LOTS of Rust in Well Water Started When Longer Pipe Put In

GA

I also have iron in my well water, though not to the extent Kassandra is having.

We have added automatic filters (they automatically backflush periodically) and an Iron Eater water softener that took care of most of the problem. At least there is no more staining. For drinking and cooking we use an under-sink activated charcoal cartridge filter that has its own tap.

GA, but if there are chips/chunks of stuff coming up, I'd also suggest some kind of settling tank before the fine filters & other treatment.

From all the helpful comments I have gotten, I suspect my problem is two-fold: 1) an iron pipe was installed when some other type of pipe should have been used. That is the source of the larger chips of rust. 2) the pump was put down too far in the well where it is almost right in the sediments. when the pump goes on, it's close proximity to the sediment stirs it up even more. Now all my pipes are coated with iron, so even when I get the pipe replaced and have the pump raised, I will probably have some residual iron taste for a while. If this remains a problem, I will try a filtering system. Hopefully I will get back to having the great water that I had before the well driller lowered the pump.

Great answer! The well driller did not drill any deeper---as far as I know, he added a 20 foot pipe and lowered the pump that much. He did not inspect the piping or the casing, and he did not clean anything. I also suspect that the pipe he added had been used (it did not look new), and that may have been the source of the iron bacteria (I had never had an iron bacteria problem in the 30 years since the well was first drilled). Before he did any of the work, I had perfectly clear, clean water. Immediately after he was done, it was rust red and had chips of rust in it. A couple of weeks later I treated the well for iron bacteria by adding several gallons of bleach and flushing it for two days. That only helped for a short while. That was several years ago. I just treated the well again with 6 gallons of bleach, and then ran my hose on full for 70 hours until the bleach smell was gone. An incredible amount of sludge and chips of iron have been flushed out, and for now the water is clear. Since I stopped flushing last night, I will know more about whether this really helped in another few days. If the water turns rusty soon, I will assume I need to raise the pump higher because it is too close to the sludge that has accumulated at the bottom of the well. If it takes much longer before it turns rusty, I assume I will need to treat for iron bacteria on a regular basis. Do you know how often this should be done? By the way, I was sure to let the heavily chlorinated water get into all my pipes and water heater before letting it all sit for 2 1/2 days, and then flushed it all for 3 days. Thanks for your help!

You will never get rid of the bacteria now, and will have to repeatedly treat to control it. On the plus side the bacteria will be relatively localize around the well.

GA from tcmtech. I would just add that, if you have to run it for 5 hours in the morning to get clear water, it is unlikely that this would be only due to rusting of 20' of iron pipe. If that was the only cause, it would probably clear more quickly than that. It is quite possible that you have hit a different aquifer, but would this account for the rust chips? So it could be a bit of both. Either way, surely the well-driller must bear some responsibility? You might want to get an inspection from them, and also from another source.

I also have high iron content. I have an iron removal system in my basement that works very well, (aqua pure). This may be an easy fix: figure out were the water table is, (surface water in well pipe). Raise well pump as close to the surface as possible without running dry. You will be pumping clear water and sediment will naturally stay at the bottom.

I suspect that they may have set your pump way too low in the water, with rust chips, maybe at the bottom of the well......wrong. I think the well driller needs to make another visit.

It may be that the water has got a high iron content, if that is the case you may need to aerate the water and let the iron settle out.

I had experience in regards to iron in water where in a drip irrigated vineyard it was so bad the water with out aeration blocked every thing up.

We had to pump into a large storage tank exposing the flow in to as much air as we could and then pumping of the top with a floating suction to filters and drippers.

Constant removal of sediment was essential.

the second was from a bore out to satelite tank to water troughs for livestock.

Iron was so bad it blocked up impellers in multistage submersible and clogged inlet filters and then pipes as the iron dropped out and settled.

Try aerating and let it settle and see if it changes . What are your salt levels as you may have opened up a bad steam which is stronger than the previous one.

There aresituations where good water is in a sealed strata and if you drilled deeper you may have gone through the layer sealing the good from the bad.

A friend had a bore that had that problem where they had good water but needed more and went deeper intercepting a very bad layer into a good layer.

But the bad water because of high salts was destroying the casing and equipment.

They had to drill a wider hole and case with PVC and then concrete out the bad layer.

It was a big high capacity bore 14inch and that cost a lot but it had to be done.

Tests should show you what is wrong, water boards should test samples and advise.

Does anyone know if I have to call the well driller to raise the pump, or is this something a plumber (or I) can do? I think it is a good idea to raise it back to where it was before I had the problem, see if the water clears up, and then just lower it a few feet. thanks to everyone for your help!

