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Solution Carryover on Strip Surface

11/16/2007 10:32 AM

Is it possible to calculate the amount of liquid (of some given viscous properties) that will be carried on a strip of steel of a given width traveling vertically (or at an angle) out of a solution tank? Are there computer programs available for these types of calculations?


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#1

Re: Solution Carryover on Strip Surface

11/16/2007 10:42 AM

Weigh the steel before the solution is applied then weigh it after the solution is applied. The difference will tell you the weight for the solution. You can then multiply that by the total surface area using the sample piece as your unit of measure. Such as using one square foot of sheet metal as your sample piece.

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#2

Re: Solution Carryover on Strip Surface

11/17/2007 1:22 AM

I don't personally know of any programs that will help, but I do have a few questions.

Do you want this to calculate loads on something like steel coming out of a "pickling solution"? In that case, the viscosity of the fluid, speed of the steel (in feet per second...), temperature (because of it's effect on viscosity), and angle will be the determining variables.

If you want this for figuring out load-mass-balance (I read your bio) on a drilling rig, then the viscosity should be fairly constant, but you will still have to account for the speed (except using pitch and RPM's), along with the more complicated density mixture of dirt and water. If that is the case then looking at the mathematics behind an Archimede's screw might be more helpfull.

Sorry I couldn't be more help.

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#3
In reply to #2

Re: Solution Carryover on Strip Surface

11/17/2007 10:03 AM

"Do you want this to calculate loads on something like steel coming out of a "pickling solution"?"


This is exactly the type of situation. Strip traveling from pickle line rinse tanks and steel strip plating tanks often do not have wringer rolls and I have visually observed solution carried into succeeding units resulting in contamination. I am looking for a way to calculate the amount of carryover based on the strip width and speed, the solution characteristics and the configuration of the strip exiting the solution (as well as the length to reach the next unit). At high speeds, I have observed a considerable amount of carryover and felt there must be some way to calculate the volume of carryover.

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#4
In reply to #3

Re: Solution Carryover on Strip Surface

11/17/2007 12:06 PM

Instead of trying to calculate the carryover (and subsequent contamination), why don't you try to eliminate it? Some type of vacuum system would probably work best. Depending on the width that you are talking about, perhaps even using compressed air through a simple venturi. That would pull the solution off the steel before it gets to the next section, and allow you to (probably through a filtering system) return the pickling solution back to the originating tank.

Since you said: "At high speeds", I am guessing that the production line is variable speed. By modulating the suction based on "line speed", you can reduce the amount of energy needed to do the job. You would have to do some step tests, but it should work.

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#5

Re: Solution Carryover on Strip Surface

11/18/2007 11:43 PM

One other thought: If the economics won't support putting in a vacuum system, then using a PH/ORP probe might be a viable option. It won't stop the contamination, but at least you will be able to predict when the "bath water" needs to be thrown out. That will also allow you to back-calculate the amount of carryover. Pickling solution is acidic, so the effect will depend on the PH of both tanks. But it should be possible.

I still think that any way to reduce or eliminate the contamination would be best. Forget about the energy used to produce the steel in the first place, the ROI would come from lost production costs.

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