Tesla Marketing Hype

Do we have to pull it backwards to windup it's rubber band?

https://insideevs.com/news/385198/video-tesla-cybertruck-race-porsche-911/

Hearkens to the days of comparing apples to oranges. (Nowadays its comparing Apples to Androids)!

I agree with Lyn, let's have a "do-over" with a Ford 4WD truck. Preferably, a Ford diesel powered truck. Diesel's make a ton of low end torque, like electric motors. Let's see what happens then. : )

C'mon you've got a 9 - 10k lb truck that runs a 10 sec 1/4 mi...and you think any ford or chevy truck can compete with that? HA! Maybe some big commercial hauler or something...

...but then let's see how that does against this...

wmerryall said it best.

Putting a 9-10K# electric 4WD up against a 6K# gas 2WD pickup is just a publicity stunt.

Just how practical is this electric monstrosity? It's just the next Hummer for people with more money than brains.

If you have a trailer to pull or a large boat, I don't think you would think this is a stunt...It's a demonstration of towing capacity...The fact that it has awesome speed, remarkable range, and is bulletproof, well these things are just icing on the cake....

"..It's a demonstration of towing capacity..." No, its a publicity stunt!

If they wanted to demonstrate towing capacity, they would have towed two identical trailers instead of hooking mismatched trucks together.

Apples to apples.

And, the last time I drove to the store, awesome speed and being bulletproof were not major concerns. Maybe in Florida, where you live, they are.

Range is questionable, depending on many things. You have to be able to plug it in to an outlet once the batteries run low. I can carry an extra gas can or two if I'm in the Arizona desert.

Maybe so, but I think it's funny....Out in the desert you'd probably be better off with a dune buggy....

https://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/g2504/15-indestructible-vehicles-for-surviving-a-desert-drive/

OK here's a 600hp F-150 4x4 against a tesla model X P-100D....

https://twitter.com/i/status/1204858623576248320

Awesome range if empty?

..."Average Cost Increase Of Towing

A truck that normally gets 15 miles per gallon, but only gets 8 miles per gallon while towing will consume an additional 17.5 gallons of fuel for a 300-mile round-trip. If fuel prices are $2.50 a gallon, they’ll end up spending an additional $43.50.

Dec 7, 2018"...

https://www.godownsize.com/pulling-camper-trailer-gas-mileage/

Tortoise and hare.

I'd like to see how it held up against an old VW bus in a cannonball run.

The whole electric range thing to me seems comparable to having a 2 seater sports car and having passenger anxiety or having a motorcycle and having Winter anxiety. Or having a screened in porch and having 3 seasons anxiety. Probably best to consult your physician before getting a Tesla Truck.

Physician or a psychologist.

I can tell you for a fact that "range anxiety" is a contrivance of the oil companies based on Americans misunderstanding of electric cars because until Tesla, we didn't have any actual electric cars, we had compliance cars designed to comply with CAFE standards. A disadvantage they don't have in Europe or China where the transition to electric is well received and well underway and the price of gas is not subsidized.

Our road trip to Yellowstone, Grand Tetons, Mt. Rushmore, Crazy Horse monument, Wounded knee memorial and a full trip through the Badlands was a breeze and we even missed a planned charging stop in Gardiner MT. before hitting the Beartooth highway. No problem.

All you need to do is look at these locations on a map and the Tesla Superchargers to see that we were never really close to them or in any danger of running out of power. We even made the one "Full Pull" a long range run from 100%. 320 miles. 85mph, 40mph head wind, pulled into Rapid City Supercharger with 3% on the dial and no warnings from the car that we needed to slow down or change route. That is manufactured confidence not anxiety.

Unlike a gas car where you really have no idea how far you can go and that gauge is not always accurate. Now that's cause for anxiety. Knowing exactly how far I can go is the opposite.

This serves me well. There was a similar one in the old Durango.

I'm not saying it can't be done. I've looked at the charging network and rural America is undeserved. The places I'd have to stop to make these trips aren't places I would have stopped at otherwise.. and certainly not for an hour or more.

In my area.. of Chicago. a pretty big city. I'm miles away from any super charger.

I can see how it would work for some people and some businesses, but it's not ready for a takeover just yet.

