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Oil In Radiator

05/18/2010 7:10 PM

I have a 1988 Mazda 2200 - I got oil in the water radiator - No water in the oil - It has a 5 speed manual transmission - Some in the overflow bottle also. It has some blue smoke and it smokes a little when first started but quits quickly - after it warms up Can anyone tell me what it is or how to fix..

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#1

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/18/2010 7:20 PM

In order of expense, head gasket failure, cracked head, cracked block.

I'd join a Mazda forum and ask them how to fix it.

There are people here who will give you advice.

You may also get advice from a cat, squirrel, extraterrestrial, gremlin and flower here.

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#2

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/18/2010 7:23 PM

Thank you for your time and expertise... I will explore more in the Mazda forum...

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#3

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/18/2010 7:50 PM

Most likely a bad head gasket. Could also be a warped head. Have you overheated it recently?

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#4

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/18/2010 8:06 PM

My first question for you, is: What changed since the Mazda ran correctly?

The very first thing I would do if I was you is to loosen the radiator cap so that no pressure will build up in the radiator. This will keep any pressurized water from getting into the engine oil system when you shut off the engine, and the water pressure becomes higher than the oil pressure.

It is time to remove the spark plugs and check compression, both dry, and with a squirt of oil in the cylinder. write down each cylinder's readings.

Inspect the spark plugs for signs of rust, or iron deposits on each of the spark plugs inside ceramic insulator.

More information will also help. What engine is in it? How much mileage? What color is the oil you find in the radiator?

The smoke may be nothing more than valve guide seals. Oil in the water could be an inadvertent error on someone else's part.

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#5

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/19/2010 4:04 AM

as they have all said Head Gasket

and if it has an oil cooler as part of the radiator that could be leaking.

Head Gasket Is Favorite though

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#6

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 1:58 AM

Seems you've been given a warning. This is seriuos, stop using the vehicle until a dertermination or cause is discovered. Do a compression test.

Likely there is a cracked head or head gasket issue or someone put oil in the water.

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#7

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 4:00 AM

I think an important point has been overlooked here. It is very unusual to find oil in the water, but no water in the oil. As has been mentioned, the usual cause of these problems is a faulty head gasket, cracked head, etc. But once the barrier between oil and water circuits is breached, it is usual for the water to travel, not the oil, since water has a very much lower viscosity (about 0.32cps at 90degC) and is under higher pressure. Having said that, I'm afraid I don't have any answers. I would normally be less concerned about oil in the water than vice versa as it would not compromise engine/bearing lubrication, and would only affect cooling if there was so much oil that it impedes circulation, but there is clearly a problem, and it is puzzling.

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#14
In reply to #7

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 9:24 AM

Unless of course the oil is under higher pressure than the water, then you have the Gulf oil spill in your car. (As in the oil galleries passing from the block up to the camshaft bearings in the head are under pressure in all likelihood higher than the cooling system pressure.)

I wouldn't waste any time yanking the head off (after checking the oil cooler, if it has one).

Good luck on your quest.

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#8

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 7:05 AM

Happened to my car when it overheated because of a faulty thermostat. Your problem is caused by a bad or damaged engine gasket. Good luck with the repair.

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#9

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 7:35 AM

It sounds like bad valve seals. The blue smoke is burning oil. The smoking at start-up and then clearing of smoke is caused by the thermal expansion of the valve seal, making it "re-seal" itself. If you are not losing water/coolant then it is most likely not a head gasket or warpage issue. A compression test (follow a srevice manual's instructions) will point you in the correct direction. But, you should not drive the car untill you diagnose the problem.

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#10

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 7:41 AM

To all here who are more familiar with the Mazda 2200 series vehicles, is there an oil cooler in the radiator?

Oil cooler failures commonly are small enough to allow only pressurized oil to travel into the lower pressure of the cooling system, but not back in the other direction.

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#11

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 7:48 AM

Had a 1978 Datsun 610, Same problem you have. I had a heater hose let go and it over heated, that's when my problem started. Installed a new head gasket. No luck. Removed the head and had it checked for cracks and resurfaced. No Luck. All that was left was to change the engine and the car was not worth it, so I took out the thermostat so it would not heat up to operating temp (made it worse), skimmed off the oil every couple of months and drove it for about 3 years. I ended up driving it to the junk yard. Bottom line: Unless you can do the work yourself, install another engine or live with it.

