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Automotive xprize (invitation to discuss)

07/16/2008 12:03 PM

Whether or not you want to participate, I welcome comments.

I am looking to form a team to win the auto xprize, described at the site below. I know how to win. Do you have a better idea? http://www.progressiveautoxprize.org/auto/prize-details Basically, they aim to televise a series of "races" with the winner being awarded a substantial prize, something like $10 Million, plus, of course, priceless TV advertising. In fact, any car entered will get national publicity, winner or not. To win, a car must get 100 miles per gallon of "gasoline equivalent." There are two classes, two-seat cars with 100 miles unrefueled range, and four-seat cars with 200 miles unrefueled range. The fuel is supplied by the race committee and can be gasoline, diesel, biofuels, or electricity. There are other requirements, including a $5000 entry fee. In addition, a qualifying team must submit a business plan which shows how they will be able to deliver 10,000 cars a year at less than $80,000 per car. Cars with internal combustion (IC) engines don't have a chance. My Prius, which is technically sophisticated, gets perhaps 50 mpg, because the IC engine is at best about 25 per cent efficient. If the efficiency exceeded 50 per cent, it would be a winner (except for the requirement of 10 cubic feet of trunk volume), but that is impossible, given the thermodynamics of the IC engine. Electric cars with batteries are not only difficult technically, to get the range and performance (0-60 in 12 seconds), but they are pretty much ruled out by the price limit. State of the art batteries will cost more than $80,000 per car. Since the electrical equivalent of a gallon of gas is approximately 35 kW-hr, a car with a 200 mile range at "100 mpg" would have to store close to 80 kW-hr of energy. The competition for the two-seat car will be fierce, including three-wheeled "motorcycles", but it is not clear there will be a winner. I doubt that there is even an entry in the 4-seat, 200 mile class. Major auto manufacturers seem to be sitting this out. There is a way to win. Use the supplied electricity "fuel" but do not store the energy in expensive batteries or depend on expensive electric motors, controllers, etc. The answer is to use electricity to run a compressor, storing the energy as compressed air. There are no expensive and toxic metals involved. The Department of Energy (DOE) says compressed air systems are only about 15 per cent efficient, so an air car won't win. (There is one entered, the French Midi, but it can't win) DOE lacks imagination. The trick is to use "wet compressed air" (WCA), as described in my US patent, 5,832,728. The trick is to increase the energy storage efficiency by conserving heat. The air compressor is cooled by injecting water into the intake. The water cools the compressor, which would normally be air-cooled, heating up the atmosphere, by turning into steam, which is mixed with the compressed air at, say, 300 C. When the air is expanded through a "steam engine", the steam condenses, reheating the air. The input is ambient temperature air and water; the exhaust is ambient temperature air and distilled, drinkable, water. Thermodynamically, it is almost perfectly efficient. This process, energy transmission and storage with WCA, is suitable for propelling cars and for many other applications, such as storing wind energy for windless days and providing power to off-grid locations such as polar research stations and African villages. It could even be used for utility load-leveling. An obsolete electricity generating plant could be converted to using "green" WCA instead of coal-fired steam, resulting in perfectly "green" electricity, any time, at low cost. Winning the xprize would publicize the technology beyond the vehicle market. Skeptics, like the clods at DOE, will say it can't be done, but it has been done. After the patent was granted, it appeared that the principles had been proven in 1930. The diesel-pneumatic locomotive was more efficient that a diesel-electric locomotive, at one point saving 29 per cent in fuel, pulling the same train over the same route on the same schedule. Apparently the WCA trick was kept as a trade secret, which explains why it did not turn up in the patent search. Of course, in 1930,
German railways were not going to switch to diesels, so the invention was never adopted, and the railway bureaucrats did not seek other applications. So, I am looking for a sponsor who can build and enter a car for the xprize. Such a sponsor should have the facilities to convert an existing vehicle to run on WCA. For the two-seat car, a small sedan or hatchback could be converted, as long as about 30 cubic feet of air tanks could be fitted in behind the front seats. The existing engine and drive train could be converted to run on WCA. (A diesel would be best, but not essential) That involves a new or modified camshaft and WCA injectors applied in the spark plug holes. Controls, etc. would be needed, including a data link to the live TV presentation of the race. They demand an entry fee and a professional driver. The sponsor should have a "sales organization" to handle 10,000 deposits and the capital to build (buy and modify) the vehicles. A four seat vehicle with a 200 mile range is a bit more difficult, but I think it is feasible if one starts with van or extended cab pick-up truck with four seats and enough volume for the tankage. (The ideal would be to build a "platform" chassis, immensely strong, out of WCA tanks and perch a small, light body atop it, but that probably would be more difficult, given the time constraints. Save it for the Mark 2 version) The team should probably also include a manufacturer of air compressors and/or storage tanks. If the race committee will allow it, there should be a "filling station" consisting of a compressor and large storage tanks. Then the vehicle could recharge in minutes from the stored WCA, something no battery powered car could match. Assuming 10,000 cars, the infrastructure to charge batteries would be much more expensive than a few filling stations, each of which could accommodate many vehicles. Assuming stations were spaced along the interstate highways, one could drive coast to coast, pausing only minutes at a time to recharge, instead of the hours required by an electric car to recharge. WCA scales up nicely. An 18-wheeler truck could get along on tanks of a volume comparable to a large sleeper cab. If the WCA is compressed with a "green" power source, say a wind turbine instead of coal-generated electricity, the entire transportation system would be zero-emissions, essentially carbon free. One could sell "carbon offsets." I am Erik Buck. You can e-mail me at esbuck@aol.com or esbuck@gmail.com.

