Crankcase Closed Ventilation on a 2009 BMW 328i

If the valve goes bad it starts pumping oil into the intake, this tends to burn the oil causing smoke and fouling plugs...

..."In a nutshell, the crankcase always produces pressure from blow-by. The CCV is simply a "middleman" controlled by Intake Manifold Vacuum.

This way the positive pressure from the crankcase is removed by the CCV which separates oil and vapor:
- Oil goes back down the crankcase
- Vapor goes back into the Intake manifold.
This is why the CCV is also called "Oil Separator" in the Volvo language."...

https://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?p=5068323

Thanks Solar. When I pull the oil fill cover, there's a definite vacuum whether cold or warm. All diagnosis points to a bad CCV.

My concern is that this happens intermittently.

Another thought: If my motor is very sound, which I think it is, it would take a high vacuum to pull any oil back into the intake manifold. The CCV diaphram may be torn, but not detached, so at high engine vacuum (engine braking while pulling off a freeway), so much vacuum may be introduced through the CCV that oil is finally sucked into the intake.

During a long trip on a hot day, I had terrible smoke on a long downhill - a lot of engine braking. When I opened the oil fill cap, there was a lot of vacuum trying to hold the cap closed. I also heard the whine on the passenger side (where the CCV is). After releasing the pressure, I drove the car home (another 25 miles) and no smoke.

The valve can fail open as Solar Eagle mentions and oil can be pulled into the intake and cause blue/white exhaust.

The valve can also fail closed which causes higher preasure in the crankcase causing oil on the cylinder walls to move into the combustion chamber during parts of the cycle....which also leads to blue/white exhaust.

Thanks Truth. I think mine is open, because I have a vacuum in the valve cover.

Thanks for the explanation.

Hi Lyn,

Thanks for your help. On the earlier E90's (N54 motor), the CCV is on the drivers side with lots of hoses. On the newer E90's (N51 and 52 motor), the CCV is build into the valve cover. I think they did this so that the oil wouldn't deteriorate the hoses (a typical problem on the older BMW's).

Simple solutio to test the fault, remove the tube and replace with a straight open tube vented to the atmosphere. Go for a drive and see what happens. The crankcase won't be under negative (or positive) pressure. If you still have the problem, it could be from something else like your brake booster.

When I pull the oil fill cap, the idle increases (like when removing vacuum). I'm pretty sure it's a CCV. Just trying to figure out why it's intermittent and why I have the white/light blue smoke billowing out. There's a lot of smoke, when it does happen.

If/when you are certain that the CCV is defective and are worried about breaking the old one, is it possible to simply seal the old one in place and install the new valve through a freshy cut hole nearby?

Note previous post about also replacing hoses and other items simultaneously.

Thanks for the idea. I don't think it'll work, since the new valve has a top housing and diaphram below. It needs a lower housing to work properly.

Looks like you need a new valve cover, which is about $500.00 +$250.00 an hour labor.

On the bright side, you could always trade it in on a brand new Toyota and you never again have to worry BMW's silly ass ccv system again.

I spoke to my mechanic and he's around the same price. The valve is cheap, but most people break the housing (on the valve cover) and wind up gluing it back together, then use RTV to seal the new valve in place. I'm not a fan of Mickey Mouse type fixes, but I've heard it works well.

I did find a Chinese aftermarket valve cover with a new CCV installed. $148 for the part. Not sure if I trust it on my motor. If you know about quality parts from China, let me know what you think of this thing. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Valve-Cover-Kit-E82-128i-E9X-328i-E60-528i-E70-X5-3-0si-X3-Z4-F10-N51-N52-3-0L/282104780831?hash=item41aec1581f:g:~g8AAOSwtItbXqXH:rk:9:pf:0

I don't know if you can say, " good quality parts from china " in the same sentence. Without getting political, the Chinese system is only set up for, " good quantity parts from China ".

I would suspect that bmw would have a vested interest in providing a part that is consistent in every phase of manufacture.

The aftermarket place might switch to plastic hubcaps next week.

