Previous in Forum: Want Advice...   Next in Forum: Testing Aluminum Sheet
Close
Close
Close
10 comments
Rate Comments: Nested
Participant

Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: jodhpur , RAJASTHAN , INDIA
Posts: 3

Quantity of Nitrogen Gas Required

07/20/2010 9:33 AM

I need to know the quantity of Nitrogen Gas required to fill 1 cubic meter of volume at 2 barg pressure at ambient temperature.

OR

I need to fill 18 Inch diamater below ground pipeline (Length = 131 Km) with Nitrogen Gas and need to preserve this line at 2 barg pressure.

Please let me know the volume of Nitrogen Gas required.

__________________
jivi baba
Register to Reply
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".

"Almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, vote them!
3
Guru
United Kingdom - Member - Not a New Member Hobbies - Musician - New Member Hobbies - Fishing - New Member

Join Date: May 2006
Location: Reading, Berkshire, UK. Going under cover.
Posts: 9684
Good Answers: 468
#1

Re: Quantity of Nitrogen Gas required.

07/20/2010 9:55 AM

1. 3 Nm3 (3m3 at NTP).[1]

2. You can do the sums.

[1] depending, of course, on your ambient temperature. Normal temperature is 20°C.

__________________
"Love justice, you who rule the world" - Dante Alighieri
Register to Reply Good Answer (Score 3)
Guru
United States - Member - New Member

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: In the pool because it is too hot.
Posts: 3054
Good Answers: 141
#3
In reply to #1

Re: Quantity of Nitrogen Gas required.

07/20/2010 12:46 PM

To fill the pipe from vacuum you will need indeed 1 time more the volume to read a gauge @2 bar.

Most of the time it is for test purposes and since air contains about 78% of nitrogen, for this purpose they just fill up the difference, unless specified differently.

If it is for special purposes and absolutely no oxygen can remain - if they start from a new pipe - (I don't know what is in there now) - after vacuum they should need 3 times the volumes as you propose. But this is almost never done.

Or when the drains are below: Theoretically 22% of the volume for the first clean up of the air inside ( the nitrogen pushes the oxygen out with this volume) and afterwards another 2 times the volume to bring it to 2 bar on the gauge. I didn't bring that up because I feel the poster just needs to know how much normal m3 he gets out of a package.

And the size of the pipe didn't make me suspect to be a special purpose pipeline. Nitrogen in there is usually applied to bring down the LEL (lower exposion level) for safe testing, which is attained with that volume of nitrogen. I should have given more explanation. Thanks.D

A GA from me

__________________
Plenty of room here
Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 6)
Participant

Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: jodhpur , RAJASTHAN , INDIA
Posts: 3
#4
In reply to #3

Re: Quantity of Nitrogen Gas required.

07/21/2010 12:41 AM

Thanx for the reply.

Actually we have laid a cross country pipeline of 18 inch dia and 131 kilometers. Now as per contract we need to fill this pipeline with nitogen gas and maintain the pipeline at 2 barg pressure. The geometric volume of the pipeline is 21400 cubic meter.

The line is empty. How much nitrogen is required to fill the line and subsequently to raise pressure upto 2 barg.

Regards

__________________
jivi baba
Register to Reply
Guru
United Kingdom - Member - Indeterminate Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: In the bothy, 7 chains down the line from Dodman's Lane level crossing, in the nation formerly known as Great Britain. Kettle's on.
Posts: 32175
Good Answers: 839
#5
In reply to #4

Re: Quantity of Nitrogen Gas required.

07/21/2010 3:56 AM

Does the air inside it have to come out first? If so, then a sweep of nitrogen gas will need to be introduced at one end and the outgoing gas at the other end tested until the levels of everything-other-than-nitrogen has fallen below specified criteria. With such a large diameter of line, flow will be turbulent, and that will mix the incoming nitrogen with the air already in there. In this case, the volume needed will be rather more than could be established by simple calculation of the volume and the pressure.

The line has been hydraulically tested to more than 2barg first, hasn't it?

__________________
"Did you get my e-mail?" - "The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place" - George Bernard Shaw, 1856
Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Guru

Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Hemel Hempstead, UK
Posts: 5826
Good Answers: 322
#6
In reply to #4

Re: Quantity of Nitrogen Gas required.

07/21/2010 5:41 AM

The line is empty.

I bet it's not!

