PC Board/Test/Repair

You might want to check the motor(s).

I know of a company in Connecticut that does PC board repairs on various industrial and utility electronic equipment. Although I doubt that they are familiar with this board in particular, they may be able to match and replace the components for you. Contact me off-line and I can give you the name & phone #.

However, I too would question whether you have a problem with the motor or the wiring to it that would have caused the failures on the controller board.

Hello Peter. I just sent you a message in/from cr4 with my email. I did check the motor and i connected a 12 battary/motorcycle and it turned ,of course slow because it is only 12vdc and the motor is 90. The shaft turns very easy, so I would think that it is not the motor. I know that the board is made in china or some were over sea's.Before some one here says" well why did you buy junk, Let me say that I got this for FREE.I also live in ct. so that would be good.I think that the ele.cap. blew and that caused the rest. But im only taking a guess. All the other parts dont look burned and like I said most or part of the board still works.

tks all

John

Hi,

Just had a quick look at this.The ceramic capacitor is most likely an NTC or VDR surge arrester, which could have blown for a number of reasons: voltage surge, heat, old age. Check the Bridge rectifier. On the output side there are three components just behind the second large cap held against a heatsink. These are likely to be a double diode, i.e. a 3 pin device with inputs on the outer legs & output on the centre pin,. (2) Triacs/ FETs. Any of these could have gone short. (3) Either of the large electrolytic caps could be damaged, shorted / leaking.Any of these will blow the fuse. Any competent electronics guy will be able to check these for you.There are of course a number of other components, but these are the most likely. If you are down to the surface mount items then it is a bit more difficult.

Hope this is of some help,

Regards

Tom

Tom you seen to know alot about this,and must work in this feild. How would you like to look at this "in person" and try to fix it If I send it to you and pay you if you can fix the board.No rush on it, I also was going to find a tech school that teaches kids eletronics and see if they would look at it.About the ceramic cap.you mentioned it might be a NTC or VDR. their are no values on this, would you know what I could replace it with?I never tested a rectifier in place,is their a way for me to test these?I did bring it to a tv shop and the guy did mention the rectifier also.I know that it must be atleast 30 amp because the motor is 20amp.The ele.cap. dose have numbers on it, thats no sweat.The small tiny 15 amp fuse is easy,

tks for the help and let me know I';l;l ship both ways and also buy you a coffee.

John in ct

Hi John,

Yes, I work in this field. I have repaired a couple of similar items for a Gym here.I wouldn't mind looking at it for you,but, whereabouts are you located? USA? In which case it might be a bit costly to send it. Maybe more than the cost of a board, though you say you couldn't get one so maybe that's not an issue.

I have found that TV guys are generally not keen on looking at "industrial" equipment.

A couple of suggestions. As you say, (1)a tech school, (2) are you anywhere near a factory that might have their own maintenance guy who might do it in his own time? One of the problems in this day and age is that most service is now a "fit new board and discard old board" scenario, unless they are high value, in which case they go back to the manufacturer.

If you have no luck come back to me. If you have access to a multimeter & soldering iron I can give you some check points. Failing that, sure, send it to me.

Give me an email address if you need to go further on this.

Regards,

Tom

Hello Tom :I looked at your profile and received your email.I e mailed a couple of other places in china and they all just say about the same thing,Its not ours.None even bother to mention or say "ship it to us and we will repair it.I use to do plumbing and heating ,remodeling and I always figured out a way to make it work if something broke.Not just saying "oh you have to get a whole new one"I guess in the USA were getting more stupid as time goes on.Im considering your kind offer and I checked the post office and they have a pre paid box for I think it was $13.00 dollars or something like that.I want to be able to get a Self addressed one also so you can ship it back.I should ship the console out also so you can plug that into the board,but then seeing that your so smart you most likely wouldn't need it.Thanks Tom.oh and my wife thanks you also and said how nice you were to offer. She is Irish ,and her mom was the Best.yes Irish also.