Thanks for the ideas. I am quite sure I don't have a problem with any salts: I'm in Northern Wisconsin and have never heard anyone nearby even mention salts. But many people complain about the iron.

If this turns out to be Iron bearing rock & you ain't using it for drinking I would suggest you install a series of settling tanks & to finally pump it into a holding tank at high level,roof space or the like, the other solution if you own the land start digging and open your own Iron ore quarry and pretty soon you could move to where you have plenty of clean clear water that you can add to your whiskey whilst sitting on the decking watching the sun go down or if your an alcoholic watching the sun cum up.

Bazzer

You are living on the iron ore mine. Better start digging you will make fortune as iron is quite expensive now a days.

I had a similar problem some years back when I bought a home. The water had vast amount of iron and the problem was traced to the well where originally it was a dug well about 22 feet then they drilled down another 40 feet and installed casing but the top of the casing did not come all the way to the top and after some years the ground water from the dug well that was iron rich filled the casing of the drilled part about 6 feet full of iron muck. I extended the well casing to the top with a J packer ring to seal it and added a pitless adapter to connect the house water. To flush the well I rot a gasoline pump that used 2 inch inlet and outlet. I pumped water from the dug well and and forced it down the casing all the way with 2 inch plastic pipe bubbling the trash up to the top until it appeared clear then I put the intake of the pump down the casing to the bottom and pulled out as much of the water as possible and in a few minutes we got clear water and never had another problem. It appears that the ground water was full of iron but down at the vein water was clear.

Iron is needed for human body,save on buying iron tablets.

Unless it was 30+ years ago that the pipe was extended, the iron chips aren't coming from the pipe. You have hit an iron rich water source. Raising the pipe would probably help, but you may never get the quality of water you had before. The filtering that has been suggested is a good bet. Have you considered drilling a new well to the depth of the previous good water source? I would get the recommendations of water/well experts in your area before proceeding with anything.

Unless of course the pipe they used was not new.

You have no legal grounds to get the driller to anything else for you. However, lets face it, he conned you when he said "better drill now", even though you had no problems with water, so don't feel bad about asking him nicely to raise your pump back up a bit, say to where it was before. The problem just might go away. (yeah, that'll happen when pigs fly, but it is the only no cost option available right now.)

At the very least, you need to install a whole house filter, possibly a multi-stage one. They are easy to maintain, if you can screw in a light bulb, you can replace a filter. That will take care of the sludge. Then you can see if you can handle the resultant mineral water. It might not be so bad, once you get the mud out of it! Then you can see if a water softener would help from there, but you really do have to clean the water before sending it to water softener. They are expensive units, and you don't want to replace one because it got full of mud! The softener will take out the invisible minerals.

So, filter first. Then soften if needed. A reverse osmosis unit under the sink for drinking water if further cleaning is required, and you are good to go.

I think the driller conned me in several ways: I don't think I needed to go lower because I had perfectly clear, good-tasting water with no iron and no sludge whatsoever before he started working. Also, I believe the extra 20' pipe that he added was USED----it was probably someone else's rejected iron pipe. This guy is known to be dishonest, and unfortunately he is the only well-driller who works in this area so he is able to maintain his crooked monopoly. Does anyone know if a plumber might have the necessary equipment to raise the pump to a higher level, or is this something that must be done with specialized well-drilling equipment? I would like to try raising the pump before I resort to filters.....after all, the water was perfect for decades before this change was done.

A competent plumber or Jack-of-all-trades will have no problem raising your pump.

Kass --

You're getting good advice here. And I'm learning a lot about dealing with extreme iron problems if some future earthquake in my area ever screws up my well. (which survived the '89 Loma Prieta event)

I'd like to add a couple of comments that I don't think were touched on. First off, and I don't think this is a major issue for you, reduced iron in the water, FeO2 is soluble and colorless. As soon as it comes in contact with oxygen or chlorine is oxidizes to Fe2O3 (common rust) or FeCl3 (similar color). A moderate amount of iron, just enough to make the water taste lousy and stain plumbing fixtures can be knocked down with an ozone system working in a decent sized water storage tank. (the ozone also works on sulfur compounds that will oxidize and precipitate.

Also be aware of a product called "Iron Out" This is a white granulated powder of sodium hyposulphite, a reducing agent. I use it in an ordinary water softener during periodic backwashes to clear out iron deposits on the resin which reduce softener capacity and efficiency. Also works on stubborn rust stains where you can keep a concentrated solution in contact for several hours such as with a wet cloth.