You might be well surprised how much is made in China for Mercs and BMW. All good German engineering, made in China. Harleys, Indian, Enfeild motor bikes, (Harley 750 Street), all made in India. Even Boeing is making parts for aircraft in India, ABB, makes much in India. Reality is the west does not make much that competes price wise for the world. Even Harleys made in the USA sell cheaper in Canada. The world has changed. Land Rover is made by the Chinese, named Land Wind and it is cheaper than the Landi and better finish. All supply and demand and a fair price.

That is why India is building all of Brazil's transmission lines, same steel for towers, same ali for conductors, just better priced to suit the client, 'Fit for Purpose', less bells and whistles and less cost to suit the pocket. And all made in India and China. Stuck with it as the west cannot compete on cost. Sad fact of life.

There is more, much more than competing on cost. Most consumers when given the option to buy a product made in China for say a given price of $20.00, and a U.S. part for $22.00 , will generally opt for the U.S. part.

Generally, consumers new to a given market, may initially decide to purchase a Chinese manufactured copy of an originally designed and manufactured U.S part. It is only after that consumer has purchased several quality deceptive copies of the original is when they realize the time and money lost in trying to step over a dollar to pick up a dime.

Consumers, both knowledgeable and unknowledgeable will usually give a German or American part, " The once over " and will feel confident that that a given part will perform better and last longer than their expectations.

Whereas a Chinese made part usually involves a greater degree of scrutiny and a lingering doubt as to fit and finish as well as long term durability.

The fact is that a political system has a huge impact on a manufacturing base. Those countries that strive for quantity over quality and remove the individuals incentive of the latter, will continually struggle with a negative perception.

Take chocolate as an example:

Many people in China eat Chinese made chocolate,,

But given the option to eat U.S. made chocolate, Chinese will choose the American made chocolate, " hands down ".

This is another well known fact. The political system in the U.S has created a culture where only pure and quality ingredients are used by American chocolate and candy makers.

A highly sought after gift for Chinese nationals is to receive a box of American chocolate.

I'm sorry Tony, but I've had some pretty bad US made chocolate. The chocolates in the box of Whitman's is just too sweet and not rich and creamy. Nestle's Crunch bar chocolate is dry and lacks richness and creaminess. And Baby Ruth chocolate is hard and brittle (crumbs fall off the bar when you eat it).

If the US chocolate is better than the Chinese stuff, then the Chinese must be pretty bad.

I'll admit that there are some very good chocolate brands here in the US. See's, Fannie May, Frango Mints and of course Godiva.

http://buildraceparty.com/bmw-builds-their-engines-in-china/

Helloooo World.

Is this really an attempt to paint Chinese manufacturing as synonymous with quality because BMW has a plant there to produce engines for their cars sold in that market?

You don't think being able to sell in that market certainly comes with any stipulations about where the automobiles are produced, do you?

Even if it weren't the case that BMW restricts the engines manufactured there to only be sold into that market, it wouldn't mean quality standards for Chinese products has reached acceptable levels. There are undoubtedly examples of Chinese manufacturing that do mot have unacceptably high rates of defects or recalcitrant manufacturing problems reported. The problem isn't that some passing example can't be found. The problem is the high risk of getting one of the all too frequent non-passing examples.

China has about 20% of global manufacturing. The New York Times reports 60% of all recalls are for Chinese manufactured items.

No, not at all, it is merely some insight that you don't actually know these days where anything is made. The great icon Apple, made in China, now moving to India. BMW and Merc's, made in S Africa, sold in the USA, NASA computer interface panels, made in S Africa, catalytic converters for US vehicles, many imported from S Africa. Boeing wings made in Japan. The whole American iconic Boeing Dreamliner is built by Korea, Japan, Australia, Italy, US. NASA rocket engines made by the Russians.

The world is not what you would patriotically like to believe. If the packaging says Made in the USA, that does not mean the contents were made in the USA. Just because something is assembled in a country does not mean it is 'made' there. Pause to consider Trade Deals. You may be amazed.

Companies send manufacturing to China, because of cost, regulations and pollution. Dirty industries wind up there, because the Chinese gov't doesn't care - they want growth at almost any cost. Labor costs are much lower, as we all know. And since the gov't wants growth, they are lenient on regulations, even though they're still a communist country.

