2003 Honda Pilot Ignition Key/ Ignition Switch Problem

I am having trouble getting any of my keys into the ignition of my 2003 Pilot. What is it that needs replacing?? I was told replacing the ignition switch would be $600. Based on what I have read that is really steep... Any feedback would be most appreciated!

Guest I would locate a locksmith in your area that works on auto ignitions. A new ignition w/ keys will set you back $400 estimate. A local locksmith was able to clean out my switch (there was a lot of gunk in mine) with air and I found that worked for me. See post #11 Locksmith Al apparently these vehicles have problems with the ignition switches. By the way the locksmith recommended using "Contact Cleaner" for electric contacts to lube the cylinder not graphite or WD-40.

Contact cleaner for the electrical contacts, graphite for the lock, the electrical contacts are in a separate assembly mounter on the rear of the lock assembly.

Bill

Auto lock manufacturers use either a vaseline based or lithium paste lube during assembly. Adding graphite will create cake batter and result in a worsening situation. Conventional wisdom is not correct, despite what that tube of graphite or can of lockease says on it ! Only a product that does not gum nor add contamination, and also thins down the existin , hardening lubricant will be useful. We use a product called Houdini (lubricant ), but silicone spray or CRC 5-56 can be used in a pinch. Aside from the good attention, i implore people regularly to dispense with the graphite and teflon products...but not into the lock!

Though an old post, it might get searched.

Honda has used a 4 track key design since 2003. Failures have spiked on Honda since this design first hit the road.

A New lock will resolve the problem for a while, but it will recurr.

At the same time the new lock to same key or old lock gets serviced, the KEYS should almost always be replaced as well. Slight crowning of the FLAT sides will cause the FRAGILE wafers in the lock to not track well, and tip..... this causes them to act like fish hooks in the lock, one or more will get bound up.

Service lock, replace keys ( chips can be harvested from old keys and planted into new ones, eliminating any re-programming, and all will be happy... for a while.

Also, have the vin run for non completed recalls, as the ELECTRIC switch portion, the ALL PLASTIC HOUSED switch behind the lock cylinder that carries full current loads has a tendancy to break down. Even if repaired under recall, they will fail again. Honda has stepped up and replaced them AS NEEDED ( about every 4 years, as they seem to be going out by 5 years )

Honda could have averted this, had they submitted sample locks for peer review within the locksmith industry. They would have been alerted to the 3 or 4 areas where failure is likely.

Honda is not alone with lock design issues.

Toyota had a design flaw from 1991-2006, with using split wafers ( similar to those in Honda ). The Toyota design can be field serviced such that the problem will NEVER recur.

Chrysler and Ford have a much higher failure rate on Ignition locks than twenty years ago. Partially due to tighter tolerances, partially because they abandoned a less secure, but more durable design. GM had a winning lock design dating back to 1935, but departed from it, trying a number of new adaptations that have been a mixed bag of results.

Now GM and Ford are going to European side-milled keys..... which use the same dreaded split wafers that have plagued other failed designs.... the keys break less, but if history is any indicator of future experience; the locks will seize up WAY more.

Pushbutton keyless start? when those fail, you will wish for the old key lock!

And I will be busier than ever!

Your key should have a number stamped on it. Take the key to the dealer and get a new key. How hard is that? or how much is that going to cost you? I have a 1993 Toyota, I am still using the same key. You must be working too hard on that key.

Hernaju1 appreciate your feedback on key issue. Keys cost $80, new ignition switch w/ keys $400 . Talking with dealer they feel new key would not work these cars Honda's in general have ignition switch cylinder problems - tumblers that work free. I am going to check out local locksmith $200. As far as being hard on keys ? The car has 130k miles and I am constantly turning car on/off for appointments.

My dad is a locksmith. I would say going to the dealer to get a new key might be your first step, but also get an inquiry from a locksmith. If you have a lot of key chains attached to your car keys, this can put stress on the key when you drive. It's good practice to have as little as possible attached to your car keys.

