELL THINNING. DDT was alleged to have thinned bird egg shells.

39. Many experiments on caged-birds demonstrate that DDT and its metabolites (DDD and DDE) do not cause serious egg shell thinning, even at levels many hundreds of times greater than wild birds would ever accumulate. [Cecil, HC et al. 1971. Poultry Science 50: 656-659 (No effects of DDT or DDE, if adequate calcium is in diet); Chang, ES & ELR Stokstad. 1975. Poultry Science 54: 3-10 1975. (No effects of DDT on shells); Edwards, JG. 1971. Chem Eng News p. 6 & 59 (August 16, 1971) (Summary of egg shell- thinning and refutations presented revealing all data); Hazeltine, WE. 1974. Statement and affidavit, EPA Hearings on Tussock Moth Control, Portland Oregon, p. 9 (January 14, 1974); Jeffries, DJ. 1969. J Wildlife Management 32: 441-456 (Shells 7 percent thicker after two years on DDT diet); Robson, WA et al. 1976. Poultry Science 55:2222- 2227; Scott, ML et al. 1975. Poultry Science 54: 350-368 (Egg production, hatchability and shell quality depend on calcium, and are not effected by DDT and its metabolites); Spears, G & P. Waibel. 1972. Minn. Science 28(3):4-5; Tucker, RK & HA Haegele. 1970. Bull Environ Contam. Toxicol 5:191-194 (Neither egg weight nor shell thickness affected by 300 parts per million DDT in daily diet);Edwards, JG. 1973. Statement and affidavit, U.S. Senate Committee on Agriculture, 24 pages, October 24, 1973; Poult Sci 1979 Nov;58(6):1432-49 (“There was no correlation between concentrations of pesticides and egg shell thinning.”)]

40. Experiments associating DDT with egg shell thinning involve doses much higher than would ever be encountered in the wild. [J Toxicol Environ Health 1977 Nov;3(4):699-704 (50 ppm for 6 months); Arch Environ Contam Toxicol 1978;7(3):359-67 (“acute” doses); Acta Pharmacol Toxicol (Copenh) 1982 Feb;50(2):121-9 (40 mg/kg/day for 45 days); Fed Proc 1977 May;36(6):1888-93 (“In well-controlled experiments using white leghorn chickens and Japanese quail, dietary PCBs, DDT and related compounds produced no detrimental effects on eggshell quality. … no detrimental effects on eggshell quality, egg production or hatchability were found with … DDT up to 100 ppm)]

41. Laboratory egg shell thinning required massive doses of DDE far in excess of anything expected in nature, and massive laboratory doses produce much less thinning than is seen in many of the thin-shelled eggs collected in the wild. [Hazeltine, WE. 1974. Statement and affidavit, EPA Hearings on Tussock Moth Control, Portland Oregon, p. 9 (January 14, 1974)]

42. Years of carefully controlled feeding experiments involving levels of DDT as high as present in most wild birds resulted in no tremors, mortality, thinning of egg shells nor reproductive interference. [Scott, ML et al. 1975. Poultry Science 54: 350-368 (Egg production, hatch ability and shell quality depend on calcium, and are not effected by DDT and its
metabolites)]

43. Egg shell thinning is not correlated with pesticide residues. [Krantz WC. 1970 (No correlation between shell-thinning and pesticide residues in eggs) Pesticide Monitoring J 4(3): 136-141; Postupalsky, S. 1971. Canadian Wildlife Service manuscript, April 8, 1971 (No correlation between shell-thinning and DDE in eggs of bald eagles and cormorants); Anon. 1970. Oregon State University Health Sciences Conference, Annual report, p. 94. (Lowest DDT residues associated with thinnest shells in Cooper’s hawk, sharp-shinned hawk and goshawk); Claus G and K Bolander. 1977. Ecological Sanity, David McKay Co., N.Y., p. 461. (Feeding thyreprotein causes hens to lay lighter eggs, with heavier, thicker shells)]<

