From Horses to Hybrids

http://www.worldcarfree.net/

in terms of its major application, maybe nothing can replace it?

Why assume the horse has had it? Windmills are back, ditto tidal energy and wind power for cargo ships. The horse, or better still, the pony, delivers clean, green power, and when harnessed to modern equipment it is modern.

only 1/4 of a horsepower, voice activated control system, predictive, intelligent suspension system, stainless steel and ABS plastic, solar powered, organic ATV. What more could you want.

Since IC engines are inherently polluting, require very refined fuels and most of them depend on oil-based fuels it is time to look at other methods and designs that could replace them easily until something even better could be devised.

I agree that electric motors are good, but when you try to make plug-in EVs that will perform like and be as convenient as IC autos you run into several problems. They become much more expensive. Recharge times are about 6 hrs on a 220 V outlet, if you can find one when and where needed. Using AC, heat, lights and power accessories can reduce the range. They are NOT zero pollution, the pollution is just moved to the electric generating plants.

Jeep has a prototype plug-in hybrid in which a small IC engine runs a generator to keep the batteries charged, allowing for unlimited range as long as there is fuel available. It would run as an EV for about 80% of ones driving, thus increasing the mpg of fuel use in total travel.

My disagreement is with the IC engine. A small steam engine would be more efficient, less polluting and use less highly refined and less expensive fuels from non-oil sources. For details of this concept e-mail beesidemeusa@yahoo.co.uk and ask about steam-electric hybrid. Could have them on the road within a 2-3 years if it was tried.

Horses are definitely not the solution to todays transportation problems.

Average 300 g of CO2 per km according to a german study I saw some time ago. They continue emitting CO2 even when not driving.

Too slow.

Not offering enough protection against impacts, rain, wind, cold, sunshine, exterior noise.

Need a lot of personel to clean the roads.

Things could get a little better if you use a horse as an engine in a vehicle. Not as simple device to tow a carriage. I mean by adapting power curves of horse and vehicle through a gearbox. It could increase speed of vehicle, add safety features such as good brakes and so on. Think of what man did on bicycles to adapt power curves. Then you open the clutch when horse goes mad. No problem. I guess it would be no problem to have it move the pedals.

Sometimes you have to think out of the box. It is a funny exercise.

Horses emit CO2 standing in fields or working. So why not get benefit from the CO2. Secondly the Carbon is all renewable supply, unless someone is drilling for grass, and I don't know about it. Plenty of applications involve low speeds and power sources, road sweepers, local deliveries, rubbish collection.

Rechargeable electric equipment never takes off because you need to carry the batteries to do the job, the batteries to get the batteries doing the job, to the job and more batteries to get the whole lot home. With horsepower, load on batteries to do job, mowing, hedgecutting whatever and when they run out pony walks home or to collect more batteries.

Pony power gives incredible traction, maximum torque from standstill and the ability to refuel for free. Horsepower/ponypower has a future if people will look. Cars wouldn't be as ubiquitous if everything had stopped with the model T.

You mention thinking outside the box, why put the pony in one. The external noise is produced by the vehicles you replace, and which cities do you drive in where the traffic goes much faster than a horse.

You say the horse is definitely not the solution as the starting point. Where is the literature, where is the research, I know they won't replace planes because they can't fly, they aren't as strong as trains, they aren't as fast, dirty, noisy polluting or dangerous as cars, but they beat most garden tractors hands down and give most ATV's a run for their money. And they aren't much cop as container ships. Before writing them off, try thinking what they might be good for.

Sorry to rant, but why are over a million horsepower standing round in fields doing nothing, when they could contribute. They would have more fun, and so would we.

Re your clutch for when the horse goes mad, I already have an instant cutoff system which makes it safe.

You emit CO2, about 2.5 lbs per day and even more when you think and talk and emit it even when you are sleeping. Fortunately the green leaves of plants take it out of the air.

Just think though, a horse needs no fuel, just food, and can get great mileage from that renewable food that is made using solar power. Most "Greenies" complain that we are always traveling too fast and need to slow down. As for protection from impacts, rain, wind, cold sunshine, environmental noise a horse is better than a moped, bicycle or motorcycle. Road cleaning would provide more jobs for the illegals plus excellent fertilizer for organic farming. A horse is self steering too, and can usually deliver the drunk safely home without accidents.

