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Power From Above, Free and Carbon Free Part II

01/04/2008 4:22 PM

I read recently that Libya will pay France billions of dollars to build them a nuclear power plant to supply electricity. This started me thinking along the following lines.

With all the concern surrounding nuclear power (disposal of waste, mis-appropriating of technology and materials, safety issues, terrorism, etc) I wonder if the money could be better spend on a thermal solar power stations such as the one built in Spain. I don't have the numbers, but I imagine that you could build many, many of those plants for the cost of a single nuclear power plant.

I think this would be a better approach for the planet, based on the following:-

1) Libya has a huge area of desert, with a lot of sunshine, so their power producing potential is enormous, limited only by how many power stations they want to build. If they build more than they need to supply domestic consumption, then they can overcome the major problem of solar thermal, namely

2) Solar power, obviously, only works during the day. The solution is simple. Lay some huge cables across the Mediterranean sea and during the day, excess power is supplied to Europe (which is why you should build much more capacity than you need domestically), thereby reducing their carbon emissions. At night, the power (probably from fossil fuelled power stations unfortunately) flows from Europe into Libya. Using a two way metering system, Libya would also get a cheque every month, with which to build more of these power stations.

3) Speed. It takes an awful long time to build a nuclear power station, much less for solar thermal.

4) Redundancy. With many (comparatively) small solar stations, if a couple go off line, no real problem. With a nuclear station, either it works or it doesn't. (I am aware that most nuclear power stations have good reliability, but sh!t happens. Look at the nuclear power plant in Canada that supplies most of the world's medical isotopes;it went down, the medical community around the world was screwed)

5) Closer business and economic ties, reducing the likely-hood of conflict between the parties involved. As they are now mutually dependant for each other on power, there is a huge motivation to resolve any differences of opinion by working together, rather than being confrontational.

6) Conservation of Libya's oil and gas assets (if they so chose....)

7) Any others I have missed that you wish to add.

Yes, there will be some major technical hurdles to overcome and it won't be cheap, but compared to some of the (oil and gas based) mega-projects either on the go or proposed, the problems are not beyond solution. The environmental impact would also be far less, both in the short and long terms.

Which bring s us to the three main questions regarding the proposal (feel free to add more)

A) is it feasible, technically?

B) would it be economically viable ?

(how many solar thermal plants = 1 nuclear plant, 10, 100, 1000? Economies of scale of 100, 200, 500 solar thermal plants vs 1 nuclear plant?

and, most important of all,

C) would their be the political will needed to make it work?

I look forward to hearing the thoughts, feelings and opinions of others regarding such a proposal.

IPG

BTW, I only used Libya as an example, as it was in the news program I read. The above is applicable to any country with the desert, sunshine, will and money to pursue it.

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#1

Re: Power From Above, Free and Carbon Free Part II

01/04/2008 11:35 PM

Good idea. The US offered North Korea economic aid to turn off their nuclear power reactor and end their nuclear weapons programs.

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Guru

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#2

Re: Power From Above, Free and Carbon Free Part II

01/05/2008 7:48 PM

Solar power is the most expensive way to make electricity, requiring hundreds of acres of land and some technologically advanced equipment. It doesn't work when you need electric lights. Storing the energyfor when it is needed is difficult. The cheapest way would be to pump water into a reservoir during the day and use the water to make electricity at night. The main problem is lack of power at night and lack of any effective way of storing the power made during the day. Solar can supplement during the day and reduce the amount of coal burned, but then Libya would need both types of plants at even more cost.


But some environmental group would discover some rare species that would be endangered by the project and bring it to a stop with lawsuits, so it won't be built anyway.

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Power-User

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#3
In reply to #2

Re: Power From Above, Free and Carbon Free Part II

01/07/2008 9:16 AM

Hi Taganan,

Thanks for your comments.

I realize that solar isn't cheap, but then neither is nuclear. I could be wrong, but I would bet that the technology required for a nuclear reactor is far more advanced that that needed for a solar plant, and if either were to fail catastrophically, the clean up of a solar plant would be far, far cheaper and easier than the clean up from a nuclear plant.

As for needing hundreds of acres of land, they have plenty of that in the desert. My bigger concern would be how to stop the sand from engulfing the solar plants.

Storage of electricity is impractical in huge amounts; in Wales they have a power storage device that consists of two lakes, one at the foot of a mountain, the other on top. At night when they have a surplus of power they use it to pump water to the top of the mountain. When they need power, they let it flow through turbines into the bottom lake. This arrangement only provides power temporarily, until they can pull another power station on line, and is not feasible to store more than a few minute's worth of the country's power needs.

This is why the venture needs COOPERATION with Europe to supply power to Libya at night, so Libya would not have to build any more conventional power stations. (I assume that they already have enough for current domestic needs)

As I see it, we will always need fossil fueled (or nuclear) power plants, nothing renewable comes close to it in terms of quick response, day or night. The main point of the project is to help reduce GLOBAL CO2 emissions, by maximizing the use of green power when it is available, and while this is by no means a magic bullet in that sense, it is, I believe, one possible way to get closer to that goal. Fossil/nuclear should be the backstop to fill the gaps between the various green power sources that SHOULD be our primary power sources.

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#4
In reply to #3

Re: Power From Above, Free and Carbon Free Part II

01/12/2008 3:24 PM

As long as the electricity doesn't cost more it may be fine. The CO2 argument is meaningless as climate change is more than 95% NATURAL. Kind of hard to run power lines to the other side of the sea too.

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Power-User

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#5

Re: Power From Above, Free and Carbon Free Part II

03/25/2008 1:07 PM

I just saw this

http://www.power-technology.com/features/feature1480/

It seems that I'm not quite as crazy as I thought!

Any comments? (about the link, not my craziness!)

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