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#12

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 8:00 AM

I'm a former owner of a Mazda B2200 pickup (1989), and from experience with that truck it appears that your valve guides may be a little too worn and in need of replacement. Check them out before you rip the head off the engine as it'll save you some money in the long run. Possibly you could try an oil additive to help out the top end of the engine to prevent the passage of oil during the warm-up period and until the valve guides (seals) warm-up and expand enough to stop oil passage......

There are several good products on the market that'll help the top end leakages......you can find a whole host of them even at Walmart.

BTW, how many miles on the engine? Year of manufacture? Great little trucks and nearly indestructible! Wish I still had mine...when I finally sold it (during a divorce) the Odo read over 165,000 miles with nearly zip repair work on the truck the entire time owned it (13 years).

Hope this helps you out!

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#13

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 8:50 AM

Are you still with us?

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#15

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 9:26 AM

The Pistons and motoring engine block, had been overhitted, due to negligible, ignorance of dry and overhit-radiator and consequently the paddings, which demarcates, distinguished chambers within the piston, V-Block, has been lacerated, to leakage and invariably connecting to the radiator.

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#16
In reply to #15

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 9:53 AM

Let me get this straight now. The paddings on the pistons have been forced through the V-block and into the radiator cousing leakage and overhit?

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#17
In reply to #16

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 10:03 AM

No wot e sed wus V-block as bin lacerated.

the chambers are distinguished

which demarcates, distinguished chambers within the piston ( ive no idea wot this means)

And is rad is overhit

And a leek is conected to the radiator

simple really

The Pistons and motoring engine block, had been overhitted, due to negligible, ignorance of dry and overhit-radiator and consequently the paddings, which demarcates, distinguished chambers within the piston, V-Block, has been lacerated, to leakage and invariably connecting to the radiator

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#18
In reply to #17

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 10:13 AM

Sorry, it must have been my accent.

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#19
In reply to #18

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 10:15 AM

Oooo Arrrr it Mite Beeeee.

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#28
In reply to #17

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 5:17 PM

Making sure to sticking head under bonnet for inspecting distinguished chamber leakaging, not to have clownish neighbour honking of the hooter, which will be causing laceration of head from sharp edge of bonnet underside, due to reaction from loud report.

This to cause emittance of heckzoot pip.

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#29
In reply to #28

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 5:36 PM

"not to have clownish neighbour honking of the hooter, which will be causing laceration of head from sharp edge of bonnet underside, due to reaction from loud report"

Ah they do that in the states as well.

After a few years you get used to that and stop reacting

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#34
In reply to #29

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/21/2010 9:42 AM

Indeed,

I had a variation of that pulled on me while standing on a carrier flight deck, with my back to the island (superstructure).

I had always wondered how loud the ships foghorn (Steam powered, about six feet long and 3 feet in diameter at the business end) would be.

Now I know what the term "Blow me down" means.

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#20

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 11:00 AM

This is not an area I possess enough knowledge in to be of any help. Having replaced my own radiators several times in the past I would only comment are you sure that what your are observing is oil and not transmission fluid? The transmission in some cars is cooled by sending the transmission fluid through a portion of the radiator.

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#22
In reply to #20

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 11:42 AM

Your life experiences more than qualify you for this discussion. The OP did say that his vehicle was a manual transmission, and the type of oil cooler you are referring to is only used on automatic transmissions. Had the OP responded to the question of oil color, we would all have had a better picture of the problem.

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#21

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 11:10 AM

If your car has a Catalytic converter, you would normally never see oil smoke as the cat should "burn it all up prperly", so I am assuming from what you said that the car does not have a cat at all......so is it worth investing even 1 red cent in?

I would junk it immediately.......22 years old, burning oil + leaks = Money.

Also, if it hasn't got a cat, its not very good for the environment either.....

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#23
In reply to #21

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 11:45 AM

WHAT? Just because I did not have a cat for a number of years you want to throw me out? What about the 3 dogs and 2 birds, don't I get any slack for them? Wow. What a tough crowd!

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#24
In reply to #23

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 11:52 AM

LOL

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#25
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Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 12:00 PM

My wife's car is 39 years old, and hasn't got a cat, but it is very good for the environment as it makes the world a better place, and makes us smile! It also has very little to go wrong with it, it is a dream to maintain and to work on, it costs me no road tax or depreciation and insurance is cheap. Being an old air-cooled Beetle it also has no radiator.