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#1

Re: Automotive xprize (invitation to discuss)

07/16/2008 2:43 PM

Coooooo .... could you précis that a bit?

its a bit long and difficult to read without paragraphs etc...

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#2

Re: Automotive xprize (invitation to discuss)

07/17/2008 1:14 AM

Hello esbuck,

I definitely have some ideas but I am not a sponsor and not familiar with WCA.

100 mpg and 0-60 in 12 sec are very doable just not a design found in todays vehicles.

Brad

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#3

Re: Automotive xprize (invitation to discuss)

07/17/2008 10:43 AM

I also am not familiar with wet compressed air, or automotive design. I do dwell on the following topic, however, every now and then during those few moments when I have enough time to day-dream.

My knowledge and experiences are in a vastly different arena so please forgive the apparent lack of proper technical verbiage in the description:

It seems to me that from a mechanical common sense perspective, the most inefficient part of the automotive drive system is acceleration so this must be the phase that consumes the most fuel (regardless of type) while provided the least amount of end-result... distance traveled.

Why not design a fluid-power based system that augments the primary driver during acceleration? Don't tie the compressor to the primary driver because this would further reduce it's fuel efficiency due to the additional work load.

But rather tie it to the breaking system. As you engage the breaks to slow the vehicle, you engage the compressor and build up your fluid pressure. During the next moment the accelerator peddle is depressed, the pressure releases assisting the primary driver in accelerating the vehicle.

Since breaking and acceleration are not directly proportional, it would be hard to calculate actual fuel efficiency benefits since they would continually vary. But, they would be there.

Granted, this idea will probably not win the X Prize, but I think it has merit none the less. Opinions?

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#5
In reply to #3

Re: Automotive xprize (invitation to discuss)

07/17/2008 3:51 PM

Hello JavaHead,

...the most inefficient part of the automotive drive system is acceleration so this must be the phase that consumes the most fuel...

To halve your acceleration time to the same speed and from the same speed, you must square your power output.

That is why a dragster uses so much more power to accelerate in the quarter mile than a sports car.

The problem with fluid power as I understand it is friction in the plumbing. Large fluid lines are heavy but flow slower so less friction, small diameter fluid lines weigh lots less but restrict flow and use higher velocity, increasing friction, to move the same fluid power.

The way this goal is achieved is efficiency and weight reduction. Regenerative breaking is reducing wasted energy. Also you will find that breaking (deceleration) and acceleration are proportional minus tire friction, slope, and drag.

Brad

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#6
In reply to #5

Re: Automotive xprize (invitation to discuss)

07/17/2008 5:13 PM

Excellent points U V...

Let me clarify my original comment regarding being proportional... my intent by that comment was that during any given trip the speeds that you are accelerating to, and decelerating from are in constant change... maybe braking off of a freeway (accumulating a lot of pressure) but then getting ready to accelerate onto a road with a 25 mph speed limit.

Or the opposite, decelerating from a speed of 25 mph and getting ready to accelerate onto a freeway.

I just didn't phrase it correctly in my original post, sorry for any confusion. I mean, in all reality, they are exactly equal since the car begins and ends its trip in the same condition... stopped. But I was referring to pairs of events being affected by speed variations during the course of the trip.

Regarding efficiencies... I know it's not the best system, especially considering the valid points you mentioned. Probably why I only drive cars and don't design them

But I can still see myself puttering around downtown, hitting every traffic light as my luck seemingly provides for. Then, after the 4th or 5th light and having built-up enough pressure, the next time I hit the accelerator I hear the distinct sounds of the hydraulic motor engaging, providing maybe 40 to 60% of the required energy to get me up to speed.