For instance, the little Casio calculator on my desk is a good product and it's made in China. My AOC computer screen - made in China. My HP computer - same! LG cell phone - China. Microsoft mouse and HP keyboard - China. All these products function well and have a reasonable lifespan.

60%! That's huge! Not to mention all the other "stuff" that nobody complains about.

For $2, it's a no brainer. For $200, it's a little different. Though saving $200 isn't good if the part causes damage or doesn't work.

My mechanic told me that many, many parts are coming from China, but are re-packaged in Delco, Motorcraft, Mopar, Toyota, Honda, Nissan, etc boxes. He told me that many Beck Arnley parts are either true OEM's repackaged or parts made in China. Also, many Dorman products are made in China now.

I think the difference between a made in China OEM part vs a knockoff is the quality of the mold and the fitment. Many knockoffs use cheap hardware or motors and the fit and finish isn't correct. For some parts, it doesn't matter - chrome pick up truck bumpers. However for other part, it's crucial - mechanical parts that can cause a car to not function properly or damage other parts.

And remember that almost all smart phones are made in China, including the coveted iPhone.

"...made in China, including the coveted iPhone. ..."

.

Actually, a very small percentage (less than 4% for the iphone 7 for example) of 'making' an iPhone is done in China.

Using value added as the measurent of 'made', of the roughly $240 factory cost of an iPhone 7, less than $9 is value added in China.

Hello, but yes there may be only 9% of the cost from China, but maybe as much as 90% of the value.

Same is happening in Aus. Basically finished product landed here bulk packaged and the repackaging and labour to do that creates the so called Australian content.

Same happened with S American fruit juices. Concentrate delivered and 90% volume water added to reconstitute and thus "90% Australian content". The Aus fruit industry was destroyed by this in just a few years.

The justified so called level playing field isn't. The labour regulations and environmental controls act against the "responsible" player to the advantage of the other.

I suppose though that we are getting close to OT since these have little to do with crankcase valves.

Not really off topic, since the two options I have considered are:

1. Change the CCV only for less than $15, but may have a lot of time put in.

2. Change the entire valve cover with the CCV using a sub $100 China knock off part.

My concern about the valve cover is that it may not fit properly - what I've read in the BMW forums, and the cheap materials may break and cause substantial damage to my "reaL" BMW motor.

I agree with your argument about cost vs value. Yes, you can use cheap labor to say the cost is low, however if the part was made in the US, the labor would be higher and thus the cost would be higher. So, to compare apples to apples, we should look at the value - in the case of a smart phone, the raw materials count for very little of the cost of the phone. The production of the parts (from the raw materials) and the assembly into a phone adds tremendous value to the product. Because handing someone a pile of aluminum, magnesium, silicon, zinc, lithium, etc can't be compared to handing them a smart phone.

"... Same happened with S American fruit juices.... ...90% volume water added to reconstitute and thus "90% Australian content" ..."

Analogies can be powerful tools. As such, their use requires dilligence lest they become dangerous.

Value and volume both statt with 'v', but these are not interchangeable. The iphone value calculation is not based on volume. There is a link to the paper with the supporting calculations.

If the Chinese really were providing 90% of the value at 9% of thr cost, don't you think Apple would figure out a way to have China produce the final 10% if they could. I mean, the cost to value disparity you describe is an 8100% difference. There are differences in labor costs, but the diffeence is not in that realm.

If Apple could reliably get more high quality value at China's cheap rates, then more than 9% of an iPhone would come from China.

The perception of this is why autobroker rightfully hesitates to order an aftermarket crankcase ventilation part manufactured there.

Thanks for the response. I very much understand the difference between value and volume. Very often though, the parent organisations utilise every crack in well intended legislation to line their pockets.

In prior work, we were sourcing materials from China. Took a little investment for initial design and first article understanding, but then got to zero defect outcome for 100k parts per annum per product line across maybe 20 different products.

Our products ended up in F350 via Detroit as well as a few GM products, plus BMW and a few others.

Us "Westerners" might have been pointing the finger at China over the last few years, but similar happened to Japanese manufacture in the early '60's while they "caught up" and in many cases overtook our local production. Beware the sleeping rousing tiger.