But we want to travel around rapidly, in a sealed box on wheels, as comfortable as our own home, unsafely guiding it ourselves and killing ourselves by the thousands. For this we give up the slow steady horse.

LOL ;) :p [horse laugh]

Taganan, looking at your biog I see you are into steam. I am looking at a linear motor for a finger bar mower, the old type mower like a hedgecutter. All the options seem to be a I/C motor producing rotation geared back to produce linear. A small efficient charcoal powered steam driven linear motor would give eco friendly, carbon neutral, quiet grass cutting. My pony thinks he has a better way, cut out all the machinery and let him eat the grass.

This is a serious application, look at all the municipal grass cutting done predominantly at around 4 mph, factor in all the horse owners whose paddocks need topping, ie mowing the bits the horse won't eat etc. What is the current horsepower per acre, and gallons of fuel per acre used in mowing grass. If we could make the whole project carbon neutral it would give a huge test bed for steam, and coincidentally for the system to tow the steam mower around.

If you are interested we could talk. Also just seen a steam generator, using water, methanol, hydrogen peroxide mix, no heat and a catalyst, hand held spray produces steam at 600C. Could this work to produce power?

Simon

saddlechariot - the last post was for laughs. Yes, I think a steam-electric hybrid would be environmentally better as an auto or lorry. About 80% of your driving is done within 25 mi of your home recharging station and it is not expensive to build an electric car for that. It's the other 20% that make electric cars too expensive and inconvenient. A hybrid, using an electric motor to turn the wheels, and a small, almost zero-pollution, efficient steam engine to generate power for the batteries is better and uses cheaper fuels.

Back when, actual horse power was used to drag steam and internal combustion engines around to where they were used. Steam is ideal for linear power, just use a double acting piston and connect the cutter bar to the piston rod. Spring load it so that when shut off it will not stop at the end of a stroke and it will always start again. A very small watertube boiler [they are the safest] would not have to make much pressure to operate the cutter bar, so an auto radiator could be used as a condenser. When drawn behind a horse a fan driven by a belt to the axle would cool the condenser. It would be hard to run on solid fuel though, because of difficulty in controlling the heat. But it would likely slice through anything that would fit between the teeth, lots of power.

The IC people are terminally and stubbornly ignorant of steam power and many are totally bigoted against it, dismissing it as old tech, dangerous and not worth considering as a power source. Check that e-mail site for more info.

Cool pony and cart.

Taganon,

If a bear can ride a bicycle then a horse could be trained to ride a four wheeler pedal car. It would be a lot safer then most trained bears also. A good and fun, for the inventor anyway, engineering project.

A modern, high efficiency steam car is on the way. There are two or three designs. Mine on the drafting boards and running small experiments and the Cyclone engine, which is better financed and proving to be very viable. Look for the Cyclone to be showing up at "Greenie meets" in the next year or so.

The old problems of steam engine efficiency are being solved. The Cyclone engine is tested at 23%, competitive with the gas engine. Mine, if I can get that far with limited budget and advancing years, will compete with the Diesel.

As you know, the driving characteristics of a steam engine car or truck are much like an electric motor. High torque from zero RPM. When the vehicle is stopped so is the engine. No need or benefit from hybridization. External combustion - cleanly burns most anything.

Check out the Steam Automobile Club of America website, discussion board for ongoing info, if you like. More real automotive steam knowledge to be found there then anywhere.

Best regards, --------- Bill G.

The Cyclone is one type I was looking at for use in a steam-electric hybrid for efficiency. Will discuss the idea by e-mail at - beesidemeusa@yahoo,co.uk

Re steam, have you seen Oxford Technology chemical steam, water, methanol, hydrogen peroxide mix poured through catalyst gives 1000C steam. If the catalyst isn't diamond impregnated platinum, it could be very impressive. http://www.oxfordcatalysts.com/technology/portable-steam.html should be the link. It appears you can have steam without startup time, boiler, whatever. Any comments from those who are more educated on steam technology.