One Manufacturer and a Half-Dozen Labels

Nothing will change. Every body will be waiting for the other guy to do it to see if it works.

Nothing will change. Every body will be waiting for the other guy to do it to see if it works. Reply Which part? Stopping the destructive practice of killing off small but successful businesses? Or the retention of knowledge necessary to continue being a leader among manufacturing countries. It has often been said "competition is good because it breeds improvement". When you kill off the competition, you also kill off innovation and improvements and ultimately growth in a positive direction. Increasing the bottom line may be good for a few individuals but ultimately the society as a whole may suffer.

"There was an important job to be done and Everybody was sure that Somebody would do it.

Anybody could have done it, but Nobody did it.

Somebody got angry about that because it was Everybody's job.

Everybody thought that Anybody could do it, but Nobody realized that Everybody wouldn't do it.

It ended up that Everybody blamed Somebody when Nobody did what Anybody could have done"

Who's on first?

I'd be happy, proud, elated, and ready to "buy American", if only I could.

We truly live in a world economy. Read that as "no matter the consequences in the long haul, we'll go to the lowest bidder, no matter about tomorrow, because the investors/share holders/banks/middlemen/CEO's/CFO's, all want a huge return on their money today.

Buying American will require a huge investment in widget factories that no one will ever buy into.

Sorry, that's all.

Now on to the subject.

Commonality is a good thing, if your making snow blowers or washing machines or cars.

GM has produced the Chevy pickup and the GMC pickup for years. They used to have different drivetrains and common sheet metal. Over the years, GMC's morphed into Chevys with a different name plate, because people weren't willing to pay for the GMC when the Chevy looked just like it. Never mind the guts.

Without rapid, coordinated, world wide change in the way business is conducted we are doomed to this "what have you done for me today" attitude.

Greed still prevails.

LL

Since I am not an American, let me rephrase that as "buy Domestic". But I echo the sentiment. I have worked in manufacturing most of my life. I have been involved in almost every aspect of manufacturing from the grunt on the production line to being part of management. Do not think I am proposing that we keep doing what we have always done and not change. I worked for an engineering firm at one time where the task was to find a better way. Or can we do the same but with less parts or cost or . . . whatever. However it dismays me to see the present trends. I worked for a company that was taken over and consolidated with two of our competitors. I saw the MBA management decimate the engineering work force. Six months later we had a major product problem and management demanded an instant fix. The new owners were not happy when they were informed that they had recently fired the only people who could have fixed the problem. They decided to drop sales activity in a certain market sector. I recommended this was not a good idea. I also recommended what could be done with an existing product to reach this market. Now five years later they belatedly realized they should have done so and are trying to regroup. Unfortunately their competitors had already gained a foot hold and now prove to be hard to compete with. Yes I realize we live in a global economy. I spend every day coping with the problems of creating CAD drawings for an asian work force so lacking in education they cannot read drawings and schematics that employ international symbology. I am constantly being told my designs cannot be built ( in Asia) because the asian workforce is not able to understand it. So the actual work must be done in North America. Unfortunately we are losing skilled but ageing workers from the North American work force and no one is replacing them. Then what? It can't be built over there but our workers are dying off from old age etc. Pretty soon no one will be able to build it.

The situation is about the same in Hungary. Skilled workforce is not a value anymore.

The machinists craft is doomed....regardless of the skill parametres one finds in CNC programmers and so-called set-up machinists the basic skills are fast disappearing. Unless they are replaced through viable apprenticeship programs RUN BY MACHINISTS and not some bell curving propped up educator, we can all kiss precision manufacturing goodbye...at least on this continent.

My apprentices came from the 'technical college'. Out of three one was capable of tying his shoelaces. The other two knew more about beer than simple arithmetic. I eventually bowed out of the apprenticeship program and finally found someone willing to learn.

This recession is going to have a more serious impact on the skills trade than anyone seems to think. A Talentless generation comes to mind.

That is what I am afraid of. The only reason manufacturing was able to be exported to other places in the world was because they relied on learning how from the centers of high tech manufacturing. This transfer of knowledge has not been completed nor has it been equally sucessful in all places. Just look at the amount of flawed and outright non functional products coming from these "cheap labour" countries. The return rate of defective products is quite high.

If the source of actual knowledge in a particular field is suddenly extinguished - then what? It will set back our society a hundred years.

I am probably the last generation of people who actually had a broad education in practical, hands-on, highschool and/or trade school level training.

In addition to taking chemistry, physics, and mathematics we took shop courses ranging from drafting to machining, to automechanics, to electrical and electronics. We designed a part in drafting, then made the wooden plug for a sand mold for casting the part in aluminum. After the part was cast, we machined it in machine shop, including gear teeth cutting etc. We built radios in electronic shop and learned to wire up houses and factories in electrical. Our electrical lab had a typical house section built inside the lab. We would drill holes, run wires and connect switches, outlets and lights, and feed them from a panel board. We also learned how to wire motor generators, and even built an electrical motor from scratch one year.

From what I'm told, this kind of high school education is a thing of the past. If people are no longer being trained correctly; we have begun the slide backwards into darkness.

Judging from the quality of stuff you find at Walmart, the factory staff now making products do not have that level of competence. So now we see a kind of shell game. One anonymous manufacturer produces a product and slaps on a brand name according to the purchase order. Marketing people try and gull the gullible public into thinking there is a real difference between these different brand names.