I'm more of a goat hauling budget minded consumer. (except he wants low range and now)

Like the French Professor. (caution.. he's a bit of a nut)

I can see where this is going.

https://thedriven.io/2018/12/14/diesel-charge-evs-remote-locations-greener-than-you-think/

We will get there in the end.

I cant see EV's taking off in Europe yet. Not the same way it does in China anyway.

Unbeknownest to us Americans, Europe has lots of electric cars and well established charging networks besides Teslas.

https://www.theaa.com/european-breakdown-cover/driving-in-europe/charging-around-europe-in-an-electric-vehicle

They have been using electrics for years for many of the reasons you site above, just the opposite. Small compact countries with highly developed infrastructure which is not something that can be said about America. Especially west of the Mississippi.

As for diesel generated electric power, might be a reason behind these.

One thing I can tell you, after the 320 mile run I had to pee like never before. I'll never do that again, but it was fun to see just how accurate the mileage estimates really are. I am sure without the headwind I would have gone a bit farther.

What we learned is that stopping to go to the bathroom, leg stretches and snacks usually take about twenty minutes with the battery at temperature and in the prime range 20-80%. Twenty minutes on the charger and we are good for another 150 miles or more depending on how many other Teslas are on the system as some of the older chargers split power between two cars and the newer ones don't.

This is far faster than running it all the way down and then charging it all the way up. That's gas thinking.

The point being, you don't notice it unless you are 'that guy' who never stops until its critical, never turns around, never admits when lost. The American male driver stereotype.

My wife was a little concerned when we headed out to Wounded Knee and the Badlands. That part of South Dakota looks like a whole lot of nothing on the map and it's even more nothing in person. But no problem. Pulled into the hotel that night with 6% in the pack and superchargers in the parking lot.

Easy peasy.

Stereotypes aside. Some people just don't get lost. The wandering is half the point of the journey.

Being away from the grid and setting up for the night wherever the road takes you is a lost pastime. A dead end on a mountain pass is the perfect time to open the cooler and start a fire.

This style of travel is not for everyone. I like hotels too. But the real treat for me is being able to skip on them.

...and really. Who stops to ask for directions anymore?

I keep a good compas at hand, just in case it's cloudy.

Norway has the highest share on electric vehicles.

But it still remains a rarity in Europe with Germany no higher registration rates of EV's than 2%. This includes subsidies there and in Europe in general.

I dont think there is a high need nor a big run for them yet, that's besides the charging infrastructure that has been put in.

If you look at California, they still beat any other country by length.

But my point was another one.

The use of Diesel for power generation for a EV charger is just a funny blooper on the side.

The text book definition of counterintuitive. Yet Railroads do it eveyday.

Trains use diesel to charge batteries?

No, they use diesel engines to turn generators that in turn power the traction motors on each axle. Both AC and DC are used depending on the line and duty.

There have been battery electric power motors for over a century on electified roads, especially in Europe. Notably the Milwaukee road in America until it was bought by the UP.

They called them Little Joes. They were beasts. They carried batteries so they could make turns on the unelectrified sections and were charge directly from the cantenary.

Here in America they are making a come back but were used by many class 1 roads for years.

Here's an old yard pup in the old Chessie livery

And here is a new BE road switcher.

easy to spot, no fuel tanks, no stacks.

A lot of industrial applications call for battery electric switchers. Large chemical plants, grain elevator complexes. any place where spark ignition danger exists.

Over enthusiastic Sales people.

Everyone does that comparison, its almost required. Now the reality of it was poorly thought out. Comparing anything electric to an ICE of any kind is pointless. The characteristics of torque, which is what pulls from a dead stop, give the electric an unfair advantage. Period.

If you are going to use the fact that it is unlike ANYTHING out there as the cornerstone of your marketing campaign, then stay on that track and leave the ICE for chilling the beer in those cool Side pillar boxes. :-).

Ford is working on North America's Largest Charging Network to support their efforts in marketing electric vehicles. The true test is one of time, not an unfair comparison of two vehicles. As I said to someone recently, "five years from now, which of the two companies is most likely to still be around?"

Look up Electrify America, that's VW's supercharger network being built across the country. We have one here in Madison. It is capable of delivering 350kw which the Model 3 is built for. It will take me from 20% to 80% in under ten minutes. Not even time enough to pick up a prescription. From 0 it would take 30 minutes or less to hit 100%.

