Magnetic Fields

Can you make a sketch? Or describe this more clearly, please?

I will try to explain what Iam trying to accomplish.A windmill can only convert at its best 57 % of the potential energy from the wind even G.E. 's windmills operate in the 32 to 38 percential.My ten ft mill is operating at about 20% which I understand to be not to bad.But still leaves about 38% of potential energy not being converted.what I am trying to do is to incease the efficeincy of my mill.My plan is to connect another single rotor w/a diameter of about 5" w/mags around the circumfrence of the rotor of the same strength that are in my dual axial flux alternator.These mags are n 50 1'x2'x1/2 pollarity on the larger 1x2 faces.My idea is to have these mags installed on the additionall rotor so north is facing out on all of the mags. and placing that single mag that I spoke of in my earlier post stationary to reppel the mags on the rotor knowing full well that the field lines are arcs and would reppel the mag on the rotor before it got to a point of reppeling the mags in one direction. this is why the ? of incasing the one side of the stationary mag in steel like explained and the ? about directing the field lines of mag.I believe that if I can block the field lines of the staitonary mag that would see the in coming mag on the rotor and by using steel I am attracting that in coming mag to a point were hope fully I have crossed the bouble lets say bringing it to a point were my stationary mag will reppell it.I guess i am trying to trick the field lines .I feel if I can do this,that repelsion will help push my rotor along and counter act maybe just by a small percentage the reluctance in my alltenator possibly increasing the torque or helping my mill do its work there by increasing its efficeincy. I hope that this draws a better picture for you Thanks again in advance for any in put.

It does help to know what you are trying to do! I'd have to read your last post several times in order to follow your thought process...

In general, commercial alternators of appropriate size, connected with appropriate gearing/pulleys/etc. are going to be more efficient than anything home brew. Please prove me wrong! Adding additional magnets will increase eddy current losses in the rotating parts, and increase the startup torque required.

The places where you are more likely to improve efficiency are in reducing friction and improving the aerodynamics of the blades. If it is a horizontal axis mill, improving the aiming mechanism will increase efficiency, especially at low wind speeds.

maybe I am not understanding your answer but the other rotor or additional rotor will not see any wire or coils. The thought is to add this additinal rotor in the way I described to maybe combat the eddie currents and resistance in the stator, of the pmg that are caused by the electro magnetic field opposing the magnetic field that is producing the electricity.I learned every thing I know about windmills at fieldlines and otherpower and maybe I missed something I thought eddie currents come in to play in the altenator when it is making the electricity.I didnt know that that mags on a disk going past another stationary mag repelling them would also cause eddie currents in the mags I thuoght I may have a problem with harmonics in the altenator or possibly cause some cogging.And mag degradation in the repelling mags.Iam not trying to prove any body wrong just trying to ask some of the brightest some question. thank you (an open mind need not think out side the box it has no boundries)

Most of us here don't speak "texting". When asking for our help it would be good to use sentences.

Is this a homework question? If not, please give us an idea of what you are doing.

Agreed!

Also to johnnyb5: Create your text in a word processing program, and run both spell check and grammar check before copying the text and pasting it into CR4. That way you could find out that 'steal' is a verb, meaning practically the same as 'rob'. I'm sure you meant 'steel', which is a noun, referring to alloys of iron.

i am very sorry about my spelling grammar and punctuation my computer skills are lacking also family issues quit school went to work at very young age, i do appreciate your patience I am a Bailbonds man and steal always looks the same to me.I'll try to draw a better picture. i know that when i have my 1x2 x1/2 " mag on a piece of steel 3/8' thick the field lines do not go thru it or lets say it has little or no attraction on the backside of the plate.possibly more strength on the mag side. if i weld a 90 w/2 pieces of stock and put the mag in the corner of the 90,leaving a 1/2" reveal around the mag so that u can measure a half overhang of steel all the way around the mag thats in the 90 would it make the field lines point out ward of the 90 more? Or would the steal at least block the fieldlines from going thru it thereby directing it some what. thank you in advance always trying to learn even if behind the curve the internet is the greatest tool in my box!

First, you are to be commended for attempting to learn in spite of past limitations!

Steel and steal do sound the same, but if they look the same, then you need to be more observant.

If I understand correctly, here is roughly what would happen to the magnetic fields:

As palinurus indicated, the strength of the local fields will depend on the gap(s) where the fields must pass through air. If you are trying to produce a concentrated (stronger) field, then you need to add a third piece of steel on the right (so you have a 'U' instead of an 'L'), and shorten the top piece so the gap between the magnet and the right side steel is just barely big enough to allow entry of whatever (coil?) you want to have in the magnetic field.

All of this can be observed quite easily with iron filings. Place your magnet in a plastic bag before bringing the filings nearby, so you don't get the filings directly on the magnet, and will be able to remove them easily afterwards. If you don't have one yourself, find a friend who has an electric grinder. With your magnet in the plastic bag, you can easily collect enough filings to do the job. Experiment!

The magnetic circuit (field lines) would not change drastically with or without the arrangement. The field strength however may be increased somewhat. It would depend on where and how large the air gaps.

I'm not sure I totally understand what you are trying to do, but I hope this can help.

The strongest attraction forces of magnets are at their North or South pole faces. The attraction force in air decreases in strength proportional to the square of the distance from the pole (pretty quickly). When you place it on the surface of a magnetic steel part, the field will tend concentrate in the steel because it is a lower reluctance path than air (or any other non-magnetic material).

If the area of the steel part is smaller than the pole face, it will concentrate the field and create a stronger attraction. If the area is larger it will try to disperse the field over the larger area, but the attraction force per area will be reduced.

There are many creative structures that can either disperse or concentrate the magnetic field. We can give you some suggestions if you can describe or show what you are trying to accomplish.