__________________
If you spend all your time looking for people and things to complain about: trust me, you will find plenty to complain about.
Register to Reply
Guru
Engineering Fields - Mechanical Engineering - New Member India - Member - New Member

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: City of destiny, INDIA
Posts: 775
Good Answers: 67
#7
In reply to #4

Re: Quantity of Nitrogen Gas required.

07/21/2010 5:59 AM

(1) I assume that pipe contains air which is not dry. You want to introduce nitrogen(dry) for preservation. To drive out air you have to first blow the pipe with nitrogen which may require approx. one fill of the pipe at atomosphric pressure(1.013 bar). Quantity for one fill is 1.25x21400x273/(ambient temperature) in Kgs.

(2) To raise pressure up to 2.0 barg you need 1.25x21400x3.013/1.013x273/(amb.temp) Kilograms of nitrogen. Hope it is clear.

(3) If you need just to raise the pressure from 0 barg(atm. pressure) to 2 barg by filling nitrogen, consider above (2) ONLY.

Register to Reply
Guru
United States - Member - New Member

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: In the pool because it is too hot.
Posts: 3054
Good Answers: 141
#2

Re: Quantity of Nitrogen Gas required.

07/20/2010 10:08 AM

If your pipe doesn't leak, theoretically you'll need to calculate the inside volume of your pipeline. That is your Normal cubic feet or cubic meters needed gas @1 bar. 2 bar is double the volume.

Depending on how you will buy the Nitrogen, you'll need to convert the volume times delivered pressure to see what one unit can supply, (minus the rest value = 2 bar 0r 29psi) Your normal cubic meters also times 2. Probably in the pipe line will be air now, or something else that needs to be removed. If the nitrogen will be used to do this, count also loss of Nitrogen if this process doesn't evolve perfectly: meaning you can lose some Nitrogen too, depending on how you drain. Vacuum pumping helps for this, and bottom rains at the lowest points. But this doesn't happen too much in reality.

__________________
Plenty of room here
Register to Reply
Guru
United States - Member - New Member

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: In the pool because it is too hot.
Posts: 3054
Good Answers: 141
#9
In reply to #2

Re: Quantity of Nitrogen Gas required.

07/21/2010 8:55 PM

The post came under reply to #1 but was mentioned as extension on this post. The first line is there out of the context because of the position in the thread list. The extra 1 volume is on top of the 2 bar needed.

Maybe it might help here as clarification.

--------------------------------------------------- To fill the pipe from vacuum you will need indeed 1 time more the volume to read a gauge @2 bar.

(on top of the 2 times the volume)

For test purposes and since air contains about 78% of nitrogen, just filling up the difference, unless specified differently.

If it is for special purposes and absolutely no oxygen can remain - if they start from a new pipe - (I don't know what medium is in there now) - after vacuum they should need 3 times the volumes as you propose.

But this is almost never done.

Theoretically 22% of the volume for the first clean up of the air inside ( the nitrogen pushes the oxygen out with this volume) and afterwards another 2 times the volume to bring it to 2 bar on the gauge. I didn't bring that up because I feel the poster just needs to know how much normal m3 he gets out of a package.

And the size of the pipe didn't make me expect it to be a special purpose pipeline. Nitrogen in there is usually applied to bring down the LEL (lower exposion level) for safe testing, which is attained with that volume of nitrogen. I should have given more explanation. Thanks.D A GA to John me

__________________
Plenty of room here
Register to Reply
Active Contributor

Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 18
Good Answers: 1
#8

Re: Quantity of Nitrogen Gas Required

07/21/2010 9:56 AM

Perfect gas law

PV=nRT

P = pressure (atm)

V = volume (m3)

n = mole quantity = m / M --> m = mass of gas (g) and M = atomic mass (18g/mole for nitrogene)

R = perfect gas constant (8.206 x 10^-5 m3 atm mol-1 K-1)

T = temperature (K) --> temperature in Kelvin = temperature in °C + 273

Choose a temperature and do the math!

Register to Reply
Active Contributor

Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 13
#10

Re: Quantity of Nitrogen Gas Required

08/06/2016 8:33 AM

http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/compressed-air-storage-volume-d_843.html

Hope you got the answer

Register to Reply
Register to Reply 10 comments

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".

"Almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, vote them!
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

dvmdsc (3); gauti1123 (1); jivibaba (1); JohnDG (1); pritam (1); PWSlack (1); Randall (1); Rheolog (1)

Previous in Forum: Want Advice...   Next in Forum: Testing Aluminum Sheet

Advertisement