1993 Honda Accord - Won't Start in Cold Weather

I trust that this car has an automatic choke that doesn't close properly when the temperature falls. You can probably observe it by removing the air cleaner or airduct immediately above the carburetor. A bi-metal spring probably activates it, and can probably be adjusted.

Tell me how my suppositions work out.

Well, it's not carbureted. I don't know if you supposition will apply then.

two things to try - if it's an automatic, move the shifter from Park to Neutral. if it starts, then the problem is in the shift select switch at the shifter (in the console). another thing is to first turn the key to the run position (don't crank the car). one of the dash lights that come on but go off after 3 to 5 seconds (i believe it's the check engine light, it comes on and goes off when the key is turned on as a 'bulb check').... anyway, the second that light goes out you should hear a click from under the dash. that click is your main relay working. if you don't hear the click, the main relay is failing. typically you can keep turning the key off and on til eventually you hear the click - this only works for so long. eventually not at all. **** these things take just a few seconds to check w/o popping the hood. if they help, great. if not, the hood needs to be popped and you need to determine if it's missing spark or if it's missing fuel. there is a hot wax idle control valve on the car but it shouldn't keep the car from starting. it could keep if from idling properly when cold though **** i worked on hondas professionally for quite a while, it's just been a few years.

Also, the starter turns over. The battery is also months old.

i was the guest that responded to you.

starter turns over, forget the shifter switch.

the main relay either working or not working has nothing to do with the startER circut, but everything to do with the startING (read:fuel system) circut. hopefully that makes sense.

so.. if your engine cranks but doesn't start, but it's capable (in your case, in warmer temperatures) of starting and running properly, then engine cam/crank timing are in check and compression is ok enough.

so... when it doesn't start - is it missing spark or is it missing fuel ?

that's your question that needs answered.

* why are you not taking it back to the shop that did the work to have them glance over what they did and diagnose the problem for you ?

* the distributor probably cured your erratic tach problem - did it ?

"why are you not taking it back to the shop that did the work to have them glance over what they did and diagnose the problem for you ?"

I'm afraid that will cost $85 that I am not able to shell out right now.

New symptom. Today it started for about 4 seconds. I gave it a bit of gas over those seconds to just keep the revs up and then it just died again. I haven't been able to start it since with the same symptoms. I'm going to try and get to autozone or something to get some carb cleaner. Is a new gasket absolutely necessary?

Would oil in the distributor cause the bouncing tach?

bouncy tack ...look for grounding failure or weak voltage other than right at the battery

the bouncy tach problem normally arises from the ignition module, which it seems is either sold with the distributor or comes with a new distributor (most likely why it got replaced). seems those also had problems with distributor shaft seal leakage causing distributor to fill up with oil (as much as it could anyway before leaking out). i remember replacing probably 20 or so of those - but that was about 10 years ago, so my memory has kinda faded as to the specifics.

i was thinking possibly ground though - the outside temperature temperature thing though doesn't 100% plug into that theory.

there are a few ground areas either at/around the thermostat housing, back or side of the cylinder head or on top of the transmission that would be the ones to look for regarding the engine management.

I used to own a 95 Accord that did the same thing. Never did find the problem (or bother to check!)

I agree with mr. HP, if the starter motor is turning and the car is turning over in warmer weather, also given the age of your vehicle, I would think it is something fairly obvious. Idle control valve, maybe, I dont know enough to comment.

Try a Tune up, clean and gap the sparks, clean the air filter, maybe lube the throttle. I'd throw in some gas line antifreeze and fuel cleaner (maybe not at the same time) to attempt to declog your old injectors. If you do get it running, fill your next tank with highest grade fuel for one fill, this will help clean out the gunk.

Start with that because it should be done anyway, then if problem isn't solved look into idle control valve and the other $1000 job the mechanic will want to fix!

Good luck ,let us know about your progress

I am not a mechanic, however if you are using a high grade oil, the vehicle should start like it is summer in cold weather.

Are you using a synthetic?

You will notice a difference if not.

My recommendation is Schaeffer Oil. www.schaefferoil.com

There is a dealer locator on this site.

They also have a fuel additive called Soy Ultra. Use it in you gas tank and see if there is a difference.

Trying these products are cheaper than some of the repairs mentioned. If it doesn't solve your starting problem, you should still gain a few mpg increase.

Not a diesel is it? Just kidding. I've heard the names Idle Control Valve, Idle air controller, and idle air valve controller, or some variation of those. A bad idle control valve can cause these symptoms. But...

It could also be the "fast idle control" which is located near the idle air valve and can cause similar symptoms.

Is the check engine light on? If the valve is bad it would probably cause the engine light to come on.

Also, check the coolant level. I've heard a low coolant level can cause air pockets in the cooling system that can mess with the temperature sensor which would then effect idle. Its quick and easy. If the coolant level is low, add some and check it periodically, if the level goes down then there's a leak.

Less likely would be the alternator and battery. An alternator going bad can produce the awkward idle. If the alternator is going, it can hurt the battery. You can have them tested for a small fee or even free at most car part stores or mechanics.

I have also heard that some cars have sensors that relay tach information to to fuel pump so it stops pumping in the event of something like a crash. Could that be the case here?

Its possible some faulty sensor is causing it. There may be a way to test for that but I don't know any and I'm not sure what sensor(s) connect the tach and fuel pump. Some Google searchin' may be in order. Basically, I don't know.