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#26
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Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 1:09 PM

Why did you also not mention that it has no head on or side on impact resistance, even from the rear and that your wife will either be horribly disfigured or even dead if anyone runs into her, or she herself even causes an accident!!! As good as no crash resistance....You can get lucky, many have, but do you want to take chances?

I have seen a few of these cars after a severe accident over the years, the only car worse than a Beetle in a crash today is the east German Trabant, but there are few of them still around......

My wife and my children are banned from small cars, older cars and the like for the reasons mentioned above because I don't want any of them injured or killed as far as possible, eg. they have the best chance of escaping serious injury that I can pay for.....nothing less is acceptable to me.

But, if you are hoping to be able to get a new wife/girlfriend at some point, then she is in the best car for just that!!!

But I see no reason to be proud of using an old car as daily transport for any reason at all.

As an old timer, only on summer Sundays well you may have a point, but even that is not for us....

I looked at the world's accident statistics a few months ago (can't find the link at this time) and you would think that the USA with its relatively low driving speeds would be one of the best places to have an accident/drive. Well statistically its one of the worst of the western countries, but I cannot imagine why.....but be warned....

Each to his own......

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#27

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 3:25 PM

I had this same thing happen to a 1967 Chevrolet Chevelle Malabu with a 260 inline six engine. It started to be a little bit of oil at first but it would eventually build up till the engine started to run warm and we would pull over at a station and flush the radiator with water and go again. After a few days it got to where the car would not make but a few miles without running hot and the water in the radiator would look like milk because the oil was under pressure and hot enough to emulsify with the water and the longer the eng1ne ran the thicker it got until it ran hot.

Well I knew the car had set up all winter before and was hoping the cold weather had not frozen and cracked the block or head. I went over my situation with several mechanics and I got many different opinions but all the mechanics agreed that the problem pretty much had to be a leaking head gasket, cracked head or block. My engine never did run bad it just got to the point that the oil filled radiator would not cool the engine and all the service stations around town got tired of me flushing the milky oil from my radiator. After having a test done that determine the head and gasket were good I decided the engine was ruined and I retired the car to my dad's pasture. It sat there with 2 other Chevy Malibu's and other old cars and trucks until my dad sold them many years later for scrap at a fraction of their worth .

Your engine is nothing like the one I had in this car other than maybe having spark plugs and being water/oil cooled. For some reason I hardly ever hear of a cracked block in the newer 4 cylinder and v-6 aluminum blocks, the car people must have figured out a better freeze protection.

I would suggest if you can find a mechanic shop that can do it and not kill you with the cost of blanking off the block a 15-20 psi. water or air test can be done that will let you know about where a crack is as long as it is leaking. Also most good shops can do PT(dye penetrant test) inspection and if needed do a MT (magnetic particle test) inspection on the head first and then the block although you probably won't see a interior crack between journals like I had. The MT inspection will show sub service cracks to as much as a 1/4" depth but may not show the crack if it is deep between journals. Good luck with your repairs and hopfully you do not have a cracked head or block to deal with.

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#30

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 9:58 PM

Blue smoke indicates oil burning. Where does oil come from in your engine, head gasket loose or blown letting oil into engine water jacket,, tighten head bolts or replace head gasket. Oil line cooler in radiator from transmission cooler or motor oil cooler cracked letting oil into radiator. Transmission will give out a color maybe red floating on water. Motor oil black. Can't see without taking radiator cap off. Don't remove when engine is hot otherwise the oil problem will seem like a minor problem by comparison.

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#31
In reply to #30

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 10:05 PM

Welcome to the insanity.

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#32
In reply to #31

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 10:27 PM

Oil in the radiator and no water in oil. Head gasket leaking around oil port to cam and valves. Did you overheat the engine? If you did, get another head.

Use new padding as old padding is crushed and won't separate the Cly piston tubes from each other nor the poppet's from the fesses. Be sure you disable the hooter before you procedure under the bonnet. Preferably a sun bonnet.

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#33

Re: Oil In Radiator

05/20/2010 11:37 PM

first - thanks to all who have replied to my post - I will use all and get back asap with results and final solution To answer a few questions asked here - never overheated engine oil in the radiator not tranny oil(manual) no engine cooler 85,000 original miles truck in excellent shape and runs great too. not a lot of oil in radiator but its there - Thanks again to all who have taken the time to help - I just need some free time and I will trouble shoot this more and get back ASAP

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