Yes, that is true. All that weight hanging from your key is not good. It is better not to have all that junk attached to your car's key. Keep your car key on a key chain by itself.

This was just being discussed on the locksmithing forum (www.clearstar.com), and these high security ignitions are going tits-up like there's no tomorrow!

Split wafers, coupled with the usual piss-poor lock design and engineering we've come to expect from the Rising Sun, and you've got a recipe for disaster (or making money, if you're a locksmith!!)

Murph

Al + Murph.... plus the commentary.... 1+1+1=thumbs

Hey, Murphy!

Have you ever tried a little bit of oil (WD40), surprisingly effective sometimes.

I recently change the ignition switch on my Honda Odyssey, it was real easy and only cost about $50 at the auto parts store and I did not have to change keys. The process of changing the switch took about 5 minutes.

Wow that is fast! You must be a real good mechanic. Like those guys in "Gone In 60 Seconds". I am good at trinkering with stuff, but I have to think twice sometimes. I guess you must know your Honda left & right. Very Good!

What parts did you have to buy and how were you able to determine those were the parts you needed.

I think most of the discussion is on the lock cylinder, not the switch on the back side of the lock bolt housing.

50.00 might not be bad, but these were recalled on nearly all Hondas, and should be replaced by Honda for free. This way the vehicle will be shown as recalls completed. They last about 4 years... longer than the lock part often does.

The first thing I would try is to blow it out with compressed air. Perhaps a piece of plastic has broken off and lodged at the bottom. In any event, it warrants replacement (some good suggestions here so far in this thread).

When you bought the car you should have received two keys, have you tried the spare?

That will tell you if the wear problem is in the key or the lock, and go from there with the other suggestions below ..... by the way DO NOT put oil in the lock - use Graphite powder.

By the way I drive Peugeots 504/505 and have done 300,000-400,000 km and have not seen this problem - and I have a big bunch of keys hung on my ignition key - I have had the electrical switch begin to wear our once, but that was well over 400,000km

I got to counter the GRAPHITE recommendation.

You are adding POWDER to a situation, as the mfr has paste grease already inside the lock.

If someone recommends heating it up, we can bake a cake !

Avoid anything in suspension, such as Teflon lubes as well. In the cold, they will separate, and flow like solder, coating all surfaces and causing siezure.

Jeff

The Locksmith

We have exactly the same problem in our '03 Pilot, and hope it can be fixed. Your description is precisely what happens when I try to start the car. Oddly enough, the problem cleared up during the spring and summer, but has now started up again.

I realize this is an old thread, but would like to add information that should be halpful to all who have HONDA automobiles from 2003 and up.

1. These use a 4 track key, often called "lasercut" or sidewinder. This means they are cut on a mill, as opposed to a rotary grinder. There is no CO2 laser involved. Someone called it that, and the term stuck.

2. In the head of the key is an RFID chip, which is recognized or rejected when inserted and turned. If a valid key, the startup sequence of events will complete.

3. When you have this lock service, with the ignition or doors, it is well advised the keys be replaced with fresh, cnc cut replacements at the same time. The chips can be harvested from the old keys and put into the new ones, saving you the programming fee. Locksmiths generally will have better resources for doing this, including weekends

4. Lubrication. NEVER put powder or oils containing graphite or teflon, nor WD-40 ( sorry, guys ), lockease or other "recommended" products into your locks. Why? Because it will react in some way with whatever ALREADY is in the lock, either from manufacturer, or someone else.

Honda and others use a lithium paste or gel lubricant that when graphite hits, creates cake batter. If you must use a lubricant we recommend Houdini highly. It can be used to flush out debris and other lubricants, but as good as it is, it can not replace lithium paste.

