Previous in Forum: How is a Bucket Elevator Used?   Next in Forum: Using Compressed Air to Push Water from a Well
Close
Close
Close
14 comments
Rate Comments: Nested
Associate

Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 27

Auto-Repeating Pneumatic Cannon

08/18/2008 10:20 PM

For accelerated life testing, I want to repeatedly launch a 5 oz, 3" diameter baseball using an air cannon at 60 to 90 MPH. The ball will not exit the vertically oriented firing barrel but will hit a stop plate and fall back to its initial position for a repeat of the cycle. I'd like to repeat this cycle for hours at a time - ideally once every 2 seconds, and in the worst case once every 10 seconds. I'll use a quick exhaust valve that is electronically controlled for timing the firing.

I'm an EE, so bare with me - it seems I need some equations that relate PSI, air flow, and work energy. Or, maybe somebody's gut feel about this....

The questions I have:

- can I use an air compressor or do I have to use a CO2 cannister?

If I must use a CO2 cannister (ughh):

- How many firings would a 20lb CO2 cannister support?

If I can use an air compressor:

- what PSI will be required in my pressure chamber?

- what size pressure vessel would I need?

- How do I figure out the SCFM / PSI rating before buying a compressor?

- what volume of air will be consumed in each cycle?

Thanks,

Dave

Register to Reply
Pathfinder Tags: pneumatics
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".
Guru
Hobbies - RC Aircraft - New Member Hobbies - Automotive Performance - New Member Hobbies - DIY Welding - New Member

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Fort Lauderdale Florida
Posts: 5708
Good Answers: 123
#1

Re: Auto repeating pneumatic cannon possible?

08/19/2008 12:18 AM

The questions I have:

- can I use an air compressor or do I have to use a CO2 cannister? Yes

If I must use a CO2 cannister (ughh):

- How many firings would a 20lb CO2 cannister support?

If I can use an air compressor:

- what PSI will be required in my pressure chamber? That would depend on how hard you want to launch the ball

- what size pressure vessel would I need? That would depend again on how hard and how often you want to launch.

- How do I figure out the SCFM / PSI rating before buying a compressor?

- what volume of air will be consumed in each cycle? That is a bit harder for me. It will depend on the launch pressure and the time the air is being expelled.

Ingersoll Rand's Aro division sells air valves that are controlled with electric signals. Use a valve that switches air from the reservoir to the launch tube when activated by your switch, then spring returns to the at rest position. While at this position the reservoir will refill from the compressor.

If the air valve has large enough flow, the on time would be 1 sec. If the cylinder consumes .10 cubic feet of air each launch, and you launch every 2 seconds, you will launch 30 times per min x.10. That means you will need at least a 3 cfm compressor to maintain that launch pace. To me that sounds too small. probably more air consumption than .10.

I will leave the 60 to 90 mph air flow calculations for the members who know how to drive a calculator better than me. Good luck and send pictures

__________________
Bob
Register to Reply
Associate

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, USA
Posts: 47
#2

Re: Auto-Repeating Pneumatic Cannon

08/20/2008 12:18 AM

Does it have to be air? If not have you considered using a nitrogen?

You can get a 4000 psi bottle or in some countries you get a 6000 psi bottle.

Or are you going to have difficulties with the density of the gas?

__________________
What's that Lassie, Timmy's stuck in the well
Register to Reply
Guru
Hobbies - HAM Radio - New Member United Kingdom - Big Ben - New Member Fans of Old Computers - Altair 8800 - New Member Canada - Member - New Member

Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Toronto
Posts: 3968
Good Answers: 120
#3
In reply to #2

Re: Auto-Repeating Pneumatic Cannon

08/20/2008 5:27 AM

what is the velocity you wish? A linear electric actuator might work here, no gas needed.

It would be at the base and have a 6 inch travel and a stop and it will lift the ball. These run on short high current pulses and can have less than a 1% duty cycle (determined by the heat it can dissipate over time)

A baseball going fast and hitting a stop might turn into a frayed mass in short order, I take it you are testing baseballs? if so, there may ne a standard basaball test procedire and jig?

