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Power-User

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Eliminating Motor Shaft Currents through Tachometer & Encoder

05/21/2011 1:12 AM

For VFDs reducing the bearing currents for motor shaft the following method are in use.

1. Insulated Bearings

2. Ceramic Bearing

3. Grounding Brush

4. Shaft Grounding Ring

To eliminate motor shaft current can we also use a tachometer and encoder for this purpose.

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Anonymous Poster #1
#1

Re: Eliminating Motor Shaft Currents through Tachometer & Encoder

05/21/2011 8:12 AM

You can also use a lawn mower or a toaster with not much different effect on reducing your bearing current S.M.

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Guru
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#2

Re: Eliminating Motor Shaft Currents through Tachometer & Encoder

05/21/2011 8:47 AM

I can't even imagine why you would even consider an encoder for earthing?

Why are bearing currents a problem in the first place?

The mind just boggles!

But I do like the idea of a lawn mower running against the shaft

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Guru
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#3
In reply to #2

Re: Eliminating Motor Shaft Currents through Tachometer & Encoder

05/21/2011 12:40 PM

Tony,

Higher than normal bearing currents are an issue in many VFD applications because the high peak and rapid rise of the PWM pulses causes higher capacitively coupled voltage to be induced on the rotor core which it is high enough to flow across many systems normally considered non-conductive. They then flow through the bearings to ground and because the bearings are moving, it ends up acting like an EDM and causes fluting of the bearing races, which eventually destroys the bearings.

But using an encoder as a discharge route? My mind boggles on that one as well! Unless someone is marketing a grounding encoder perhaps?

salahuddin zia,

Insulated (and ceramic) bearings are a solution for normal shaft currents, but are generally considered insufficient for the higher VFD induced shaft currents because if left isolated, they build up and eventually discharge somewhere anyway. This is a very good paper on the subject.

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#4
In reply to #3

Re: Eliminating Motor Shaft Currents through Tachometer & Encoder

05/21/2011 3:21 PM

JRaef, I have worked on insulated bearings and seen them fail for silly reasons. So I do know why they are there.

One silly reason was someone innocently leaving a crowbar leaning against an insulated pedestal.

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#5
In reply to #3

Re: Eliminating Motor Shaft Currents through Tachometer & Encoder

05/22/2011 12:18 AM

Thanks for your reply.i had already gone through the link you have passed on regarding baldore -inverter driven induction motors shaft and bearing current solutons.but recently i came across a paper ------------eliminating damage from motor shaft currents through tachometers and encoders. by brain w.winter of avtron manufacturing inc.i am reproducing his introduction para below.

since the introduction of variable speed electronic controls for dc and ac motors users have noted a troubling problem, voltage potential is sometimes induced on the shafts of the motor.the resulting current can discharge through gearbox bearings,through motor bearings or through the encoder or tachometer attached to the motor.this discharge causes the premature failure of motor bearings and /or encoder bearings.

kindly guide me thanks

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Anonymous Poster #1
#6
In reply to #5

Re: Eliminating Motor Shaft Currents through Tachometer & Encoder

05/22/2011 12:48 AM

This just means that tachometers and encoders CAN be damaged too. Nothing else. S.M.

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Guru

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#11
In reply to #5

Re: Eliminating Motor Shaft Currents through Tachometer & Encoder

05/26/2011 8:25 AM

The author only has cautioned that shaft currents might find a path thro the tachometer / encoder. That definitely does not mean that they are used for routing the shaft currents.

I think you need be tuited on English more than on electricity.

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Guru

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#7

Re: Eliminating Motor Shaft Currents through Tachometer & Encoder

05/22/2011 5:07 AM

The most effective way of reducing these effects is to filter out the transients before they get to the motor. A sine wave filter, or isolating transformer are the preferred methods. These also allow the motor to be positioned further from the VFD and also generate less interference along the wiring.

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Guru

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#8

Re: Eliminating Motor Shaft Currents through Tachometer & Encoder

05/22/2011 11:59 AM

Baldor / Reliance / ABB / Avtron have it right. They are not in collusion with each other.

I have seen instances with VFD's that used insulated bearings and then a tachometer was added with a conductive coupling. The result was damage to the tachometer bearings due to the electrical discharge now occurring through the tachometer bearing. The solution was to use an insulated coupling, so the shaft potential no longer discharged through the tachometer bearing.

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Power-User

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#9
In reply to #8

Re: Eliminating Motor Shaft Currents through Tachometer & Encoder

05/22/2011 10:57 PM

thanks for the reply.Still request all the forum members to let me know is encoder / tachometer used for eliminating shaft current.or these are now obselete methods.your reply will be highly appreciated

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Guru

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#10
In reply to #9

Re: Eliminating Motor Shaft Currents through Tachometer & Encoder

05/22/2011 11:01 PM

NEVER USE an encoder or tachometer as a means to discharge shaft currents. It takes the bearing right out of the device.

Protect your instruments, don't abuse them!

Plain enough?

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Users who posted comments:

Anonymous Poster (2); electricalexpert65 (1); GM1964 (1); GW (2); JRaef (1); salahuddin zia (2); TonyS (2)

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