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Definition of Information

04/11/2026 3:59 AM

Please define "Information".

My understanding is that it data that can be understood by an intelligent entity. In that case, we are in an ocean of information. "Noise" is really information that we do not currently understand.

How can a black hole leak "Information" into total void with no intelligence to understand it.

Information must have mass, and having mass, must affect anything that measures it, and the reciprocal, which would help explain the particle/wave duality of photons, electrons, etc.

Please shine a little light on my island / errr-continent of ignorance.

Thanks in advance for the light.!

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#1

Re: Definition of Information

04/11/2026 2:28 PM

"Information" is one of those words whose meanings vary depending on context. In the context of astrophysics (black holes), the information that leaks is the quantum states of matter lost to the black hole. In this context, an intelligent receiver interpreting the information is not needed. The spin, charge, mass-energy, and other quantum states of the matter entering the black hole, forever, violate conservation laws. To be accurate, this lost information paradox (solved by Hawking radiation) comes from a thought experiment about what happens to the matter that enters a black hole. Hawking radiation has never been directly observed, let alone directly analyzed to prove or disprove Stephen Hawking's analysis. An acoustic version of a black hole was found to produce acoustic Hawking radiation.

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#2
In reply to #1

Re: Definition of Information

04/11/2026 10:29 PM

Thanks for that! That answers a lot of my unspoken questions.

In another context, information, or knowledge, must have some mass or energy associated with it. How does a particle "know" if it is being measured or observed?

Nothing can be measured without adding to or subtracting from the whole.

Even a thermometer in the ocean affects the ocean.

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#8
In reply to #2

Re: Definition of Information

04/14/2026 5:09 PM

IMHO, knowledge and information are distinct. Knowledge requires a knower. Information is may be available but without a perceiver yet.

As for information having mass, I don't think that is very clear. Does nonfiction weigh as much as fiction? If information has mass then mass should be a good indicator of truth. There exist infinite nontruths that can be about any thing so if untruth had noninfintesimal mass, everything would have already collapsed into a black hole from all the mass of untruths about any and everything.

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#3

Re: Definition of Information

04/11/2026 11:19 PM

What if my information is spoken in a foreign language--say what the Navajo code talkers used in WW2? The info given does not have to be understood, which was the goal of the code talkers.

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#4
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Re: Definition of Information

04/12/2026 5:08 AM

True, lack of understanding does not mean lack of information, which is what I am referring to. "Static" is not currently understood, so it is labeled "noise".

The noise may contain all of the information of the universe, past., present and future but we have to move through the morass of time to understand pieces of it, and once we do, we will know it has been there the whole while.

The speed of sound was once thought impossible to exceed, likewise the speed of light now, but we will be released from our photon-prison.

The entire sum of our knowledge is merely accumulated drips from an ocean.

We do not invent or create anything, we simply discover that which is already present, yet we are so egotistical we claim a great victory over the darkness of ignorance.

So here we are, ants in a desert, thinking the universe is made of sand, with life spans so short we will never see the bigger picture.

I am very happy with my little sunbeam.

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#5
In reply to #4

Re: Definition of Information

04/13/2026 6:55 AM

I have to say HTRN, in the 10+ years I have been lurking here, your posts always touch the most entertaining and thought-provoking topics.

Thanks, man. You typically make my mornings just a little bit better.

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#7
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Re: Definition of Information

04/14/2026 3:38 PM

Agree.

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#6

Re: Definition of Information

04/14/2026 9:24 AM

I believe our science is wrong about the concept of information.

Information is only needed for choice. And only bio-physics has choice.

And the fundamental purpose for information is “fit”. And with the proper “fit”, we get the proper function.

Dead matter interaction only has one fit. So information is not used, except on earth.

And this information has to be stored and passed on.

The filtering, assembly and storage of this bio information remains a great mystery.

Just like the one solution fit of dead matter remains a great mystery.

Information is like life, it’s only present here.

And it confuses us about all else.

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