US Corporations (and worldwide also), use China as a place to inexpensively make products. Some are actually pretty well made - their labor force is pretty good and they understand the concept of quality work ... well, at least some of them. I know there are many, many, many auto parts made in China that are used by our factories. Honda has made car speakers in China for many years (my 2004 Civic speakers were made in China). Almost every car brand has used China to manufacture it's parts.

Chinese aftermarket parts may be okay if they're just cosmetic, but for something as important as a valve cover, I don't want to risk damaging the motor.

I heard something interesting from a gal at my office (she's from China). The Chinese people will buy something that looks like the real thing, even if it doesn't function properly. For instance, if they could buy a knock off Mercedes S550 that looks just like a real one, but it's built on a Ford Taurus chassis, they would. They want to drive down the street and waive to all their friends, as well as park it in the driveway, so all the neighbors can see.

So, a BMW valve cover may look like the real deal, but the use of cheap plastic and a misfit due to a copied mold - that's reason enough for me to pass on it.

I found this information when I was doing some research last year on the iPhone and the possible cost of tariffs. Many of the parts do come from China, even though the manufacturers have plants in other parts of the world.

• Accelerometer: Bosch Sensortech, based in Germany with locations in the U.S., China, South Korea, Japan, and Taiwan
• Audio chips: Cirrus Logic, based in the U.S. with locations in the U.K., China, South Korea, Taiwan, Japan, and Singapore
• Battery: Samsung, based in South Korea with locations in 80 countries
• Battery: Sunwoda Electronic, based in China
• Camera: Qualcomm, based in the U.S. with locations in Australia, Brazil, China, India, Indonesia, Japan, South Korea, and more than a dozen locations through Europe and Latin America
• Camera: Sony, based in Japan with locations in dozens of countries
• Chips for 3G/4G/LTE networking: Qualcomm
• Compass: AKM Semiconductor, based in Japan with locations in the U.S., France, England, China, South Korea, and Taiwan
• Glass screen: Corning, based in the U.S., with locations in Australia, Belgium, Brazil, China, Denmark, France, Germany, Hong Kong, India, Israel, Italy, Japan, South Korea, Malaysia, Mexico, Philippines, Poland, Russia, Singapore, South Africa, Spain, Taiwan, The Netherlands, Turkey, the U.K., and the United Arab Emirates

• Gyroscope: STMicroelectronics. Based in Switzerland, with locations in 35 countries
• Flash memory: Toshiba, based in Japan with locations in over 50 countries
• Flash memory: Samsung
• LCD screen: Sharp, based in Japan with locations in 13 countries
• LCD screen: LG, based in South Korea with locations in Poland and China
• A-series processor: Samsung
• A-series processor: TSMC, based in Taiwan with locations in China, Singapore, and the U.S.
• Touch ID: TSMC
• Touch ID: Xintec. Based in Taiwan.
• Touch-screen controller: Broadcom, based in the U.S. with locations in Israel, Greece, the U.K., the Netherlands, Belgium, France, India, China, Taiwan, Singapore, and South Korea
• Wi-Fi chip: Murata, based in the U.S. with locations in Japan, Mexico, Brazil, Canada, China, Taiwan, South Korea, Thailand, Malaysia, Philippines, India, Vietnam, The Netherlands, Spain, the U.K., Germany, Hungary, France, Italy, and Finland

This list doesn't demostrate that those parts of the iphone are manufactured in China, only that the corporations responsible for that specific part manufactures something in China, not necessarily even something that goes in an iphone.

Correct. I don't have the time to investigate further, but i was hoping someone here on the site could let us know if those companies make iPhone parts in China.

Thanks for the info. When you have a second, watch this Bloomberg video on iPhone production. They tried it in Brazil and it failed, due to the parts manufacturers being in China. Enjoy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEmu3Dz--bM

The Land Wind is a cheap knockoff to the LR Evoque. It may look similar, but it's not even close to the same quality. I, personally am not a fan of LR/RR vehicles. They are very expensive to keep on the road, both repairs and maintenance costs. I also see a high percentage of them having a major problem near 100K mi.

