Previous in Forum: Milling Machine and Lathe   Next in Forum: Manufacturing
Close
Close
Close
8 comments
Rate Comments: Nested
Power-User
Engineering Fields - Mechanical Engineering - I am here to help!!

Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 192
Good Answers: 2

Blisters on surface of Ag-C contacts

07/28/2008 1:44 AM

Hi,

I am facing some queer problem.

We are manufacturing contacts for MCCB. The contacts are made of 98% Ag & 2% Graphite. They are flame brazed to ETP copper fingers. Afterwards they are silver plated.

Now, when the end of the Copper finger (which at a distance of 50 to 60 mm from the above Ag-C contacts) is then again brazed to braid assy by Resistance brazing. It is observed that when this brazing is going on, the Ag-C button develops blisters on surface.

I want to know, why this is happening?

Register to Reply
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".

"Almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, vote them!
Guru
Hobbies - HAM Radio - New Member United Kingdom - Big Ben - New Member Fans of Old Computers - Altair 8800 - New Member Canada - Member - New Member

Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Toronto
Posts: 3968
Good Answers: 120
#1

Re: Blisters on surface of Ag-C contacts

07/28/2008 10:49 PM

melted silver absorbs oxygen from the air. WHen it cools, the oxygen is excluded, making bubbles, blisters etc.

Solution, exclude the oxygen with an inert gas while the brazing job goes on.

less pure silver alloy might mitigate this.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22melted+silver%22+%2Boxygen&btnG=Google+Search

__________________
Per Ardua Ad Astra
Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Guru
Engineering Fields - Systems Engineering - New Member Hobbies - Model Rocketry - New Member

Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Long.92E,Lat.26N
Posts: 1336
Good Answers: 14
#2
In reply to #1

Re: Blisters on surface of Ag-C contacts

07/29/2008 12:03 AM

HOW will this work:

While resistance brazing to braid-- keep silver/graphite button dipped in flowing cold water.This setup can be easily rigged up.

mm

Register to Reply
Associate

Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: OZ
Posts: 33
Good Answers: 3
#3

Re: Blisters on surface of Ag-C contacts

07/29/2008 1:32 AM

If the silver plating is going over the silver button as a final coating, there's a good chance that the graphite gas released by the silver button re-heated after plating is causing the problem.

__________________
Shocking from OZ
Register to Reply
Anonymous Poster
#4

Re: Blisters on surface of Ag-C contacts

07/29/2008 8:13 AM

Uh... this might be a bit simplistic but why dont you do it the other way. Braze the braid before you plate the silver...

Register to Reply
2
Guru
Hobbies - HAM Radio - New Member United Kingdom - Big Ben - New Member Fans of Old Computers - Altair 8800 - New Member Canada - Member - New Member

Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Toronto
Posts: 3968
Good Answers: 120
#5

Re: Blisters on surface of Ag-C contacts

07/29/2008 8:33 AM

A second look at this show that the sintered silver-graphite button,

""Contact materials consist of graphite particles dispersed in a matrix of silver. Graphite has a high melting point (high refractoriness) and is insoluble in silver, resulting in superior anti-welding characteristics in high power and cycle applications such as circuit breakers. The graphite burns ups in the arcing or switching process and maintains a clean, low-resistivity contact surface. The silver typically bonds the graphite together, forming continuous high-conductivity paths and a lower voltage drop. These characteristics allow silver graphite brushes to perform well under high current density and low voltage conditions. Silver is more oxidation-resistant than copper, which can maintain cleaner contact surface during down times.""

from the description, the button is not remelted, thus will not extract oxygen from the atmosphere, followed by release on cooling.

A sintered material usually has some internal voids, and thus the only cause I can think of that will cause a blister is expansion of trapped gas. The buton has been pressed at high pressure and temperature, which consolidates the surface against the die into a gas tight barrier, thus leaving it susceptible to this problem. I suspect this might be caused by lack of welded contact between the deeper particles of the sintered mass, and thus would be a common Quality Control problem at the button makers end. So call them, as it appears you purchase preformed buttons. Suggest you also call a few other button makers to see if the problem is endemic in low end price competitive buttons, but goes away with costly better made buttons.

__________________
Per Ardua Ad Astra
Register to Reply Good Answer (Score 2)
Power-User
Engineering Fields - Mechanical Engineering - I am here to help!!

Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 192
Good Answers: 2
#6
In reply to #5

Re: Blisters on surface of Ag-C contacts

07/30/2008 12:06 AM

At first even I thought of the same rpoblem.

I took cross section of two contacts where the blister size is small & large. It was quite evident that the blister was slowly growing out of nowhere.

We wrap wet cloth around the button before the braid brazing. So, possibility of overheating is less. Again, why the bubbles are not formed when the button is being brazed to copper finger, as it is subjected higher temp while being brazed.

We observed cross sections of around 20 buttons through microscope and found no cracks no impurities.

Register to Reply
Commentator

Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 83
#7

Re: Blisters on surface of Ag-C contacts

08/08/2008 2:41 AM

graphite in its "normal state" has a small [micro] amount of moisture trapped in its crystalline structure. It is this quality that enables graphite to be a "dry lubricant". when this moisture is released at high temperature it no longer has low friction properties. I actually thought that the moisture would have been removed during the alloy process. if this is not so then what you are witnessing may be graphite releasing moisture from pre alloy process or moisture released that has been absorbed by graphite after alloy processing. [improper storage] this moisture is released at quite a high temperature however absorbed at ambient temp [ I believe].

Register to Reply
Power-User
Engineering Fields - Mechanical Engineering - I am here to help!!

Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 192
Good Answers: 2
#8
In reply to #7

Re: Blisters on surface of Ag-C contacts

08/11/2008 2:06 AM

Do you mean to say that when the button is brazed to the copper finger the graphit in button absorbs moisture while cooling to room temp & when the finger is again brazed to braid assy the moisture is released by graphite at less heating temperature.

Register to Reply
Register to Reply 8 comments

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".

"Almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, vote them!
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

Anonymous Poster (1); aurizon (2); MUKULMAHANT (1); nap (1); pc (2); pretzel (1)

Previous in Forum: Milling Machine and Lathe   Next in Forum: Manufacturing

Advertisement