__________________
Per Ardua Ad Astra
Register to Reply
Associate

Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 27
#10
In reply to #3

Re: Auto-Repeating Pneumatic Cannon

08/20/2008 12:14 PM

I did not know these existed. Sounds great, but I haven't been able to find any that would accelerate a ball to 130 ft/sec. Most are motor driven. Any companies you can point me to..?

Thanks!

Dave

Register to Reply
Guru
Hobbies - DIY Welding - New Member

Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1601
Good Answers: 58
#4

Re: Auto-Repeating Pneumatic Cannon

08/20/2008 7:46 AM

You can try to find, or develop equations for this process. You can locate someone with experience in building pumpkin-chunking machines and scale those designs, or you can do what I would do. Get a piece of pipe to use as a barrel, a storage tank for compressed air that you connect to the barrel via a quick acting valve, and a small air compressor. After you have determined the storage volume and pressure required for a single launch, you only need to muliply that value by 30 to obtain the CFM required to launch every 2 seconds. Be prepared to anticipate some heating effects in your process.

Register to Reply
Guru
Hobbies - RC Aircraft - New Member Hobbies - Automotive Performance - New Member Hobbies - DIY Welding - New Member

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Fort Lauderdale Florida
Posts: 5708
Good Answers: 123
#8
In reply to #4

Re: Auto-Repeating Pneumatic Cannon

08/20/2008 10:19 AM

Like this?

__________________
Bob
Register to Reply
Power-User

Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Brampton, ON, Canada
Posts: 218
Good Answers: 3
#5

Re: Auto-Repeating Pneumatic Cannon

08/20/2008 8:12 AM

Here are some of my thoughts.

You want a ball to accelerate to 90 mph. This is equivalent to 125 feet per second. The acceleration will occur in approx. 0.25 seconds for an accelerartion of 500 ft per second squared.

F=ma=5/16x500=156 pounds of force

I would use a short stroke air cylinder to strike the baseball, rather than trying to push the ball with air, this will also simulate the bat hitting the ball.

Use an air compressor with 100 psi air. The air cylinder required will then be approximately 3/4" diameter. I believe you would only need about a 2" stroke.

To give the ball time to come to a rest at the back of the tube you would probably need at least 5 seconds. Therefore you would hit the ball 20 times per minute, cfm at 100 psi would be 20 x pi x .75^2 x 2" x 2 (return stroke)/ 1728 = 0.08 cfm = 0.6scfm.

Register to Reply
Associate

Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 27
#11
In reply to #5

Re: Auto-Repeating Pneumatic Cannon

08/20/2008 1:59 PM

Excellent suggestion. Thanks! I came across hydraulic cylinders (too slow) and totally missed air cylinders. Any suggestions for where to purchase low cost, 4" bore, long stroke, spring return, air cylinders?

My calculations:

m=mass of piston+ball

a=acceleration

b=bore diameter

P=Pressure

d=stroke distance

Using F=ma, F=PxArea, v=at, t=d/.5v I get the following equation to predict velocity (ignoring friction, pressure droop, air resistance, linear accel...):

v = 1.25b x (Pd/m)^.5

Plugging in .75" bore and 2" stroke, 100 PSI, and assuming 32 oz for the ball+piston (wild guess),

I get:

v = 10.5 MPH... mmmmh

Looks like I need a greater bore and/or more PSI and stroke length.

Increasing bore to 4", stroke to 4", I get 79MPH. Which is iffy given the things I ignored.

unit conversions courtesy of my favorite: http://www.digitaldutch.com/unitconverter/

Register to Reply
Power-User

Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Brampton, ON, Canada
Posts: 218
Good Answers: 3
#12
In reply to #11

Re: Auto-Repeating Pneumatic Cannon

08/20/2008 2:24 PM

I've always found Parker www.parker.com to supply good stuff. Numatics, Bimba etc. are all very good.

Register to Reply
Anonymous Poster
#6

Re: Auto-Repeating Pneumatic Cannon

08/20/2008 8:41 AM

Along the same lines as this question: I need to get a pneumatic launcher for cricket balls to coach my Little Leauge cricket team of 10-12 year olds.

can anyone tell me if this is available .

I have seen 9 on TV) baseball batting practise machines which launch a baseball.

A cricket ball is about the same size as a baseball but about 4 ounces.

My email address is d_jacob9@yahoo.com for anyone who wants to direct a personal email.

I live in the Caribbean.

