Fire Hose Rupture

Can you match the cut hose to any part of the monitor ?

given one end of the hose is attached to the monitor, strech pipe back to give an idea of where on the monitor it could have been and look to se if frame could have cut it.

the monitor frame would of course have to be heavy enough to flatten a prsurised hose.

You should be able to tell by close examination of the damage ie if cut with a kno=ife i assume you would see a nice clean cut with smooth surfaces on both sides .

but if crushed through it will be not so smooth on the sides.

When you say monitor, I think of this type of thing:

The trolley would have to be pretty substantial to withstand the reactive force of the water streaming out. This trolley... is it on rails? Even if no, how possible is it the trolley ran over the hose? I would think you had considered that, and I would think it difficult for this to happen, but... ya never know unless you ask.

I am not sure how to give you a photo of your broken hose.

thats true it could be just the force of the water newtons law and all that stuff

In principle, I believe that a well trained open minded forensic analysis can determine if this specific break was the the cause or an effect of this failure. But the subtle details required to be noticed to determine which will not be easily converted to text for us to assist. To do a proper investigation you will have to have somebody on site and a lot of carefully documented information on the undisturbed scene. At least that's what they portray on CSI. Maybe you could hire Gil Grissom and solve your mystery within the hour of programming.

if you take some pictures of the monitor on its carriage.

picture of the damage. load it onto your computer copy the photos and paste them onto the question/answer area and we might only might be in a better position to answer.

Chafe damage

Photos of hoses etc pick some that look like yours

http://www.google.co.uk/images?um=1&hl=en&rls=com.microsoft:en-gb:IE-SearchBox&tbs=isch:1&q=photos+of+damaged+fire+hoses&sa=N&start=162&ndsp=18

fire monitors

http://www.google.co.uk/images?q=fire+monitors&rls=com.microsoft:en-gb:IE-SearchBox&oe=&redir_esc=&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=univ&ei=kuHZS67hCZv40wSjtf1T&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=4&ved=0CCcQsAQwAw

http://www.firepromonitors.com/

There ya go, peter... fire fighting equipment. Had not thought of that. Duuuuh... just looked again at the thread title

The pictures from the website you link to do not copy over very well... might be copyrighted anyway. There are water monitors mounted on trailers used for fire suppression. This would go with our Dubaian poster's incomplete description of the issue.

Until we hear back, nothing to do. redfred is right, though (as is his custom)... there is little constructive advice we will be able to offer anyway. This may be in litigation, for all we know. If it is, I want nothing to do with it. Why, I wasn't even here. Doorman who? What the heck is CR4?

yes very true what we would see as a cut may not be seen as a cut by the inexprienced eye.

just one last link that might help him/her work out the reaction force that may of caused the problem

http://www.firetactics.com/NOZZLE-REACTION.htm

Back when I was a member of a local Bush Fire Brigade, we would regularly inspect and pressure test our hoses. The common place for the hoses to fail was on the crease as even though the canvas hoses were always rolled up, they could still suffer injury on the crease.

The first part of the inspection was to check for any abrasions on the crease caused by mis(lazy)handling of the hoses. We were always conscious of the need to carry rather than dragging the hoses.

We had a rather meaty PTO pump on our Studebaker 6x6 Back Filler Tanker that could provide sufficient pressure/volume to rupture even new hoses(though not at normal operating range). It was this that we used to pressure test the hoses with an appropriate proceedure.

Hoses that failed were repaired and retested. If they failed again they were condemned. Something that we were loath to do as every piece of equipment was hard fought for.

As for the OP's question, how old was the hose? how long had it been in operation? does the cut have a reference to any part of the frame/trolley? Is the hose that failed actually up to the manufacturers/regulators specification or is it counterfeit?

Photos of the rig and the failed hose would be nice.

You are right on the money there. If it is "fire" hose it is tested as fire hose. Like you said, a preliminary inspection for cuts, abrasions, or any other visible damage.If there are no marks next to the couplings, new ones are drawn. ( To see if the hose pulls away from the end coupling when under pressure.) Then pressurized to the manufacturer's specifications, for prescribed time. Any hose that fails is no longer "fire" hose. If the leak is small and near an end, we will have a professional hose company repair it, and have them retest it. When hose is returned, we retest it again ourselves.

So, when was the hose last tested, and to what pressure? What pressure was the monitor being used at?

I have been in the fire service maintenance business for 30 years now. I have seen monitors on the ground, mounted on trucks, ladders, trailers, boats, fire hydrants, tanks and buildings, but never seen or heard of mounting a monitor on rails. Reaction force with high flow- pressure monitors are substantial. I regularly have trucks back up from reaction forces if left without the brakes applied while using roof monitors (turrets). Something just does not sound right here.

I have been in the antique fire apparatus hobby many years, and also have not seen a monitor on a trolley or rails or whatever it is on. We need a better description.

A hose butt or nozzle that is dropped (not anchored/ tied down) can flop around pretty violently. Did this trolley (or whatever) come loose from its moorings?

The reaction force of a hose stream is very substantial, as has been said. I saw a video several months ago of someone supported above a lake only by the reaction of a hose stream which was supplied by a floating pump towed behind it. (Sort of like the personal jet engines that have been experimented with.)

My brain is calibrated in pounds per square inch (psi), not bars. How much is that--ballpark 135 psi?

Is the "cut" parallel or perpendicular to the hose length? How smooth/straight? Is the outside fabric frayed or cut cleanly? Bulges?

Pictures?

How many gallons per minute were you pumping?

How much did/does the trolley weigh?

Are you (is your company) an "end user" or a manufacturer/designer of the equipment?

What type of hose was it....????

We tested our fire hose yearly to make sure it didn't fail on the fire ground. All our hoses 45mm, 65mm, 100mm were tested at 300psi or 20.5 bar. Our normal operating pressure ranged from 60 psi to approx 130 psi on the fire ground. Our older hoses were (cotton jacket ,rubber lined) and the newer hoses were all rubber.

I suggest you check and make sure your hose is of proper type and being tested regularly. Bursting at only 135 psi is not a good sign for a proper Fire Hose if that is indeed what failed during your test.