Disclaimer: Repeated Supercharging is hard on your batteries. It should never be relied on for daily charging.

VW started running EV commercials two years ago. Even though they did not have an EV in America. They have announced the end to ICE development in all forms and will bring their biggest factory on line next year in China. A full EV plant. They are building their own battery facilities in Norway I think and plan to have the European EV plant open in 2021 and the US plant open in 2024. Other Major players have also made this commitment. It is just the US and Japanese makers (and our public in general) that are 10 years behind.

I have no doubt America could lead in this if we wanted to. in fact we do, in the case of Tesla.

We can't support to many 350kw chargers.. they will work for the municipality.

Total cost of ownership est Ford F-150 vs, Tesla Truck...

..."Overall, Sullins estimated that the total cost of ownership for a Ford F-150 in CA would be around $72,459 over five years, while one in TX stands at about $65,467. Thanks to low charging and maintenance costs, the Cybertruck would likely have a TCO of $53,379 in CA and $46,610 in TX, respectively. That’s a difference of $19,080 and $18,858 over the course of five years. Of course, if a Tesla owner charges the Cybertruck through solar panels, then the TCO of the all-electric vehicle will be even lower. "...

https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-cybertruck-vs-ford-f-150-tco-comparison-video/

"Of course, if a Tesla owner charges the Cybertruck through solar panels, then the TCO of the all-electric vehicle will be even lower. "...

No...in fact then you need to include the cost of the solar panel charging system, $20k...there goes any savings...That's if you have the space...if you have to include the cost of land space for a solar panel installation, then the price could go much higher...In fact that would be a much fairer comparison, you can't assume everybody has a proper location for mounting a solar panel array...

At the end of the day, it is all about infrastructure and avoiding the possibility of a "walk home failure", the phrase in powertrain development that strikes fear in any engineer ( I was one).

I can remember being in advance powertrain discussions about using advanced engine technology for new engines or old, proven technology. The argument that kept coming up was if your wife and children were driving through a "bad" area of the city, which one do you want them using.

There was a large push to use natural gas for Class 8 trucks and even a push to install LNG filling stations across the US main expressways. This didn't work because of the range concerns.

If there can be enough "filling stations" of any powertrain device (electric, gas, natural gas, hydrogen, M&M's) it will have a good chance of gaining public acceptance, keeping in mind there is a "critical mass" of vehicle structures that need to be build to be cost effective.

1/2 mile lines for Tesla charging reported in California..

That's a serious problem.

Maybe they can daisy chain them and all will charge at the same time?

Its a bit of a challenge. Tesla is deploying Semi Trailer mounted 'MegaPacks' with chargers to many of these bottleneck chargers. The problem is economy. if everyone hits the charger at the same time its a problem but if they stagger drive times its not.

This was something we learnbed running into folks traveling home from the Sound of Silence rally. Since the South Dakota superchargers coming from the east are not plentiful and several are still 120kw. When the rally was breaking up they had a meeting to schedule departures so that no one would have to wait at a charger. This seemed to work well for the folks traveling with us in I90. We ran in to them at all stops.

Only place we waited for a whole 10 minutes was Rapid City which had one charger down. Otherwise it would have been no delays.

The folks attending the rally figured this out all on their own. People are very predictable. When leaving on a road trip we all tend to depart in the same 3 hour window. This makes for lots of demand for very short periods of time. Not really worth building out infrastructure for. Like so much else with electric cars, it really is a paradigm shift, not just buying a car. You think differently.

We all remember the gas lines of the 70's, I guess it will be the same for electric cars in the 20's....no thanks!

The ICE war has begun....

https://ww.electrek.co/2019/12/11/tesla-electric-cars-block-gas-station-protest/

I saw this setup last week. Had a good laugh and went around the block to take a picture.

That's a lot of real estate for that setup.

Maybe there's a Tesla in the garage?

It also looks to be mounted under the electric lines, a violation of right-of-way restrictions I would think...

Give it time. We are only seriously researching this technology now. Once we got solar Panels to the point where they powered spacecraft we stopped seriously funded R&D on them.

Same thing happened to battery research once the Navy went Nuke.