44. Among brown pelican egg shells examined there was no correlation between DDT residue and shell thickness. [Switzer, B. 1972. Consolidated EPA hearings, Transcript pp. 8212-8336; and Hazeltine, WE. 1972. Why pelican eggshells are thin. Nature 239: 410-412]

45. Egg shells of red-tailed hawks were reported to be six percent thicker during years of heavy DDT usage than just before DDT use began. Golden eagle egg shells were 5 percent thicker than those produced before DDT use. [Hickey, JJ and DW Anderson. 1968. Science 162: 271-273]

46. To the extent egg shell thinning occurred, many other substances and conditions could have been responsible.

47. Oil has been associated with egg shell thinning. [Anon. National Wildlife Federation, Conservation News, pp. 6-10, October 15 1979. (Embryonic mortality from oil on feathers of adults birds) ; Hartung, R. 1965. J Wildlife Management 29:872-874 (Oil on eggs reduces hatch ability by 68 percent); Libby, EE. 1978. Fish, wildlife and oil. Ecolibrium 2(4):7-10; King,
KA et al. 1979 Bull Environ Contam Tox 23:800-805 (Oil a probably cause of pelican mortality for six weeks after spill);Albers, PH. 1977. Fate and Effects of Petroleum Hydrocarbons in Marine Ecosystems, Pergamon Press, N.Y. (Chapters 15 & 16; Dieter, MP. 1977. Interagency Energy-Environment Research and Development Program Report, pp. 35-42 (5 microliters of oil on fertile egg kills 76 to 98 percent of embryos within; birds ingesting oil produce 70 percent to 100 percent less eggs than normal; offspring failed to develop normal flight feathers); Szaro, RC. 1977. Proc 42nd N Amer Wildlife Nat Resources Conference, pp. 375-376]

48. Lead has been associated with egg shell thinning. [Bellrose, RC. 1959. Ill Nat Hist Survey Bull 27:235-288 (Lead poisoning in wildlife)]

49. Mercury has been associated with egg shell thinning. [D’Itri, FM & PB Trost. 1970. International Conference on Mercury Contamination, Ann Arbor, September 30, 1070; Scott, JL et al. 1975. Effects of PCBs, DDT and mercury upon egg production, hatch ability and shell quality. Poultry Sci 54:3350-368; Stoewssand, GS et al.. 1971. Shell- thinning in quail fed mercuric
chloride. Science 173:1030-1031; Tucker, RK. 1971. Utah Science June 1971:47-49 (Effects of many chemicals on shell thickness).; Tucker, RK & HA Haegle. 1970. Bull Environ Contamin Toxicol 5:191-194]

50. Stress from noise, fear or excitement and disease are associated with egg shell thinning. [Scott, HM et al.. 1944. (Physiological stress thins shells) Poultry Science 23:446-453; Draper, MH & PE Lake. 1967. Effects of stress and defensive responses. In Environmental Control in Poultry Production, Oliver and Boyd, London; Reid, BL. 1971. (Effects of stress on laying birds) Farm Technology, Fall 1971; Sykes, AH. 1955 (Adrenaline excess inhibits shell formation) Poultry Science 34: 622-628]

51. Older birds produce thinner shells. [Sunde, ML. 1971 (Older birds produce thinner shells) Farm Technology, Fall 1971]

52. Normal egg shells become 5 percent thinner as developing embryos withdraw calcium for bone development. [Romanoff, AL and AJ Romanoff. 1967. Biochemistry of the Avian Embryo, Wiley & Sons, N.Y.; Simkiss, K. 1967. (Shells thinned by embryo development within) In Calcium in Reproductive Physiology, Reinhold, NY, pp 198-213]

53. Larger birds tend to produce thicker-shelled eggs. [Asmundson, VS et al. 1943. (Relations between the parts of birds’ eggs) Auk 60:34-44]

54. Dehydration is associated with thinner egg shells. [Tucker, RK and HA Haegle. 1970. (30 percent thinner shells formed after quail were kept from water for 36 hours) Bull Environ Contam Toxicol 5(3): 191-194]

