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Torque Required at Pinch Roll to Flatten Wire Rod

07/15/2009 2:08 PM

I'm working as a mechanical design intern at a rolling mill and have been asked to design a roll turning device for the finish stands. The purpose of this device is to be able to set the roll gap in the roll shop instead of out in the mill after the rolls have been changed out. The way the roll gap is set, initially, is by taking a 0.25" piece of aluminum wire (round), and in some instances a 0.375" piece of steel wire (round), and running it through the pinch rolls and then measuring the flattened wire. The wire rod is effectively used as plastigage and is run through the pinch rolls on the shoulder at a relatively slow speed. They just jog the stand in order to hand feed this piece of wire through.

I need to calculate the necessary torque to be applied at the rolls in order to successfully crush this material. I know there are standard fomulas for this as this is one of the basic (relative term here) rolling calculations considered when designing or setting up a stand for rolling a given material.

The rolls are turning on what can be considered frictionless bearings since there is very little resistance here and the amount the test wie is crushed is as follows:

0.25" aluminum flattened to 0.025" 90% reduction

0.375" steel flattend to 0.200" ~46.6% reduction

I need formulas including and relating reduction in area, separtion forces, as well as the mechanical properties of the material being crushed. I think. Thats why I'm asking. I'm a student of Mechanical Design/Engineering and do not have textbooks (yet) that cover this topic. Any help on this would be greatly appreciated and please let me know if any of this is unclear or you would like additional info.

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#1

Re: Torque Required at Pinch Roll to Flatten Wire Rod

07/16/2009 12:43 AM

1) is torque really what you want to know? or roll separation force? or horsepower?

2) Do you have access to your school library? try to find this paper
Schultz et al.: Determination of a Mathematical Model for Rolling Mill, Iron and Steel Eng., May 1965, p. 127/133. .

If you want to use torque as your solved for variable, you will probably find the lever arm calculation method most easy to use. See 10-3 here

LEVERARM

from: Coldrollingbook

milo

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#4
In reply to #1

Re: Torque Required at Pinch Roll to Flatten Wire Rod

07/16/2009 12:10 PM

Thanks Milo. Torque is what I'm really after here and it looks like that formula will give me what I need. The only varialble I don't have at this point is the rolling force but I'll do some digging and see if I can't come up with it. I referenced the "cold rolling handbook" half a dozen times yesterday (online) but didn't run across the lever arm method. Thanks again.

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#2

Re: Torque Required at Pinch Roll to Flatten Wire Rod

07/16/2009 6:33 AM

I have presently in front of me answers to the three questions asked, no textbooks used, time elapsed about three minutes nine seconds.

Unclear is what's keeping you student of Mechanical Design/Engineering from researching on your own?

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#3
In reply to #2

Re: Torque Required at Pinch Roll to Flatten Wire Rod

07/16/2009 12:05 PM

Congratulations bwire I'm impressed. I have been doing research and still haven't come up with what I need although I am getting closer. Forums like this, usually, are a good place to get additional perspective when you can't come up with what you need on your own. Again, providing you've arrived at the correct answer, I'm impressed.

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#5
In reply to #3

Re: Torque Required at Pinch Roll to Flatten Wire Rod

07/16/2009 1:05 PM

What is the pressure increase before rolling at the cap end of the actuator and as the roll is flattening the wire?

Are all the rolls driven?

Is the roll diameter about six inches?

Is there a radial groove cut and in which roll?

Is it a two, three or four roll machine? What exactly is the method of driving this roll, what type of motor or configuration of motors?

I'm thinking we used a linear actuator to manage attenuation and repeatability.

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#8
In reply to #5

Re: Torque Required at Pinch Roll to Flatten Wire Rod

07/16/2009 9:52 PM

I initially thought that this was a wire rolling machine, but a careful reading of the original post convinced me that what they are trying to do is develop a proxy means of setting rolls. and do that they are using a scacrificaial wire whose deformation will be the measureable...

He desn't know the pressure increase.

I don;t think that his off line roll setting method is "driven" in the same sense as if they were back in the mill.

I may be off base , but Thats what I inferred from the material given in the original post.

milo

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#9
In reply to #8

Re: Torque Required at Pinch Roll to Flatten Wire Rod

07/17/2009 2:26 AM

Milo, you are 100% correct! This "roll turning device" will be used in the roll shop, not the mill, and it is up to me to figure out how to power and configure this thing. I will most likely be using a hydraulic or electric motor coupled to a speed reducer to get the required torque multiplication. If 360 degrees of roll rotation isn't necessary (this is still up for discussion) for this application I may use a hydraulic cylinder, actuating a torque arm that is attached to one of the roll spindles. Getting the required torque (not sure what this value is yet) via this method shouldn't be much of a problem but again, it's up for discussion.

There are only two rolls on these stands and they are mounted horizontally, one above the other and are parallel. The roll diameters on this particular stand range from 270mm (10.6") to 350mm (13.78"). The sacrificial wire is fed through the rolls on the shoulder which are smooth. I think at this point the critical value I need to find is the opposing tangential force at the rolls due to the wire being fed through the rolls. Then it's a simple matter of multiplying this force by the roll radius which will give me the torque. I have yet to come up with a mathematical way to achieve this.

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#10
In reply to #8

Re: Torque Required at Pinch Roll to Flatten Wire Rod

07/18/2009 5:22 AM

I didn't think he was looking and tried answering his thoughts with questions or put a little spin on it

The question could be answered with pressure gradient tables in the pump description; I think I think...

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#6
In reply to #2

Re: Torque Required at Pinch Roll to Flatten Wire Rod

07/16/2009 2:04 PM

gee what are you going to do for the remaining 23 hrs, 56min, 51 sec to make yourself feel superior.

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#7
In reply to #6

Re: Torque Required at Pinch Roll to Flatten Wire Rod

07/16/2009 3:21 PM
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