Another comment about pulling the well. A shallow well up to maybe 100 feet deep can be pulled with muscle power or the help of a simple hoist you can rig yourself like an engine hoist "A" frame and a come-along. You need a gripper that grabs the pipe and can be easily moved with each lift cycle until you have 20 feet in the air. Then a plate with a "U" slot that supports the hanging load while you unscrew and move the 20 foot section up above (swaying in the wind) to temporary storage. Then you attach your gripper to the pipe below and do the next section.

Professional well service trucks are equipped with an industrial hydraulic motor driven version of what I described to handle the weight of deeper well strings of several hundred feet. My well is at 400 feet and every few years I have to have my well service guy bring his rig in to deal with some problem in the submersible pump that generally gets replaced at that point. (typically about the same cost as all the money I saved from not having to pay monthly water bills were I living in town)

The engineered rig he has on his truck is really slick to watch. It's almost completely controlled with operating levers. The only thing he has to do is fiddle with each coupling to check it and detach the electric wires and attach the rotator that unscrews the upper pipe from the coupling and places it in a storage rack on the truck.

Ed Weldon

Ed, Thanks for all the good info and suggestions. I have treated for iron bacteria, flushed all pipes and water heater, and it is much improved, but not yet drinkable. I am considering my options for pulling the pump and removing the 20 foot pipe that was added....I suspect that will solve the problem. If possible, I will have a ten foot pipe replace the 20 footer in case the water table really is dropping.

Remember that you can probably put that 10 foot section or any other length you like at the top of the string rather than the bottom. That means if lifting the weight of the string is a real chore with whatever tools you muster it will be less pain if you only have to make just one 20 foot lift rather than an "X" hundreds of feet lift you'd need to get at the pump on the bottom.

But understand that all the abrasive stuff that went through the pump may have shortened the life of the main thrust bearing in the pump that carries the pumping load, a function of the differential pressure across the impeller stack (not the entire static water pressure in the well) So you may have to "pay the piper" sooner than later. You can delay this bearing failure by lengthening the "on" cycles as much as the flow of the well (which may vary with the seasons) and the capacity of your storage tank will allow. Reason for this is that most of that thrust bearing wear occurs at the start of rotation of the pump shaft.

If you really have to "scrape the bottom of the barrel" so to speak in order to get enough water in the dry season you could get clever and build a mechanical lifting mechanism into the top support for the pump pipe and connect the discharge with a long flexible hose. Just remember that most wires that go down deep wells are solid copper, not multistrand, so they will take only so much flexing.

Ed Weldon

Ed, Thanks for more good ideas. I like the idea of replacing a 20' pipe with a 10' at the TOP end of the string. The pump was new when all this iron problem began a few years ago, so hopefully it will last. (I wasn't in the house for several years when I was taking care of my mother, so the pump was not on at all during that time). It's main use lately has been running the iron-laden water out the hose for many hours a week for the last couple of months. I have never been aware of seasonal water level variations in the well, but there may be a difference.

As far as cleaning your existing pipe out thats an easy one. Just install a valve at the point where the line coming from the well connects to everything else and then hook up an air compressor to it that can pump around 10 CFM or better at close to what your normal water pressure is. Use a pressure regulator of course in order to keep from over pressurizing your water system.

Then go around to each faucet and hydrant you have and open them to full flow while the air compressor is pumping air into the feed line along with the supply water. Start with the points closest to the air source and work your way out. The high volume of pressurized air bubbles will pound and shake the sediments and rust deposits out of your lines without problems. Just don't be surprised when the nasty muddy syrup starts to come out at first though.

My brothers place also has a well with a high iron and sediment content so I have to do that to his place about once every two or three years otherwise the pipes silt in so bad that he looses all of his flow capacity and pressure. It works very well but always make a for a few minutes of very nasty looking sludge being pumped out of everything!

I also did this to my dads place last summer when I changed his old 1940's pump jack system over to a submersible system. For about 20 minutes all we got was nasty orange and brown goo from every hydrant on the farm! Be he has good water flow and pressure everywhere now!

When the driller did his job, by drilling deeper I think his drill equipment loosened the rust of the existing pipe going into the well. So at the bottom of your well there is now a big heap of rust. I suggest taking out the submersible and use a vacuum water pump (if the water is not that far from the surface) to suck up all the rust at the bottom. Then reinsert your submersible.

Hi, I think you should pull out the pump and fill the well to its previous level with underwater sement (if there is such a thing) or something that will block the rust. Then put the pump back at the level it was before this driller gave you rust.