55. Temperature extremes are associated with thinner egg shells. [Romanoff, AL and AJ Romanoff, 1949. The Avian Egg, Wiley & Sons]

56. Decreased illumination is associated with thinner egg shells. [Peakall, DB. 1970. (Shells not thinned even after illumination was abruptly reduced from 16 hours daily to 8 hours daily and high DDT dosage begun simultaneously) Science 168:592-594; Day, EJ. 1971. (Importance of even illumination on laying birds) Farm Technology, Fall 1971;Houser, EJ. 1962. Pacific
Poultryman, August 1962; Morris, TR et al. 1964. (The most critical area of light duration is that between 16 hours and 8 hours daily) British Poultry Science 5: 133-147; Ward, P. 1972 (Physiological importance of photo period in bird experiments) Ibis 114: 275]

57. Human and predator intrusion is associated with thinner egg shells. [Beatty, RG. 1973. The DDT Myth, John Day Co., N.Y. 201 pages; Anon. 1971. Hawk Chalk 10(3):47-57; Cade, TJ. 1960. Ecology of the peregrine and gyrfalcon populations in Alaska. Univ Calif Publ Zool 63(3): 151-290]

58. Simple restraint interferes with the transport of calcium throughout the body of birds, preventing adequate calcium from reaching the shell gland and forming
good shells. [Sykes, AH. 1955. Poultry Science 34:622-628]

59. Uncovering eggs after parent birds are removed or frightened off exposes eggs to potentially fatal chilling, especially in northern or high altitude locations. [Cade, TJ. 1960. Ecology of the peregrine and gyrfalcon populations in Alaska. Uni Calif Publ Zool 63(3):151-290]

60. Phosphorus deficiency is associated with thinner shells. [Crowley, TA et al. 1963. Poultry Science 54: 350-368]

61. Calcium deficiency is associated with thinner shells.[Greely, F.. 196 (Effects of calcium deficiency) J Wildlife Management 70:149-153; Romanoff, AL and AJ Romanoff. 1949. The Avian Egg, Wiley & Sons; Scott, ML. 1975. Poultry Science 54:350-368; Taylor, TG. 1970. How and eggshell is formed. Scientific American 222:89-95; Tucker, RK and HA Tucker. 1970. Bull Environ Contamin Toxicol 5(3):1191-194]

62. Egg shell deficiencies were attributed to DDT and DDE by U.S. Fish and Wildlife researchers even though the birds had been placed on low-calcium diets. [Bitman, J et al. 1969. Nature 224: 44-46; Bitman, J et al. 1970. Science 594-595.]

63. Cutting illumination from 16 hours daily to 8 hours daily at the same time as DDT feeding began had no significant adverse effect on shell quality. Shell quality was only adversely impacted after large amounts of DDE were injected into birds. [Peakall, DB. 1970. Science 168:592-594]

64. DDT was blamed for egg shell thinning even though a known egg shell thinner (dieldrin) was also added to the diet. [Porter, RD and SN Wiemeyer. 1969. Science 165: 199-200]

65. No significant correlation between DDE and egg shell thinning in Canadian terns even though the eggs contained as much as 100 parts per million of DDE. [Switzer, BG et al. 1971. Can J Zool 49:69-73]

VII. BALD EAGLES. DDT was blamed for the decline in the bald eagle population.

66. Bald eagles were reportedly threatened with extinction in 1921 — 25 years before widespread use of DDT. [Van Name, WG. 1921. Ecology 2:76]

67. Alaska paid over $100,000 in bounties for 115,000 bald eagles between 1917 and 1942. [Anon. Science News Letter, July 3, 1943]

68. The bald eagle had vanished from New England by 1937. [Bent, AC. 1937. Raptorial Birds of America. US National Museum Bull 167:321-349]

