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Posts: 9

star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/08/2010 12:04 AM

dear all,

On 5th april 2010 , Electrical Preventive maintenance was done on ash handling compressor -1.

The following works was done

1. Cleaning the compressor motor,

2. cleaning of the blower motor,

3. Checking the tightness of the terminals

4. Checking the main contactor,

5. Insulation resistance >550 mega ohm equal in all phase to earth.

6. Winding resistance = 0.13 ohm equal in all phase.

The trial run was taken , the motor was started and tripped suddenly. The indication in the local panel was "FC " and the motor overl. The electrical engineer checked the motor insulation resistance >550 Megaohm and winding resistance = 0.2 ohm.Opened the contactor and checked, it is normal.

1 litre of oil was filled .

When they started the motor , our auxiliary transformer got tripped due to earth fault..The plant Block out was ocurred.

Specification:

The compressors make INGERSOLL RAND

Capacity - 125 HP

Voltage - 440 V

Current - 146.6 A

RPM - 1785

P.F - 0.87

Frequency - 60 HZ

Connection - star delta

overload setting for the motor - 145 A

Incomer breaker details for the compressor -1

Make : siemens

Type: 3WT8

In - 800 A

SETTINGS

Inverse time delay overload tripping Ir - 0.8 x In

Short time short circuit tripping Isd - 3 x Ir

instataneous short circuit I1 > 15 In

Earth fault tripping Ig - 0.3 x In

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Guru
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#1

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/08/2010 12:27 AM

You have an 800A power breaker protecting a 125HP motor???

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#2
In reply to #1

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/08/2010 12:49 AM

yes that is for main breaker 800 A,

for that individual feeder , motor protection of 145 A overload relay

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Guru
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#3

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/08/2010 3:01 AM

<.....the motor was started and tripped suddenly.....auxiliary transformer got tripped due to earth fault...>

Then there is an earth fault. Chase it down and eliminate it.

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Power-User
India - Member - design engineer Engineering Fields - Electrical Engineering - New Member United Arab Emirates - Member - New Member

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#4

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/08/2010 4:24 AM

like mr jraef has said why r u providing a 800a protective breaker for tht motor....may be this s the reason for overload ..........can u provide a little more detail on transformer........?if there s an earth fault, then probably u should check for insulation of the wires or some short cicuits between neutral n phase.......also can u provide the details abt the contactors used ???? ..........

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#5
In reply to #4

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/08/2010 5:31 AM

we are using incomer for motor is 800A, but the motor has seperate protection such as thermal overload relay eventhough the motor also burnt

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Power-User
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#6
In reply to #5

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/08/2010 6:01 AM

may be its bcoz of high short circuit......have u consulted wit anyone regarding breaker sc capacity......?

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#7
In reply to #5

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/08/2010 6:58 AM

The motor burnt? ie there was a phase- earth fault in the motor itself? How come it passed the megger twice?

And you are in HT motor either (440V). I also assume that didn't put a 60Hz motor in 50Hz line (may not be so much of problem, but the otherway round may overload it a bit)

Off-topic: your FLA is 146.6A, but OL setting is 145A?

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#8
In reply to #7

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/08/2010 10:14 PM

yes the motor is LT motor (440v),and it is 60 HZ

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Anonymous Poster
#9
In reply to #4

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/13/2010 1:00 AM

800 A breaker is the incomer to the compressor feeder. In compressor feeder we are setted 145 A thermal overload relay, single phase preventer. eventhough the motor burnt.

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Guru

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#10

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/13/2010 1:23 AM

Could a post the problem more clearly.There are lot of loose ends which I am unable to to relate.For example 1 litre oil was filled?did the motor fail or only transformer tripped.I think you have a compressor in shhet steel enclosure coupled with motor.What is the service factor?Pl Pl post the problem clearly.

regards

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Anonymous Poster
#11
In reply to #10

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/13/2010 5:03 AM

ok,

for the compressor 1 litre oil was filled. this was after happened after 2 times the motor got tripped due to overload.

befor starting the motor we checked the megger>550 m ohm and winding resistance as 0.13 ohms

so we started the motor for the third time . at that time the motor got burnt and our auxiliary transformer got tripped due to earth fault

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Guru

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#12
In reply to #11

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/13/2010 6:15 AM

So that is it.You have started the motor continuously under hot condition.Every motor is suitable for certain number of hot and cold starts .Normally it is 3 cold starts and 2 hot starts .Cold starts means machine under ambient condition.Hot is when machine is swiched or tripped while running with full load and at rated temp rise over ambient.You should have allowed a rest of 45 Min (Check manufacturers cooling curve)Normally in new machines 30 min cooling is ok.Continuous starts means continuously starting current flowing.One question did it trip after switching to delta or in star?some times if switching over is delayed motor cannot accelerate inder star condition and may trip.Since the machine was in hot condition thermal overload must have tripped and repeated attemps to start must have lead to the failure .By the way have u got a fly wheel on the motor shaft?One one by one if we analyse it will not be a simple application .

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Guru

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#13
In reply to #11

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/13/2010 6:22 AM

You have probably exceeded the no of starts permissible under hot condition.Every motor has what is known as no of cold and hot starts.In normal case it is 3 cold and 2 hot starts in an hour.After 2nd start motor should be allowed to cool down .A rest of 30 min to 45 min is essential ( See manufacturers cooling time curve)Further do you have a fly wheel mounted on the motor shaft?Did it trip after changing to delta or in star?I presume you are using a automatic star delta star.With the available details one can conclude that permitted temp rise has been exceeded due to repeated starts leading to failure.Probably the tripping was on thermal overload which was ignored.

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#14
In reply to #13

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/13/2010 4:35 PM

we are not not using fly wheel mounted on shaft. we are using automatic star delta starter.after the motor burnt we found our main contactor R,y.B phase was melted and the star contactor also melted. nothing happened to delta contactor. also thermal overload relay also burned.

ok the motor got burnt.because of high current,the incomer breaker for the compressor motor 800 A not tripped. our auxiliary transformer breaker in LT side 4000 A is also not tripped, HT side is tripped due to earth fault

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Guru

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#15
In reply to #14

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/14/2010 1:22 AM

So the motor was in star and could not accelearte the load and failed.As regards other relays and protection one cannot comment unless we go through the whole relay grading and coordination scheme.

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#16
In reply to #15

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/14/2010 5:52 AM

how suddenly it cannot acccelerate the load. the motor was run just before 1 day ago

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Guru

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#17
In reply to #16

Re: star delta starter , the power plant block out

04/14/2010 9:10 AM

Because starter failed to switch over to delta.The star gives only1/3 torque and in delta motor will give rated torque.You are using the star delta starter to minise duration for which starting current persists.

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Users who posted comments:

alagirisamyv (3); Anonymous Poster (5); JRaef (1); nesubra (5); PWSlack (1); SHAMITHGAMBHIR1 (2)

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