Or, due to its inefficiencies, it's used as a speed-maintain system, and rather than burning fuel to keep me going at my current rate of travel, the next time I hit the peddle, the hydraulics kick in instead.

Don't know, but it's a cool little topic for me to day-dream about.

But, I do know one thing for certain, their are people WAY smarter than I who have probably already field tested such a device and moved on to a different idea because it just didn't work.

Well, I hope you all have a pleasant weekend, I will be away from my computer from now until Monday doing some military stuff.

Good luck with your search ESBUCK, feasible idea or not the most important things we need to keep alive in the field of design and invention are: passion, the ability to dream, and the conviction to follow your dream through to its natural conclusion even in the face of detractors. Best of luck to you!

JavaHead

"If the cops didn't see me I didn't do it "

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#7
In reply to #6

Re: Automotive xprize (invitation to discuss)

07/17/2008 6:17 PM

Thanks for the clarification. That is why you need a larger accumulator/capacitor to store your power.

they are exactly equal since the car begins and ends its trip in the same condition

I'm being overly exact because at 100mpg you need to be. If you travel from point A to point B and then back to point A to the same spot the slope is zero. There is still drag from the air, wind, road surface, tire deformation, entropy, conversion losses. Acceleration will always need to be more than deceleration. (in space this is not true only when you add air)

Personally I like hydraulics, then I could use Tesla Turbines and Motors. The problem is losses, electric is more efficient. Capacitors are lighter and have less losses than accumulators.

I'm working on a direct mechanical conversion of gas to electricity but it's all still in my head. I will talk to my Electrical Engineer partner Saturday so he can blow it full of holes.

Brad

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#4

Re: Automotive xprize (invitation to discuss)

07/17/2008 11:44 AM

Problem you're going to run into with retrofitting an IC engine is they simply arent made to run with that much water in the system. Granted, water injection has been used on high performance engines for decades, but these engines typically only run a few seasons of racing before they are torn down and rebuilt. Water will mean more frequent oil changes, piston ring wear, cylinder wall wear (which in turn will cause blow by) and valvetrain corrosion. You also need to consider the timing factor - at high rpm will you have enough time for the water to sufficently condense enough to give a maximum efficiency before the piston wants to change direction. You'll need alot of gears to keep those RPMs down. Also, water will condense inside a storage tank given time - this is why most home air compressors have a petcock valve on the bottom to prevent internal corrosion, weakening the structural integrity of the tank. Also, the compressor itself may not like having water injected into it for the same reasons an IC engine doesnt.

There was a guy a while back who had built a 6 stroke engine not much unlike your proposal. Basically it was a conventional 4 stroke IC engine, but he added a cycle where water was injected into an already hot cylinder and allowed to flash into steam, creating pressure (no fuel was added at that point, and there was no spark). Im sure if you look around you can find out more about it.

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#8
In reply to #4

Re: Automotive xprize (invitation to discuss)

07/18/2008 10:27 AM

Yes, regenerative braking is feasible in an air car, as the motor being driven by the car (decelerating) turns it into a pump.

Water in the cylinders might require some modifications (eg. plating the bore), but, considering that steam locomotives often lived longer than their drivers, the converted IC engine should last long enough to win the prize.

At a temperature of about 350 C, I don't think condensation in the storage tanks will be a big problem. Of course, a drain is obvious.

Yes, that six-stroke engine is interesting. Actually, a century ago, is was fairly common to cool gas engines (stove gas, not gasoline) by spraying water into the cylinder, putting waste heat to work by making steam. Again, corrosion doesn't seem to have been a big problem.

Here's a nice problem for you thermodynamicists.

1. If the expander is the inverse of the compressor, and both are insulated, the energy conversion efficiency will be high.

2. Suppose, however, I do not modify the IC engine beyond scrapping the fuel system and sticking an injector (valve) in the spark plug hole? Now I have a four-stroke engine which, at the end of the compression stroke,has a lot of air in it before injecting the WCA. Now, near TDC, I inject the hot air/steam mixture, increasing the pressure both by increasing the mass of air in the cylinder and by heating the compressed air, analogous to heating it by burning fuel. How do I calculate the efficiency of that thermodynamic cycle? (clearly, it isn't just a matter of temperature difference between the beginning and end of the power stroke) The temperature of the exhaust will be comparatively low, but the pressure will be above atmospheric.

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