By the way, the three Toyota's are doing great. No problems like this with a Toyota. Though I did have a problem changing that valve on top of the MR2 gas tank.

Also, none of our Toyota's drive like a BMW.

... well, maybe the new Supra, since it's a BMW Z4 with Toyota badging.

Sweden, valve cover is SEK1295.00 ($137.00). CCV is SEK450.00, ($47.00). Maybe you are limited in Google searches.

no, just limited to specific vehicles information.

Is it an OEM valve cover? Also, where did you find the part. I may order it and pay overseas shipping. Thanks.

https://www.autozone.com/emission-control-and-exhaust/pcv-valve/bmw/328i Across the puddle, and, now I am picking this one up on eBay.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Engine-Valve-Cover-11127552281-BMW-E70-E82-E90-E91-Z4-X3-X5-128i-328i-528i-/272528286313?ef_id=EAIaIQobChMI15yWucnI4AIVE4myCh2RAg1UEAkYByABEgKv0vD_BwE:G:s

I shall hunt the other site for you.

That's the aftermarket valve cover. The forums say "don't use the aftermarket". So I'd like to stay with the OEM valve cover or I can just change the CCV.

Thanks for searching.

I would plug in my OBDII scanner first, before I started on what seems to be a complicated installation of a relatively inexpensive part. The PCM stores a lot of codes and can lead you to a more correct choice of actual causes. The fuel trims are one of the best indicators of what maybe an intermittent vacuum leak.

I burned myself buying parts I didn't need before I got my own non-clone scanner and even the clone scanner I bought first was of immense value. Burning myself was even more painful because I was an Industrial Electrician for 36 years and not using a scan tool is just like going up on a crane without a meter. You can maybe get it right, but the odds are not in your favor.

Years ago, I had a MB that also blew out blue smoke. Turns out the seal between the master brake cylinder and the vacuum assist was intermittently bad and it sucked brake fluid causing the smoke. Surprisingly, my mysterious disappearing brake fluid without leaving any drips or other evidence also stopped. Would you be losing brake fluid you can't explain?

Thanks for the tip. Unfortunately, it's the CCV - I'm pretty sure. Signs of failure are:

1. High pitched whine coming from CCV (passenger side of motor)

2. Strong vacuum holding oil cap tight

3. White/light blue smoke at high vacuum

My car has an intermittent problem. The vacuum is there all the time (at the valve cover), which is a normal CCV problem. My idle is fine most of the time, but when it goes bad, it's really bad. When it blows smoke, there's a lot of smoke. Idle is very rough when it happens, which tells me that there's so much oil that the plugs can't fire properly. When I release the vacuum, the engine runs better.

You mentioned something that interested me. What can you tell me about fuel trims? I'm curious.

The fuel trims operate to maximize the engines efficiency. I've used this website for fast easy explanations:

https://www.obd-codes.com/faq/fuel-trims.php

The BMW forums I looked up keep mentioning the P0012 code so here it is:

https://www.obd-codes.com/p0012. So I would see which codes you have.

I ran across this YouTube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIRPtA93wx

The BMW people also talk about 2A98 and 2A99 BMW codes so take a look at this:

https://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=449103

But when you come down to it, they all kinda do point to where your at the CCV.

It seems that this is a pretty common problem but has an expensive cure. You must also be experiencing higher than usual oil consumption.

When it happens for a significant period of time, have you checked the oil level? This may confirm that it's engine oil vs. tranny, power steering or something else. I'm not sure what might be connected near the CCV but you never know. Maybe it's just causing that much vacuum that a valve or fitting that is marginal leaks when the CCV goes wacky.

I've had white smoke when the vacuum modulator on an '88 Bronco II went. The diaphragm blew and it was sucking transmission fluid into the intake. Engine oil usually burns black, but I don't know about the newer synthetics. They may burn white or blue white.

Engine oil was a little low, so I filled it back to full. This car has never burned oil in the past, so I think the CCV is the cause.

Thanks for your input.

I received the new CCV (valve only) in the mail today. Barring any rain tomorrow, I'm going to try to "remove" the old CCV and replace it with the new one.

I'll let you guys know how it turns out.