John

Hi John,

I sent you my email address through CR4, hope you got it ok. Have you had any success with your motor board?

Regards

Tom

No progress yet,was looking at it and had No idea of what to test, and really don't want to break any thing else.I guess I was just trying to see if I could get any readings with my meter through different parts.Im still thinking of taking you up on your offer.To test the ele. cap. I will have to take it off the metal housing, but If you look at it I would rather leave it as is. I did get your email and was very happy to read it.I don't know you but I have told many people about you and your offer.They were amazed . Im still emailing and sending the picture to alot of companies to see if they know were I could get one or if they can fix it. No luck so far.I should let my wife hold the board for awhile and maybe she can give it some of that magic dust, The Luck of the irish! Tks John B

ps. Im always looking for the end of the rainbow,but by the time I get their it's gone.LOL

Hi John,

Take a few photo's of the board looking into the unit, i.e. face on to the damaged cap, and a few other views, and email them to me. There is very little you can test successfully without removing from the board as you can get readings through other components. You could pick up short circuits on the bridge rectifier, diodes, triacs,transistors etc in situ. You will then have to remove them to confirm the findings. You will then of course, have to find replacements, fit them and test. What testmeter do you have, and how proficient are you at using it? My advice is, have someone who knows what they are doing, look at the controller. Once powered up,the large capacitors can retain a high charge, possibly lethal, after the power is removed, so be aware.

Regards,

Tom

GA Tom: Conntaxman look for open too in case the "Magic Rock" inside the simiconductor was blown apart before the fuse stopped the current flow across the short which is the failure mode for diodes, Triacs, and FETs type semiconductor.

If you have replaced the fuse a few times and now it doesn't blow but the board is still dead the MR's have been opened and it will be harder to troubleshoot.

If the last time you tested it the fuse blew that's good (don't test again) and finding the simiconductor that shorted will be easier.

kwcharlie Thanks, and I didn't put any power to it since then.I have no idea what you mean by the MR's .But thanks for telling me. I would like it to be as easy as possible to trace and fix.

John

Just wondering, did you ever get this repaired? I have the exact same problem, the treadmill just stopped (ERR1 code), pulled it apart and saw that the capacitor was burned and cracked in half, that's the only thing that I can see. (No leaking Electrolytic or anything else, no blown fuse). I got the same response from the manufacturer, the controller is not available and we can't give you the spec on the capacitor... (sadly, that's what they call customer service).

No real suggestions but just a +1 conntaxman. Mine demonstrates the same failure after a rubber ball went under and rotated along with the walking belt spitting it out top side. It blew the 250V 15a fuse. I replaced the fuse which blew again after the treadmill initially came to life and surged with speed. That's when I noticed that same green component broke.

The board shows it as RT1 (thermistor). Yes?

DAve

I sent my board out to Tom S. and he did change some parts,a fuse ,relay,and that cap.I think thats all, when i got the board back i installed it and it ran once or twice and then Failed again, i think it was error 1 but it still dosent work.So i spent over one hundred bucks and got junk. You know the company is out of business. And no one has the board, it was made in YA, china, . We have to STOP buying from china. Once its broke you cant get parts to fix it.

SAD

John

Sorry to bring up an old thread but I have some information if anyone runs across this issue again.

I'm trying to help a friend of mine with the same issue (RT1 broke) - as indicated in the thread, this indeed is a thermistor (or a inrush current limiter in this case).

The component in question DSP 0415 is produced by Lotron Industries Corp. DBA Millennium Components Corp. based in Taiwan.

I reach out to Lotron, and they provided the following specs:

N.T.C. Thermistor

R25: 4 ohm +/- 20%

B= 3027°K +/- 5%, 15A

Lead Wire: Tinned copper wires (KI)

RoHS approval

Item no.: 20DSP-0415M

Since Lotron requires a minimum purchase of 500 units @.40/ea it's unreasonable for any individual to get their hands on one (I looked at various sources such as Digikey, etc and they did not carry Lotron)

I'm trying to find a comparable component from a higher quality provider such as Ametherm that people can also order from a Digikey, Mouser, etc provider if anyone is interested.

