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Battery Charging

09/21/2016 12:11 AM

I ran across a solar charging application that wasn't set up as would normally be and i noticed something odd. This setup has a TriStar 60 MPPT charge controller taking power from two series solar panels for 40 volts output charging two 12 volt batteries in series. the unit properly charges these batteries. The load on the batteries is around .75A

Then there is a system that comes on which has AC power and powers a 24v supply at 5 A. this power supply is switched onto the charge controller input and the solar panels are removed. So a 24v supply is fed into the array input of the charge controller. The output from the controller now is 22.6v. The AC stays on and the 24v supply continues to run but the charge controller output keeps dropping, it has gone down to 17 volts as does the battery voltage. My question is- if the supply continues to operate at 24v why does the charge controller voltage still drop? Why wouldn't the potential stay at 22 something.

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#1

Re: battery charging

09/21/2016 12:40 AM

Sounds like you have something wired incorrectly....can you supply a diagram?

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#2

Re: battery charging

09/21/2016 12:43 AM

Never mind.

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#4
In reply to #2

Re: battery charging

09/21/2016 11:02 AM

Sounds like it was installed by a sawn wit, a pair of half-wits.

Get rid of the offending 24 V charger, and put in a system with the appropriate voltage, very simple.

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#3

Re: battery charging

09/21/2016 2:20 AM

What you are experiencing is logical, although why you have done it this way is not immediately so.

Assuming the PVs are nominal 12v units, they will have a Vmp of around 37v when connected in series, this fits with your measured 40v which is most likely Voc.

The Tristar will operate to charge the series connected batteries as it will have sufficient voltage to do so. The boost/absorb voltage for charging the 2 batteries will need to be at least 28v, and for float, at least 27v.

Your 24v power supply does not have sufficient voltage for that, and it also loses some of its voltage due to losses in the Tristar - hence the 22.6v output.

Being a 5 amp unit, it will also suffer an inability to supply the current that the battery requires when attempting to charge, which will reduce the output voltage of the power supply even further.

If the PV circuit does not have a blocking diode external to the Tristar, then you may also be losing some of the current from your power supply back up through the PVs.

Another problem may be that the power supply is not supplying a smooth DC output (common with switch-mode units). The Tristar - being an MPPT type unit - will thus see any voltage fluctuations as movements in the knee curve of the input, and thus be constantly recalculating to find the maximum power point, this could result in very little "on time" of the controller - these units are not designed to be powered by anything other than a PV.

1. Why have you not connected the power supply directly to the batteries rather than feeding it through the Tristar with the consequent losses?

2. If you really want the batteries to be charged from the mains, then you will require a power supply that can provide at least 27v under load.

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#5
In reply to #3

Re: battery charging

09/22/2016 1:06 AM

I don't know why this system was connected this way, i was just consulted as to why it wasn't working. I knew the AC powered supply was too low to keep the batteries charged but thought they would at least maintain that low charge level. I had noticed the DIP switches were on auto detect so i was thinking that the charger was trying to maintain a much lower voltage. I had not thought of the calculations for the power curve or the clean power from the supply. thank you those were the things i was looking for.

And yes when i connect the panels correctly everything works as it should

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#6
In reply to #5

Re: battery charging

10/01/2016 8:16 PM

Any evidence the mains charger system ever worked?

You may have two incompatible control systems here.

The solar charger may not have to bother about input overvoltage or over current - because the panels have their inherent limits. If there is a fixed transformer ratio, input to output, it may have no need of output current limit. It may have a microcontroller which operates a routine - < increase output current a bit - if output power rises, increase current again but if it falls then drop current back a bit > - in order to find peak power. Measuring Amps + volts and calculating power will take a definite time. From the AC charger's viewpoint this is a load which always wants to find its overcurrent limit and sit on it.

The AC charger wants to keep fixed voltage, but must protect against overcurrent. If current limit is exceeded it may well have a "foldback" Volts/current feature that gives a fraction of rated current at zero volts and current which increases linearly with output voltage - up to nearly normal voltage. This is an unstable slope - it will bootstrap an electronic load full of capacitors from zero volts up to normal or collapse volts in overcurrent! It might shut off after a time with low output volts & overcurrent but re-start after a time interval for cooling. The solar controller may see a very low input voltage as "darkness" and shut off - it does not have to wake and check volts again very often.

So your low AC charger output volts may be because it is cycling on/off quickly giving a low average reading on a DC voltmeter - and the output to the battery may be low because the solar control thinks it is "dark" most of the time.

An oscilloscope could reveal what is happening.

Also, since many multimeters have a DC blocking capacitor on AC voltage ranges, measuring AC charger DC volts on AC range may detect an unusual "sawtooth" AC component. A fluctuating reading on DC may be a symptom but most DVMs measure over a time equivalent to several mains cycles (to avoid mains ripple causing fluctuating readings) so may not notice fast sawtooths.

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