Register to Reply
2
Member

Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 8
Good Answers: 1
#7

Re: Auto-Repeating Pneumatic Cannon

08/20/2008 9:37 AM

Since you're launching baseballs, why not use a baseball pitching machine. Here's one that can be fitted with an automatic feed with adjustable pitching speed to over 100 mph.

http://www.pitching-machine-superstore.com/p/bata-bata-2-baseball-softball-combo-pitching-machine-pitching-machine

You can probably find a good used one for just a few hundred dollars.

Register to Reply Good Answer (Score 2)
Guru

Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Sebring, Florida
Posts: 923
Good Answers: 25
#9

Re: Auto-Repeating Pneumatic Cannon

08/20/2008 10:37 AM

I would like to launch a baseball ------ 60/90 mph ------

Repeat cycle every 2/10 sec.--------- will hit stop---------

I suggest that you stop right where you are! The repeated bouncing of the baseball against a stop with such force and then expecting it to return for the next revolution of excelleration and sudden impact in such a fast cycle will quickly destroy the baseball. I suggest that you try some other type of ball. Maybe a WHAMO BALL. IT BOUNCES WITH SUCH FORCE THAT AFTER HITTING THE STOP, it will assist gravity in returning it to the starting position. It will try to continue bouncing as the result of it's molecular structure. Balls used to play requet ball may also work. At any rate timing will be critical but less force will be needed after the system is set in motion.

TMF

__________________
The only problem with common sense, is that not very many people have it, or know how or when to use it.
Register to Reply
Anonymous Poster
#13

Re: Auto-Repeating Pneumatic Cannon

10/10/2008 12:44 AM

I remember when I was 10(early 60's), my dad an automobile mechanic, bought onto the little league field, something he and his mechanic buddys welded together. I'll do my best to describe it. It had a 1.5 HP Briggs and Stratin engine, belt driven air compressor unit, an air tank, switches, wires, car battery and an air pressure gauge. It was sitting in what looked like a letter "P" that had rotated to the right 90 degrees. The "tube" was not much larger than a baseball. The thing was painted bright RED. He wheeled it out to the pitching mound and hammed the stakes into the ground to hold it still. He pulled the rope to start it. We all stood there watching it run. He took one of the baseballs and pushed it into the barrel and took a fungo and pushed it in all the way down.

After 30 seconds, he takes ahold of the firing button connected by wire to the pitching machine and presses the button. We watch the thing shoot a ball with no apparant warning. The condensation smoke coming out afterwards was intimidating. He shoots a few more balls toward home to make sure it's lined up. He asked us who was going to be first to bat, we all moved away toward 1st base.

Just then Mr. Willis(Mike's dad) shows up from work to watch the team practice. My dad calls out to Mr. Willis to "show the girls how to hit". Mr. Willis sellects the biggest bat we have which is a 30" and puts a helmet on top of his head, not on his head cause it won't fit. He steps up to the plate.

Dad lets the engine run about a minute to build up enough pressure and tells Mr. Willis, "OK get ready, cause I'm going to push the button on "3". One.....Two....Three..... Blam....

Mr. Willis took his best cut at the ball, but unfortunately, the machine decided to shoot a huge "Screwball" way inside at testicle level.

We all ran toward home plate to see if Mr Willis was alive. He was because he was rolling around on the ground grunting.

Dad turned it off, pulled the stakes out of the ground and wheeled it toward the shed.

The thing was better suited to shoot flyballs to the outfielders.

BE CAREFULL!!!!

Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 5)
Guru
Hobbies - RC Aircraft - New Member Hobbies - Automotive Performance - New Member Hobbies - DIY Welding - New Member

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Fort Lauderdale Florida
Posts: 5708
Good Answers: 123
#14
In reply to #13

Re: Auto-Repeating Pneumatic Cannon

10/10/2008 4:25 PM

Great story. Do you still have it?

__________________
Bob
Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 5)
Register to Reply 14 comments

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

Anonymous Poster (2); aurizon (1); bob c (3); Kaywak (1); Non-ME (2); Poison (2); RATSSTAR (1); Toomuchfun (1); welderman (1)

Previous in Forum: How is a Bucket Elevator Used?   Next in Forum: Using Compressed Air to Push Water from a Well

Advertisement