Sometimes the deception goes beyond just paint colour and decals. Superficial exterior trim and covers are used to change the appearance in the attempt to fool the public into thinking there are actually different manufacturers.

This dishonest practice should stop.

D.I.T.P. you have my full agreement.

Commonality is a good thing, if your making snow blowers or washing machines or cars.

GM has produced the Chevy pickup and the GMC pickup for years. They used to have different drivetrains and common sheet metal. Over the years, GMC's morphed into Chevys with a different name plate, because people weren't willing to pay for the GMC when the Chevy looked just like it. Never mind the guts.

REPLY

Good example! But I question if the GM practice is necessarily the best overall strategy. Detroit automakers have for some time been accused of not being at the forefront in engine development. The ubiqutous small block chevy engine being a good example. While GM continued to manufacture the same block for 40 years in virtually unchanged form, other manufactures explored ways and means to get better performance, either in less emissions or more power or whatever.

GM's concession to this trend was to chop off two cylinders and bring out the 4.3L V6. But inside its still the same small block chevy engine.

Honda and BMW and seveal other car makers have developed a number of alternatives. Some of which display much improved emissions or HP per weight or total weigh treduction or any number of comparison points.

You may be old enough to remember the days of Studebaker Silver hawk, Buick Skyhawk, Ford's Edsel and Chrysler Imperial "select shift" and the much improved steering system in Mercury Cougars. Going back a few decades there were a number of brands that had innovative engineering for their day that got killed off by the Detroit giants. Many of these innovations quietly got shelved and never survived as mainstream production design. In most cases it was not from being inferior but because it cost mor to make it. And the public being inundated by marketing that emphasized superficial appearance over built in quality got sucked into buying the lesser quality.

So now that we have toxic emissions, in fuel guzzling SUVs and our protectionist "consumer safety standards" I have to ask if this was really a good trend.

Generally speaking, chinese built clones are inferior to the originals but just barely meet the minimum emission standards.

Chinese clones often cannot be repaired because no spare parts are available.

Sometimes you can get parts by buying the parts from the original from which the chinese clones were copied but only if the clones are true copies (design and patent infringement)

More often, you are forced to scrap them entirely. The excuse being "its disposable" Sorry; but in light of dwindling resources, and increasing pollution from far east manufacturing facilities that would never meet north American anti pollution standards, I fail to see that as a bebefit to society as a whole.

Sadly I have to agree that "greed prevails".

BUT! in light of how this greed has now sparked a world wide recession which may still become a global depression, who in their right mind would argue that the greed of the few is justified or even excusable.

Tecumseh refused to build their engines in China and lost out on the consumer goods market.

Briggs and Strat have most of their engines built in China. Consumer product (eg, lawnmowers) costs plummeted. Tec couldn't compete and market shares plummeted. Briggs bought them out and destroyed Tecs product line. End of competition.

Too Bad! I have a Tec engine that's been running hard for 22 years.

Actually, most Briggs and Straton engines are manufactured in the US. One of their biggest plants is located in Murray, KY where I went to college. Briggs & Stratton only has one plant located in China.

http://www.fool.com/investing/small-cap/2007/10/19/briggs-strattons-engine-sputters.aspx

That's good to know. The ones I've seen have all been on cheap lawnmowers selling out of large type stores. I bought one which ran for a day. The replacement was much better.....it ran for a week. After the third replacement I traded up for a Honda type which runs like crap...also a knockoff.

It seems that you have had some lousy luck. Perhaps you were unfortunate enough to purchase an engine that was put together here in Kentucky on some temporary worker's first day.

On the other hand, I bought a Troy Built 20" push mower with a Briggs and Stratton engine two years ago, and so far it cuts well (as fast as I care to push it while mowing a 3/4 acre lot) and usually starts on the first pull. It came with a "2-pull guarantee" for the first two years, so I am expecting the engine to lock up this spring and for all softer materials to disintegrate by early summer.

Had Made in China stickered on. Same with the Honda knockoff.

Begger thy neighbour say it all.

jt.

(if I don't buy his work he cannot buy mine.)

It happens in every industy years ago many auto lift makers were around selling quality lifts at a standard range now Dover corp is buying up all the small companies and then letting them go under, or selling the cheap lifts under a different label. wich they dont allow their Rotary distributors to carry. total bs

talk about unskilled workers too, dont get me started weve gone from generation y to generation x to generation que?. no one can even reed a safty lable on the products they use yet alone have the inclination to better them selves at thieir jobs they just show up and cash their cheks.. unskilled workers is from unskilled minds and societies that put no importance on self improvment , its just how little can i do today and still get paid..wtf and then the company goes under ..

shouldent OSHA require every one working somewhere EVEN A FRY COOK be able to read poison and safty lables..

lots of worms in brains in califonia, miss diagnosed as tumors , not a epidemic but an upward trend in numbers,,please no one can read a lable or learn to wash thier hands.. come on OSHA step up to the dinner plate.

NEXT WE DISCUSS WORLD HUNGER AND THE FAILURE OF CELBRITIES TO MAKE A LASTING DIFFERENCE...

After the flood God told Noah he would never again destroy the world's population.. Well of course not! He knew we would eventually do the job ourselves. The decline of the Roman empire was just a practice run. Now we are ready to do the job for real. First we create a global recession. Then deepen it onto a depression. Then all the megalomaniacs will get out their nuclear arsenal and then . . . . T.S. Elliot was right. . . . . not with a bang but a whimper. ( its not my fault)