There is an adjustment screw on the valve. It may just need adjustment, but the engine needs to run until it reaches normal, operating temperature. I doubt that's the problem but its good to check the simple stuff first.

If you're a do-it-yourselfer, there is a short procedure to check the IACV.

What is this short procedure to check the IACV?

have you listened for the main relay making contact like i asked you to? if it doesn't click the second the engine check light cycles off after your key is turned to run - it is impossible for the car to start. you'll hear it if it makes contact - it's right above the brake pedal bracket (give or take a few inches).

this is not a generic, 'my old ford was this way, so maybe your car is to' question. this 100% specifically applies to your HONDA.

how many miles does this car have on it? did it die while driving or was doing fine til you parked it and now it won't start?

I haven't heard it. What is that click making contact to?

The car didn't start after I parked it. It did start earlier today for about 4 seconds then died. Could the main relay be the cause of the tach problem as well?

ok.

get in the car.

shut the door.

make sure the radio isn't on and no outside noises are present.

put you key in the ignition.

turn the key to the run position. (do not crank the car, just to the run position)

notice that as you turn your key to that point, some dash lights will illuminate.

when the red one goes out, the check engine light, you can hear a faint but audible click from just above where your feet are if the relay is working.

* they didn't try to make it to where you can hear it necessarily - you just can.

if you don't hear that very slight click, providing you can hear reasonably well, then the relay is bad.

i've been in cars that were brought to the shop, that upon trying to start them and realizing the relay was bad, i've had to turn the key back off and then to run, back off and then to run ............ 25 to 30 times before i heard it make contact (click). the second that it clicked i would proceed to crank it and it'd fire right up - i'd then pull it into the shop and change the relay.

* my family owns/runs a large honda & acura repair shop. i'm sure that during the time i worked there as a tech, we replaced no less than 250 to 300 of those relays. i'm not saying it is your problem, i'm telling you that it could be and in detail how to check it.

* the relay has nothing to do with the tach.

* i mean no offense when i say this, but you don't sound to mechanically inclined. you might be best to let someone who knows what they're doing look at your car.

I got in this morning an I heard the click. Relay is still functional.

Where is the engine speed sensor?

As far as I know there is no "engine speed sensor". I think the tachometer serves that purpose. The tach does send a signal to the Ignition Control Module, in the distributor. There is a vehicle speed sensor, it sends a signal to the ECU and speedometer.

I can not find any info on the location of the speed sensor other than the following website, but it is for the 94 accord:

http://autorepair.about.com/library/images/bl723a-lib.htm

I have the Haynes manual for my 92 as well as the shop manual and neither give a location.

I have a 94 honda accord with similair trouble at times fuel pump cycles for 2 seconds wont start though if i leave the key on eventually the cel goes off. I have replaced fuel pump relay already. If I spray carb cleaner in throttle body it will start till it is consumed . Problem is very intermitant more off than on when it does start you can drive it and it does not stop running. I suspect that fuel pump is not getting its consatant voltage signal but dont know how to check for that symton.

Any updates?

Hopefully we didn't overwhelm with info and suggestions.

So, updates.

I got the car started and it starts consistently now. I pulled off the idle air control valve and sprayed some carb cleaner in and let it dry then replaced it and it started right up. The Engine Light is now off.

The tach still bounces up under acceleration. When its really cold it will bog down under acceleration. What do you think the cause of this is?

Thanks for all your help

First, I would do a few simple, cheap and easy checks. A faulty PCV valve can cause these symptoms. Its a cheap item, about $2, and easy to replace. The wrong spark plug gap will cause bogging under acceleration so check that. Also, bleed any air out of the coolant system. Air bubbles can effect the thermostat which effects idle.

Since it does it only when cold, I would suspect the Fast Idle-Thermal Valve (FITV), especially if it corrects itself after it warms up since the FITV will close when normal, operating temp is reached. I believe it is located to the right of the IACV (if you're standing in front of the car looking at the engine). You can adjust this valve by removing the cap and turning the screw. I would do this only after the previous items are checked.

Does the engine rev with the tach?

I was wrong about the tach being mechanical in my previous post. The tach gets its signal from a sensor in the distributor. If the tach is bouncing around on its own, i.e. the engine speed doesn't change, it could be a problem with the sensor. Unfortunately, you can't replace just the sensor and a new distributor will hurt your wallet. If the engine doesn't rev up and down with the tach bouncing, it could point to the sensor.

Were you able to get any codes from the ECU while the engine light was on?

Update:

It didn't start for a good while then I replaced the ignition coil because I was not getting a spark at the plugs or distributor. It started right up for a day then failed to start this morning. Again, no spark. Could there be a sensor denying power to the coil? What other situations could explain this?

Refresher: New Coil, New Distributor and Distributor Cap, New plugs and wires, cleaned IACV with carb cleaner. Battery Fine. Starter Motor fine. Fuel Pump sounds like its working. No spark. Engine Light On.

My earlier reply, the first, is obviously that of a guy who hasn't kept up with auto mechanics since he fixed the clutch on his '65 Ford F 100. these new electronic whizz-bangers are far beyond my old fashioned ideas!

The DTC codes are 14 and 15 which mean "Idle air control valve or bad ECM" and "Ignition output signal".