4. The best bet for servicing these cars is a GOOD locksmith. Beware of phony locksmith ads, links, even on this very website page, as they are sold by GOOGLE and others without any requirement of any kind. They link you whomever paid to be there. 99% of all online listed locksmiths are illicit. Go to the sites that follow to be sure you get to a legitimate firm, and learn to avoid fraud. visit www.legallocksmiths.com and/or www.findalocksmith.com

Jeff

City Lock

Boulder CO

My fix was to remove the tumbles from the cylinder, reassemble it and it works like new....

total cost was 87 cents from Lowes.

I removed the key assembley then disassembled it, removed the tumbles and springs... i did not remove the last tumbler (key keeper) because this keeps the key in the hole while the key is on.

i have pictures if your interested

i had to drill out the roll pin that keeps the key cylinder in the assembley.... 87 cents at lowes to buy a new roll pin to replace the old one.

At first i thought by removing the tumblers i would be able to use any key... nope you still have to use the proper key (electronic chip)

so with the electronic chip, i don't have to worry about anyone steeling my car.

Sharum I am interested in the photos if you would send me. I had a locksmith look at my ignition and he didnt suggest this idea. My understanding is that the tumblers in this switch are flat plates that slide back and forth. My e mail is jhatheway@bizpvf.com thanks

SHARUM nice work. I have the exact same problem. Can you please send me the pictures when you get a chance? Email is "pas1814@yahoo.com" Does anyone know if Honda has a recall out on this?

I would love the photos... jm15066@hotmail.com Thanks, James

Better yet can they be posted here of all?

While you had a good result, for which I give you Kudos for bravery; you did not share the steps required to get the lock out of the vehicle, ( MOST require removal first, one variant does not ) as well as the cautions on the tear-down of the lock.

It is NOT rocket surgery, but it is sensitive; the antenna ring must not get damaged, and in taking off the front of the assembly, there are precautions, lest one damage a small circuit board in the face of the lock, as well as two micro pin switches that are part of the circuit board. We have had car dealerships bring us spanking new ignitions to be matched to a cars' key codes; where someone tried to do a re-key of the original one, and destroyed the lock in the process.

There is also an issue of wrong keys starting the vehicle. Even with a transponder ( RFID ) chip in the key, the vehicle is highly susceptible to theft.

Someone trying to steal would find the ignition turning without having to fit a key or attack the lock, that leaves programming in a key....

I will not go into too much specifics of HOW to steal the car, but mentioning it to be informative.

Should the vehicle every be stolen by ANY means, the insurance company would examine the vehicle and find security elements removed. Your claim could be in jeopardy. This is probably why a legitimate locksmith would NOT recommend "just taking out the parts and charging your 87 cents". Of course, most of the job of repairing the lock correctly is in labor, not parts. The parts to rekey the lock are about 8.00.

Also, keys should be replaced when the flat surface has rounded over, much like the crown of a road. This wear allows excess free motion for the lock to fail.

The lock design IS poor, this issue was predictable from the outset.

I Just no idea why car companies go forward with poor lock and key design. It is not ONLY Honda, by any means. They should know better than to use historically failed concepts. ( I refer to lock design of 1970s Lancia, Fiat and others )

Do I condemn what you did ? NOPE... above my pay grade. But the risk of damaging the lock while working on it, incorrectly assembling it ( which could cause a problem with key removal ) and the issues mentioned above are why I would not suggest this to be a good DIY project,

Now you know the risks, and can better decide if this is a good idea for you.

Jeff

The Locksmith

Jeff,

My 2003 Honda has been a very good vehicle for my family, that being said, we have over 100k on the odometer, this will not be a prime vehicle for a car thief.

With all the tumblers removed except the last one, the key will not turn unless it is a honda side-cut key in the hole.

Yes, before you start pulling the key and electronics from the steering column, if you screw something up, it will cost you big money... It was jammed, the car wouldn't start and the wife wanted her car back... I had nothing to lose.

As for my insurance, I spoke with my insurance lady and she said they would cover my car even if i left the keys in it.

Hey,

Can you send me the pictures? I am having this same problem and would prefer a reasonable fix.