69. After 15 years of heavy and widespread usage of DDT, Audubon Society ornithologists counted 25 percent more eagles per observer in 1960 than during the pre-DDT 1941 bird census. [Marvin, PH. 1964 Birds on the rise. Bull Entomol Soc Amer 10(3):184-186; Wurster, CF. 1969 Congressional Record S4599, May 5, 1969; Anon. 1942. The 42nd Annual Christmas Bird Census. Audubon Magazine 44:1-75 (Jan/Feb 1942; Cruickshank, AD (Editor). 1961. The 61st Annual Christmas Bird Census. Audubon Field Notes 15(2):84-300; White-Stevens, R.. 1972. Statistical analyses of Audubon Christmas Bird censuses. Letter to New York Times, August 15, 1972]

70. No significant correlation between DDE residues and shell thickness was reported in a large series of bald eagle eggs. [Postupalsky, S. 1971. (DDE residues and shell thickness). Canadian Wildlife Service manuscript, April 8, 1971]

71. Thickness of eggshells from Florida, Maine and Wisconsin was found to not be correlated with DDT residues.


Data from Krantz, WC. 1970. Pesticides Monitoring Journal 4(3):136-140.

State

Thickness (mm)

DDE residue (ppm)

Florida0.50About 10
Maine0.53About 22
Wisconsin0.55About 4

72. U.S. Forest Service studies reported an increase in nesting bald eagle productivity (51 in 1964 to 107 in 1970). [U.S. Forest Service (Milwaukee, WI). 1970. Annual Report on Bald Eagle Status]

73. U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service biologists fed large doses of DDT to captive bald eagles for 112 days and concluded that “DDT residues encountered by eagles in the environment would not adversely affect eagles or their eggs.” [Stickel, L. 1966. Bald eagle-pesticide relationships. Trans 31st N Amer Wildlife Conference, pp.190-200]

74. Wildlife authorities attributed bald eagle population reductions to a “widespread loss of suitable habitat”, but noted that “illegal shooting continues to be the leading cause of direct mortality in both adult and immature bald eagles.” [Anon.. 1978. U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, Endangered Species Tech Bull 3:8-9]

75. Every bald eagle found dead in the U.S., between 1961-1977 (266 birds) was analyzed by U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service biologists who reported no adverse effects caused by DDT or its residues. [Reichel, WL. 1969. (Pesticide residues in 45 bald eagles found dead in the U.S. 1964-1965). Pesticides Monitoring J 3(3)142-144; Belisle, AA. 1972. (Pesticide residues and PCBs and mercury, in bald eagles found dead in the U.S. 1969-1970). Pesticides Monitoring J 6(3): 133-138; Cromartie, E. 1974. (Organochlorine pesticides and PCBs in 37 bald eagles found dead in the U.S. 1971-1972). Pesticides Monitoring J 9:11-14; Coon, NC. 1970. (Causes of bald eagle mortality in the US 1960-1065). Journal of Wildlife Diseases 6:72-76]

76. U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service biologists linked high intake of mercury from contaminated fish with eagle reproductive problems. [Spann, JW, RG Heath, JF Kreitzer, LN Locke. 1972. (Lethal and reproductive effects of mercury on birds) Science 175:328- 331]

77. Shooting, power line electrocution, collisions in flight and poisoning from eating ducks containing lead shot were ranked by the National Wildlife Federation as late as 1984 as the leading causes of eagle deaths. [Anon. 1984. National Wildlife Federation publication. (Eagle deaths)]"...

https://junkscience.com/1999/07/100-things-you-should-know-about-ddt/

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#18
In reply to #15

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/26/2019 11:01 PM

..."In 1970, the National Academy of Sciences wrote in a report that ''to only a few chemicals does man owe as great a debt as to DDT'' and credited the insecticide, perhaps with some exaggeration, with saving half a billion lives."...

https://www.nytimes.com/2004/04/11/magazine/what-the-world-needs-now-is-ddt.html

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#19
In reply to #10

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/27/2019 12:17 AM

That may be the most morally obnoxious question I have ever heard. You should be ashamed of yourself. In a separate reply, I will presently address some merits/demerits of the matter.