Hope this helps!

Thanks so much for the info! I got no help from New Balance who basically said "get lost"....

I still have the motor controller in the trunk of my car, so if you find out where we can get the part, let us know. If there is a minimum buy, I would be willing to split costs, still cheaper than a new treadmill.

Jim

Hi zeropanic, do you know if anyone ever sourced this RT1 thermister? I cant find anyone interested in trying to repair this board for me, but I'm a tech on Xerox printers and I can solder in new components if I can just get them. My treadmill is so nice and in mint cond otherwise. My failure is identical to all the others on this thread. Thank you ! Ed Y.

Greetings Ed,

It has been awhile but I think it was digikey that was able to source a similar part. I'm afraid that I can't find the email with the exact part # that was ordered but you should be able to chat with the sales engineer online and they can find you a close match that will work.

Small world by the way, I'm a Xerox employee :-)

Thanks very much for such a quick reply to an old thread Mr Zeropanic... I left on vacation a day or 2 afterward, before I could respond back. It was one of those horrific vacations where all electronics were banned ! ( Cruise ) :-) ... Were you suggesting that I try to contact DigiKey to source this part? If so I will definately try. Are they a U.S. company? Out of curiousity, did your friend get his treadmill going? If so, since it has been awhile, do you know if that repair held up? Thanks again --- Ed Y. ( Xerox CSE for 30 yrs in central Texas) Where are you ?

Totally understand - the DW and I just had ours in Jan.

Digikey is based in the US (MN I think), and they have always been helpful to me - you can either call them or chat online with them and they should be able to help. I pulled up some old emails I had and that is where I suggested my friend pick up his replacement (though I can't find the part he ordered).

Another good place to check with is Mouser - Mouser is based in TX and if Digikey doesn't have stock on something or can't find a match, chances are that Mouser will be able to help. I've ordered from both but I've had more experience with Digikey.

Also, something that may help both companies narrow down a replacement for you, is that while technically the part is a "thermistor", the application it is used for here is what they refer to as an "inrush current limiter" - it's for protection of the motor and it also absorbs any transient current left after the motor draws the additional amps needed to start it up.

So far, the replacement has held up pretty well - I asked about it the other day when we were trying to track down the part number I had him order. I think what we ended up ordering was produced by Ametherm. Hopefully this info will at least get them started down the right path for you; and if you do get one ordered, please post it here since I neglected to do so (doh!).

I work for the ITO part of Xerox - our HQ is in Dallas, but I'm remote here in NC. I've been here (on and off) now for 10 years :-)

PS - if you want a little Xerox humor, check out this reenactment of an actual legal case:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZbqAMEwtOE

I know Xerox tried for years to remove themselves from the common vernacular that associated themselves as just a copier company, so it is very amusing to see such a ruckus being caused by it.

Hope this helps!

Ok, thanks for everything, including the YouTube link. There's 7 mins of my life I'll never get back ! :-) It was too funny... I'll pass it around.. So, one more question, (not necessarily the last) .. Was that RT1 the only component that was replaced ? It would seem like something else would have shorted to cause it to blow.. I saw references here about the 2 large electrolitic caps, and the diode/rectifiers possibly shorted. I did notice that my large caps had a caramel colored wax at the base of them and wondered if that might flag bad compontents there... ( like I said, I'm not a component level guy , just enough to be dangerous..) The failure went like this: All was good, motor running smooth and quiet at all speeds and suddenly full voltage went to the motor and it instantly went to full speed for a few seconds before blowing this Thermister and the fuse. ( It almost threw me down face first on the belt...) I replaced the fuse one time using the same fast-acting 15 amp and it immediately blew upon powering up and smoked the RT1 a little more than the 1st time. The other components I mentioned seem like they might be a little easier to source... Any thoughts? Thanks, Ed Y...

In my friend's case, it was just the inrush limiter that popped (he had something or rather that caused the belt to get stuck).

