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Participant

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Casselberry (Orlando) Florida
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Converting 400Hz AC to 60Hz AC power

10/31/2007 2:34 PM

I have a 60 KW generator which provides power at 400 hertz. These are used in miltary and aircraft operations. Is there an economical way to convert the power to the more commonly usable 60 hertz? I don't need extremely accurate power converters or high end phase choppers.

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Engineering Fields - Electrical Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: El Lago, Texas, USA
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#1

Re: Converting 400Hz AC to 60Hz AC power

10/31/2007 3:00 PM

We always made 400Hz from 60Hz using a motor/generator pair. I assume they make them for going the other way as well.

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Power-User

Join Date: Nov 2006
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#2

Re: Converting 400Hz AC to 60Hz AC power

10/31/2007 3:45 PM

To use a motor generator set would be rather futile why not drive the generator of said set directly from the engine that was proposed to drive the 400 Hz unit !!!

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Power-User

Join Date: Aug 2007
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#3

Re: Converting 400Hz AC to 60Hz AC power

11/01/2007 11:53 AM

Speed = freq ... Just slow that gen set WAY down ...

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Guru

Join Date: Aug 2007
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#4

Re: Converting 400Hz AC to 60Hz AC power

11/01/2007 12:24 PM

like already mentioned motor - generator is best option but at efficiency cost, change the only generator for 60Hz supply if you like , AC-DC-AC phase converters you already opted out

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Guru

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#5

Re: Converting 400Hz AC to 60Hz AC power

11/01/2007 1:19 PM

Perhaps drive it at 60/400 times the speed, and then adjust field strength to get the right voltage. (You may need to rewind things however.)

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Power-User

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#6
In reply to #5

Re: Converting 400Hz AC to 60Hz AC power

11/01/2007 6:00 PM

Driving at reduced rev's 60/400 would adjust the frequency of course but to obtain the 60Kw output you would require the same power from the drive engine which it won't develop at reduced rev's, some kind of gearing would be required to allow the engine to run at its correct rev's

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Guru

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#9
In reply to #6

Re: Converting 400Hz AC to 60Hz AC power

11/02/2007 9:48 AM

Of course. At 60/400 of the typical 3600 rpm of a stationary engine, you'd be at 540 rpm -- below even a reasonable idle speed for such engines. A multi-belt or toothed belt drive would give the correct rpm while bringing the engine back up into its operating range.

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Guru

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#7

Re: Converting 400Hz AC to 60Hz AC power

11/02/2007 2:22 AM

If You are having DG set to produce power at 400 Hz,you may reduce the speed to have 60 hz.since f=PN/120, where f-Frequency,N-RPM,P-No of poles.

But if the alternator is designed to develop the required voltage at 400Hz,it may not develop same voltage at reduced RPM.

With same primemover you can couple differant alternators to have differant frequencies.

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Guru

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#8

Re: Converting 400Hz AC to 60Hz AC power

11/02/2007 8:44 AM

If you simply slow down the generator, you will probably fry the generator windings and the voltage regulator. The AC impedance (inductive reactance) of any winding is directly proportional to the frequency (XL = 2∏fL). At 60 Hz you have reduced the frequency to 15% of rated, and reduced the winding impedance by a similar amount. For a given voltage, the current will increase by over 650%! Since the basic limitation of generator capacity is the ability of the windings to remove the heat generated by the current, the generator itself could work, if you limited load to about 15% of the rated output.

The voltage regulator would simply not work. The voltage output is directly proportional to the both field strength and the speed. Reducing speed by a factor of 6.66 means that the regulator output must increase by the same ratio to generate rated voltage. I don't think there's a regulator design in the world built for that kind of abuse.

Unfortunately, there really is no easy and inexpensive way to do this. My best suggestion would be to see if you can find a surplus 400 HZ rectifier. Most military navigation and weapons electronics have these, and you might be able to find an obsolete avionics or nav package for a reasonable price. Once you've got DC, all you need is an inverter, like a big UPS. Again, you might find one of these on the surplus market.

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#10
In reply to #8

Re: Converting 400Hz AC to 60Hz AC power

11/02/2007 1:27 PM

What sort of devices do you wish to run with these 60Kw of power ? ,many devices such as heaters and filiment lighting do not care about the frequency.

The only problem would be if you wished to run induction type motors although small series type motors such as you find in vacuum cleaners ect would be OK as would TV's, computers etc where the power is initialy converted to DC.

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Anonymous Poster
#11

Re: Converting 400Hz AC to 60Hz AC power

11/05/2007 1:16 AM

I do not think it is economical to change the 400 hz MG to make it do something it was NOT designed to do.

Trade or sell your unit for what you need and reduce your total cost for the long run.

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Active Contributor

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#12

Re: Converting 400Hz AC to 60Hz AC power

11/05/2007 9:08 PM

Probably you need a AC-DC-AC inverter. And 60KW is huge.

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Anonymous Poster
#13
In reply to #12

Re: Converting 400Hz AC to 60Hz AC power

11/15/2007 10:27 PM

By slowing the generator speed down you also will severley alter the prime movers HP curve. E Bay that mf'er!

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Anonymous Poster
#14

Re: Converting 400Hz AC to 60Hz AC power

01/25/2008 7:45 PM

Is your unit diesel powered or does it have an electric motor? What is your price if you want to sell.

Tks.

Gary Collins

gcollins4@comcast.net

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