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Participant

Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Hampton Virginia
Posts: 1

Open Transition Transfer Switch In Hospitals

07/26/2010 7:46 PM

We have a new Hospital attached to our old Hospital

Newly installed transfer switches are open transition with a sync feature.

Critical and Life Safety transfer switches will not transfer within the 10 seconds, during a test due to this sync feature. We can bypass if we choose to, but this will cause some issues during transfer to emergency.

Even though it has been proven that the transfer switches will transfer over within 10 seconds during a power outage we can not prove this during our monthly test.

I have bounced this off of some of our third party engineers with two different opinions. One states that the commissioning documents prove that they already transfer over within ten seconds and there is no need to prove it during the monthly test. The other opinion states that you have to prove the 10 seconds monthly

I agree with the later opion, NFPA 110 does not come out and say ten seconds monthly with out doing some digging between chapters.

The loads on these two branches are typical of Chapter 517 of NFPA 70. Our servers do have there own UPS systems but we still have personal computers and patient monitoring systems on these branches as well.

The old Hospital still has critical areas that are served by older open transition switches in which we do have issues with equipment shutting down during the test.

Two ways I could go with this. Disable the sync feature and by a bunch a small UPS's

Or keep the sync feature and possibly be in violation of NFPA 110 and all other applicable codes

My Facilities manager is concerned about this issue as well. We are open for suggestions.

I hope this makes sense

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Power-User

Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: India
Posts: 333
Good Answers: 6
#1

Re: Open Transition Transfer Switch In Hospitals

07/27/2010 1:23 AM

Dear ,

What is your concern ? You need to test LTC monthly ?

For that, you need to have stand by LTC arrangement with bus coup[ler facility. with this, you can test periodically, your critical equipment.

Considering the criticality of hospital emergencies, any how, you require the same.

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Power-User

Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: India
Posts: 333
Good Answers: 6
#2
In reply to #1

Re: Open Transition Transfer Switch In Hospitals

07/27/2010 1:34 AM

dear,

can you clarify ....

open transition switches - we can by pass sync. facility. basically, sync. facility is very useful with close transition switches.

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Participant

Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 2
#3

Re: Open Transition Transfer Switch In Hospitals

07/27/2010 11:25 PM

Hi Rich,

Some new equipment based on some new switching ideas is coming out. We are looking for applications to test the ideas.

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Thanks,

Mac

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Anonymous Poster
#4

Re: Open Transition Transfer Switch In Hospitals

07/28/2010 9:24 AM

I assume that the alternate source of power if an emergency genset, if that is the case, try raising the genset frequency to 60.3 or so, as the genset goes through the switches sync. window the switch should operate, also if there is a utility power failure there is no utility to sync. to, there is a dead buss feature that lets the switch operate, there would be a delay returning to utility after because there is two sourses to sync. If you are using the switches test switch for testing there would be a delay because of sync. issues, this is all normal

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Associate

Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 51
Good Answers: 4
#5

Re: Open Transition Transfer Switch In Hospitals

07/29/2010 4:27 AM

Rich,

Normally all critical equipments in the hospitals, where even a 10 seconds drift in power loss will create a problem is backed up with a UPS system, that can catter the load for a 10-15 minutes, where by that time the generator or backup source will switch on and the system is under normal condition.

This is the standard practice followed in industries also. Where you have to have both the UPS with the transfer switches, A UPS cannot supply the desired load for long time, if you design a UPS for long loads then the inital cost of UPS will be very high. Its better you segregate and provide UPS for critical loads for a short duration by which time the transfer supply comes online.

In more critical system you can use a rotary UPS system, where there will be a changeover of supply without any time delay, this system takes care of the delay and supplies the power without any drift. the initial cost is a bit high but better than providing UPS for individual loads.

Amarnath

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Anonymous Poster
#6

Re: Open Transition Transfer Switch In Hospitals

07/30/2010 4:19 PM

I do not understand why you cannot prove this during your monthly test.

If you have a power quality analyzer or similar power data recorder on the line, why can't you record the monthly test? Is it that you do not have the power dataloggers? FLUKE or Extech both sell power dataloggers. Just a note, make sure that you purchase a datalogger that has the capability to look at the time interval that you are interested in. Some dataloggers only look at your power line every 5 minutes or so. If you are intested in seconds or milliseconds, you need to make sure that the datalogger has the capability to provide you detail for that time interval.

Some dataloggers just store the analog waveform so you can view it, but do not provide analysis capabilities. You will need to purchase a datalogger that can both store and provide analysis/calculation of the analog waveform.

Some handheld Fluke Meters have limited datalogging storage but do not have the capabilities that a power quality analyzer has.

The power quality analyzer should be able to provide hardcopy data to verify that you meet

Additionally, what is rule of the AHJ and Fire Marshall?

Per the NFPA 101 Life Safety Handbook p348 Section 9.1.2 Electrical Systems and I quote "Where required for compliance with this Code, emergency generators and standby power systems shall comply with 9.1.3.1 and 9.1.3.2.

9.1.3.1 Emergency generators and standby power systems shall be installed, tested, and maintained in accordance with NFPA 110, Standard for Emergency and Standby Power Systems.

9.1.3.2 New generator controllers shall be monitored by the fire alarm system, where provided, or at an attended location, for the following conditions:

(1) Generator running

(2) Generator Fault

(3) Generator switch in nonautomatic position

9.1.4 Stored Electrical Energy Systems.

Stored electrical energy systems shall be installed, tested, and maintained in accordance with NFPA 111, Standard on Stored Electrical Energy Emergency and Standby Power Systems.

NOTE: Per 4.1 in 2005 NFPA 110 and specified in Annex "A" this standard specifies requirements for the EPSS as a complete functioning system in terms of types, classes, and levels. It is not the intent of this standard to recommend the EPSS most suitable for any given application.

You specify 10 seconds as per Table 4.1(b) Types of EPSSs

Type 10 10 second power restoration.

Another question:

Can your existing EPSS combination old and new system fall under the definition specified in Annex "A" as a complete functioning system per the AHJ and the Fire Marshall? Has it been signed off on by AHJ and Fire Marshall?

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AdeptOne (1); amarnath.sn (1); Anonymous Poster (2); harry potter (2)

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