Thanks!

Sharum,

Would you mind sending me some pics on this...if I may have to replace my ignition assembly anyway, I would like to try this ...thank you!

Kelz

my email address is...

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Thank you for this, Varmintjim. I followed your steps and, except for when I didn't, it all went exactly as you said and was completely successful. Really appreciate it! I've read a great number of posts about this problem; this was the most complete and sensible solution offered.

Great Post man! Worked like a charm for me my Pilot has 189,000 and was getting unstartable.

I followed your instructions, found a brick and mortar locksmith $21 later I am up and running!

A+ Brother thanks for posting!

Brilliant! Thank you so much for the post...I am back in business! Please allow me to add a couple of thoughts:

Step 4: I ended up using a pair of needle nosed vice grips to remove the shear bolts. Due to obstructions around the bolts I could only turn the bolts maybe 10-20 degrees at a time, but after the first such turn they came out smoothly. Also, I found the ignition module wiring bundle to be in the way, so I carefully used diagonal cutting pliers to cut the black plastic wire guide, allowing easier access to the left shear bolt.

Step 7: I was unable to disconnect the circuit board connector from the ignition module; after mangling the connector I left it in place. I don't think it hindered the locksmith; you might consider leaving it in place if you have similar difficulty.

Step 8: I was referred to a locksmith by a hardware store, but turns out the fellow had a mobile business and he in turn referred me to a "brick and mortar" business, admitting that it would cost more to use the mobile locksmith (thus consider avoiding them). I was charged $60, more than others, but I was quite satisfied that the work was done by the next morning after leaving it late in the day.

My locksmith noted that I had used Lock-Ease (suggested in another forum); he said a moderate amount of graphite powder, applied annually, was the way to go.

Again, well done Varmitjim!

Chiller

PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE do not every use graphite or graphited or teflon lubes in locks!

I am sure the other locksmith was trying to give you good advice, but I challenge his premise on lubricants.

The factory lubrication, and long-lasting lube used when servicing automotive locks is a lithium paste lube, or a vaseline-like gel lube

Add graphite, and you will get cake batter as a result. This clumped material will cause the little wafers to stop moving freely.

The only time graphite turns out well, is for INTERIOR doors in commercial buildings where all lock service is maintained by a professional. Because the interior of skyscrapers and other well-managed larger facilities follows specific protocols, the lubrication initially used will be matched in the future. Most smaller businesses and facilities just wing it and start using whatever a hardware store had with a picture of a key on the can !

The only lock manufacturer still putting graphite in their cylinders that I can note is Schlage. We have found in EXTERIOR applications, this leads to totally caked up locks, because people will be spraying WD-40 and Silicone in, which will cake up the existing graphite. On interior doors we do not see this, providing there is no MIX of graphite and other lubes or sprays.

My shop does not even HAVE any graphite. NONE. We use Houdini Lubricant. Silicone lube and CRC 5-56 is ok, but will require more frequent application.

AUTO ignitions should not ever need additional lube. The EXTERIOR locks are under attack by grit, moisture and in colder climates: Magnesium Chloride. These only help the locks fail prematurely, needing service.

We charge a bit more to service these ignitions, but we do a real nice job, and we nearly ALWAYS will replace the keys.... look at the wide flat surface of your Honda keys.... if there is a wavy wear pattern, it is the result of components not moving properly in the lock... and the surface wear will provide less square contact surface for the tiny little points on the wafers to track upon.

I'm going to attempt this next week. One day out of the blue my key got stuck in the ignition. After successfully getting it out I tried to start my pilot. It will start after about 50 times trying to get the key to turn. I received a quote from the dealer today to replace the ignition switch. $800 plus labour to replace. There is no way I'm paying that. We'll see how it goes.

Thanks for the step by step process Jim!!! It guided me right through the process. Saved me a few $$$.

You need a new ignition lock assay.. common problem....just contact to Davie Locksmith.They are best locksmith.