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#20
In reply to #19

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/27/2019 9:54 AM

I'll take that as a NO....

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#21

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/27/2019 5:54 PM

Vaccine derived polio is explained very clearly here:

https://www.who.int/features/qa/64/en/

VDP is where the attenuated virus is passed on to unvaccinated person(s) in the community due to poor sanitation. Neither the child who was immunized, nor the children who got it soon after, get sick. They get immunity.

Circulating vaccine-derived polio is the problem. When the vdp is passed around passively for a long period it can mutate and regain the ability to cause disease. Mass immunization would solve that problem, and it can also be used effectively to stop the C-vdp situation.

No one who gives polio vaccine to their child is ending up with a sick child. It's the ones who didn't get vaccinated who are at risk.

There is only one strain of polio left that hasn't been eradicated. Most of the C-vdp was associated with type 2, which has now been removed from the vaccine.

That being said, it would be much better to use the more expensive vaccine with dead virus, and avoid the risk of C-vdp altogether.

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#22
In reply to #21

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/27/2019 9:18 PM

Thanks for your good information. Your link is more than 2 years old. Here is some newer information with the breakdown by country:

polioeradication.org/polio-today/polio-now/this-week/

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#23
In reply to #10

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/27/2019 9:35 PM

".... Would you infect your family with live polio viruses? ...."

Do you mean 'Would you inoculate your family with the live polio virus vaccine?'

If that was your intent, perhaps making the question more realistic and letting you answer would shed some light.

In bulk, the killed virus vaccine is over 10 times more expensive than the live virus vaccine. The chance of an infection resulting from vaccination with the live virus vaccine is about 1 in 200,000.

Polio has been infecting kids in the surrounding towns. Times are hard but you want to vaccinate your children and the children of your close relatives who make up your town. With everyone pooling resources and leveragjng available assistance, you can afford to vaccinate all the children (everyone in your town is a close relative) in your town if you use the live virus vaccination that carries the 1 in 200,000 chance of leading to a polio infection, or you can afford to vaccinate just one tenth of the children in your town, which isn't enough to vaccinate just all of your own children. In fact it isn't enough to vaccinate all of your own kids even if you excluded your least favorite one. In this scenario you have several children that you are very fond of.

What do you do?

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#24
In reply to #20

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/27/2019 10:17 PM

Then you might be wrong.

I had intended to reply earlier, but I took some time out for a bit of research, where I found some of the same things mentioned in Artsmith's post, TINAC's post and even SG's most recent post.

Some other things, too. At one time the Salk vaccine was characterized as obsolete, but apparently it has regained favor in the US and maybe other countries that can afford it. Yet the Sabin vaccine, despite some greater risk, is still more commonly used where money is scarce.

As for my choice, I would compere the risk of getting polio from the live-virus vaccine versus the risk of getting it without vaccination. And then I might still go for the live virus version.

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#25
In reply to #24

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/28/2019 1:09 AM

Yes I was having a little fun with you there...I think we probably all have been given live viruses as a vaccine, and it worked because everybody was required to participate...Not treating everybody at the same time leaves the back door open...

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#26
In reply to #25

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/28/2019 1:45 AM

Nearly so, but not quite. In some cases it can be best to stop a bit short of vaccinating everybody. That is what could have been meritorious about this thread, except that it was couched in anti-vaxxer agitprop-speak.

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#27

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/28/2019 2:17 AM

That threat was always there, it happens...

the difference is, as the polio incidences begin to drop because of c

vaccines... the incidences where polio cases caused by vaccines (say per 100,000 as an example) remain the same. The only difference is polio vaccines prevented more possible causes.

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#28
In reply to #26

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/28/2019 2:40 AM

I don't see any anti-vaxxer presence here...perhaps you are imagining it...? ...as far as I can see here the problem is not with vaccination, it's with doing a half-ass job of it...

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#29
In reply to #28

Re: Vaccine Mania

11/28/2019 5:09 AM

Please don't be so blind. The very title of this thread, "Vaccine Mania", is pure anti-vax nonsense.

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