Your case sounds a little different and I'd agree there could be a short somewhere - I'd follow what Tom had posted earlier in this thread.

Are the caps bulging? If they look like this: http://www.zen22142.zen.co.uk/Prac/dab_repair/dab5.jpg or this: http://www.upgradenrepair.com/images/capacitors/badcap.JPG then they need to be replaced. I'm not sure what those caps are rated, but be extra careful when checking/removing them (if needed) since they may still hold some current.

There should also a be speed sensor next to the motor - check it along with the motor itself for any damage/shorts.

Worst case, it looks like these guys will repair the board for you for $85:

https://sites.google.com/site/jatinahelectronics/

Sorry that I'm of less help here - I don't have one of these (though my NordicTrack is built off an Android tablet which should be fun to troubleshoot if it ever dies) so I'm flying a bit blind.

Hi again, I fell off the planet for a month or 3, but back at it now. Thanks for the good advice on ordering parts from Digikey. I ordered the 2 large caps and 2 of the current limiters, ( why not at $2) ...and got them right away. Sadly, the unit still is not working. It changed the symtoms somewhat, nothing blows up, no fuse blowing, and the panel works again. But when you start any program, it does its count down but motor never starts. Faults with the err1 eventually. Something is still smelling hot on the board, but didn't want to touch anything while powered up. No smoke yet but I suspect there would be if I kept at it :-) I have sent an email to the company you recommended may be able to work on it. We'll see what that brings... Thanks again. ----------- ( I could shot gun some more components like the rectifiers and FETs, but... ... )

Hi, I recently got a New Balance 1400 free with the same thermistor (RT1) blown. Just curious which part you ordered from DigiKey? I ordered [Digi.Part#570-1063-ND] Ametherm SL32 4R023 4Ω ±20% 23A, and it seems to be working so far. You should check on both sides of the motor to see if one of the carbon brushes (contactors) have come out/loose. The motor on my unit stopped working, and was behaving exactly like yours (err1 eventually). It was because a "constant-force spring assembly" for one of the two carbon brushes had popped out of the side of the motor....I just had to put it back. They may be under small square plastic covers sticking out of one/both sides of the motor which can be removed by carefully squeezing them. Under that, the spring assembly that holds the brush/contactor in place sticks out with a piece of heat-shrink tubing around it. Good luck!

Just want to make sure everyone knows that treadmill belts need to be periodically lubricated with 100% silicon lube...even if the treadmill has not been in use. This is essential maintenance for all treadmills, and failure to do so can result in blown circuit board components [i.e. In-Rush Limitors / Electrolytic Capacitors] or can damage/destroy the motor.

Hi JR... I cant tell you for sure what I ordered, as the Digikey receipt that sat here on my desk forever finally got pitched I guess... I kinda remember that the spec on the original one was 15A, and the one I ordered from them was 14A. The brand sounds right. I ordered the big Caps too, just because.. It didn't blow anything after that, but still wouldn't turn the motor on, at least correctly. If you farted with it long enough, you might get it to turn on briefly. Whats transpired with mine, (still not in operation) is that I found a recommendation of an expert on these boards to send it to, and I did. He complimented me on the choice of components, the thermistor and the electrolytic caps.. and said I'd done well in installing them. He additionally found a couple more components bad, fet, diode, etc, and replaced and sent it back to me free of charge, as he more or less had indicated he would do. Well that was nice, but it still didn't work. The motor wouldn't come on at all now, even though leds were lighting up, flashing, etc when it was time for the motor to energize. So, I sent the whole control console, including wire harness, with the board back to him to see if he could figure it out. (He had treadmills and motors) Now its been months, and its as if he's fallen off he planet... He's responded to an email once, saying he was looking for a control board for me, but no details or any other explanation. So I still have a huge paper weight that's in the way... I will definitely check the motor as you suggested, although my gut says its fine.

After having it fixed by Tom S. the board still dosen't work.I got rid of the machine.