Previous in Forum: Sizing Pulsation Dampeners   Next in Forum: Heating Water for Pool
Close
Close
Close
7 comments
Rate Comments: Nested
Active Contributor

Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 12
Good Answers: 2

How Much Would an Unusual Beam Bend?

10/09/2009 10:50 AM

Hi yall. I have a question about a sign and a sign mount I'm installing on the wife's store. She had this triangular "beam" made at the local woodworking shop, It has a base of about three feet wide, and the length from the base to the peak is about four feet. The thing is four inches thick. She wants it installed over the door, with the three foot wide base attached to the front of the building, and that four foot dimension hanging out, and I have a sign to attach to it.

I can attach it really good to the front of the building, so it won't flex much at the mounting, but I was wandering if there is a way to figure how much it might bend down where the sign hooks on. My late kid was an engineering student, and I was looking through her school books, and there are some formulas which can figure this, but they are for things like I-beams, pipe, square and rectangular tube; I reckon what you would call standard types.

I would appreciate any kind of help yall could provide.

Register to Reply
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.
Guru
Technical Fields - Technical Writing - New Member Engineering Fields - Marine Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Vancleave, Ms about 30 miles inland from Biloxi and the coast
Posts: 3197
Good Answers: 106
#1

Re: How much would an unusual beam bend?

10/09/2009 11:28 AM

Depends on the weight of the sign. Is the triangle apex pointing up or down? Point down for strength. It sounds like it would be ok as long as the sign is not too heavy.

__________________
Mr.Ron from South Ms.
Register to Reply
Guru
United States - Member - USA! Hobbies - Musician - Sound Man Engineering Fields - Mechanical Engineering - More than a Hobby Technical Fields - Technical Writing - New Member

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: City of Roses.
Posts: 2056
Good Answers: 101
#2

Re: How much would an unusual beam bend?

10/09/2009 12:49 PM

When calculating wood, it's not cut and dry like steel. Wood has many imperfections, and each piece of wood is unique. One small knot, or fracture in the grain of the wood can cause it to act in strange ways.

What is the weight of the sign?

What type of wood are you using for the beam?

Are you attaching the sign with two attachment points on the beam, or one on the tip of the beam?

I'm assuming this sign will hang over the heads of the customers and pedestrians walking down the sidewalk, so certain precautions should be taken to avoid a lawsuit. I would think a 4" Dia, 4' long triangular style beam should be ok for an average sign, and the amount of bending should be negligible. But this will depend on the sign you intend to hang on it. I wouldn't hand a 1/2" thick 36"x36" hunk of plate steel on it. But a nice Di-Bond sign, or plastic/fiberglass sign should be fine.

Generally I would figure out what will support the sign then at least double it.

__________________
Don't believe everything you read on the Internet!
Register to Reply
Guru
Engineering Fields - Manufacturing Engineering - New Member Hobbies - Target Shooting - New Member United States - Member - New Member Hobbies - Hunting - New Member

Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Charlotte, NC USA
Posts: 791
Good Answers: 17
#3

Re: How much would an unusual beam bend?

10/09/2009 2:14 PM

The type of wood it crucial, crucial, also you need to have it treated correctly for UV. I made the error with white oak one time and completely ruined my project (porch glider), because of UV.

I've seem some basic strengths of materials for wood, where was that?? Oh yea, some excerpts here, strongest wood material red oak, followed closely by white oak, then hickory.. but there are too many variables to predict stain and breaking point.

Good Luck

Laby

__________________
Be careful of what you wish for .....
Register to Reply
Associate

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Arizona, almost in Sonora. Previously Alaska, Montana, Minnesota.
Posts: 25
Good Answers: 1
#4

Re: How much would an unusual beam bend?

10/09/2009 3:05 PM

Sorry, but you have too little info here to get a good evaluation by a structural engineer, whose business it is to calculate what you wish to learn. Go find one in the yellow pages, show him the actual objects you wish to use, and pay for about an hour of his time to calculate things like moments of inertia, stress distribution, and lifetime maintenance requirements.

As an alternative, construct a full-size replica of the set-up and load it with at least three times your expected design load. If it does not break or distort, go with it.

__________________
It seemed like a good idea, at the time!
Register to Reply
Guru
United States - Member - USA! Hobbies - Musician - Sound Man Engineering Fields - Mechanical Engineering - More than a Hobby Technical Fields - Technical Writing - New Member

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: City of Roses.
Posts: 2056
Good Answers: 101
#5
In reply to #4

Re: How much would an unusual beam bend?

10/09/2009 5:15 PM

But even in the replica, Its quite hard to replicate the exact grain structure of the wood... thats why you need to triple the load to err on the safe side.

Yes, Carver is correct in saying there is too little information to provide an actual analysis of your project, from an engineering perspective.

But on the other hand, Your just hanging a sign right? Ther is no harm in complete overkill, just make all the extras look perty. Just DONT under build it.

__________________
Don't believe everything you read on the Internet!
Register to Reply
Guru
Popular Science - Weaponology - bwire Hobbies - Car Customizing - New Member

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Upper Mid-west USA
Posts: 7498
Good Answers: 97
#6

Re: How Much Would an Unusual Beam Bend?

10/09/2009 11:42 PM
__________________
If death came with a warning there would be a whole lot less of it.
Register to Reply
Guru
Hobbies - DIY Welding - New Member

Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1601
Good Answers: 58
#7

Re: How Much Would an Unusual Beam Bend?

10/10/2009 10:06 AM

To even begin to answer your question, one would need to know whether the 3' long dimension is intended to be horizontal or vertical when installed. One would also need to know the weight of the sign, and details about the consrtuction of the beam. (I doubt it's a single piece of wood). Are you only interested in the deflection of the sign, or also the strength of the assembly. The building the assembly is attached to will also influence the amount of deflection. If it is attached (for example) to wood siding, the siding will flex and contribute to deflection of the sign. You might also want to consider wind loads. Once more details are known or assumed, the calculations are simple. Because there is an element of safety involved, you won't find many on this web site who ore willing to make assumptions about your problem.

Register to Reply
Register to Reply 7 comments
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

bwire (1); carver35 (1); Labyguy (1); ronseto (1); RVZ717 (2); welderman (1)

Previous in Forum: Sizing Pulsation Dampeners   Next in Forum: Heating Water for Pool

Advertisement