Previous in Forum: ATEF   Next in Forum: BS EN 62305
Close
Close
Close
10 comments
Rate Comments: Nested
Participant

Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 2

Some Electrical Engineering Questions

06/12/2011 11:13 AM

Dear all,

I'm new to this group. As I'm computer Engineer, I need answers for the following questions. Will be grateful to u.

What is the relationship between grounding of power system components and zero sequence impedance.

Why we take/ why we use placement of resistance in neutral circuit

Why in power system shunt reactance don't effect the power transfer capability of transmission line.

Register to Reply
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.
Anonymous Poster #1
#1

Re: Some Electrical Engineering Questions

06/13/2011 1:58 AM

The zero sequence currents are additive - in same phase unlike the positive and negative sequence currents that are destructive at the neutral points due to their phase shifts.

Due to this the only way for the zero sequence current to loop back to source is through the ground connection.

Resistance or reactance in the ground/earth terminal is to limit the fault current.

Power system shunt reactance or the series reactance both do affect the power transfer capability. Only the problem is the amount. The series reactance (capacitor) - the reactive power compensated is proportional to the power. Whereas in case of shant it is inversely proportional to voltage (infact V2) So the decrease in voltage - usually associated with high reactive power- will have the effect of lesser compensation by the shunt (when in fact higher should have been there). But these are any way taken care of by the switched capacitor by controlling the firing angles.

Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1013
Good Answers: 36
#2
In reply to #1

Re: Some Electrical Engineering Questions

06/13/2011 8:44 AM

What aload of rubbish.

1- If the current is going to return via the ground, it will end up in the neutral point in any case, at the source! so what makes it decide to take the more resistive earth path????

Your 2nd paragraph is OK

The 3rd paragraph is from another planet I Think. Could not make head nor tail...

Register to Reply
Anonymous Poster #1
#7
In reply to #2

Re: Some Electrical Engineering Questions

06/14/2011 6:09 AM

Ignorance is not always rubbish bliss. I recommend highly to brush up your electrical engineering.

1- If the current is going to return via the ground, it will end up in the neutral point in any case, at the source! so what makes it decide to take the more resistive earth path????

In case of a three phase circuit. The phasors consists of sequence (positive, negative and zero). The phasors positive and negative rotate in time phase in reverese direction but still add up to zero at neutral.

The Zero sequence current do not add up to zero.

In a balanced three phase system there are only positive sequence currents. But the unbalance - whether due to load or due to fault have the other sequences too. Of which the negative sequence adds again to zero (phasor addition) at neutral.

However the zero sequence do not. And the NGR is used to check the magnitude of the 3I0 and act the protection when needed. Too lazy to search out references but you will find it in your power system protection textbook. (BTW what is the more resistive earth path ie what is the ground resistance recommended by IEEE/NEMA?)

The third paragraph has been alerady explained in another post and hence I need not repeat. Of course I could have a bit additions on that but I feel it is really not necessary to go into the power carrying capacity of transmission lines. (Please refer your text book) and then Put the seriies and shunt reactors one by one and look at the reactive power compensation mechanism of each.

Please note that this is from my past knowledge and may be a bit wrong here and there. Correct any point if so.

I could web search and find necessary reference of course, since the text books I have to dust and scan (and that would be illegal). But I feel it is not too necessary.

Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 5)
Guru

Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1013
Good Answers: 36
#9
In reply to #7

Re: Some Electrical Engineering Questions

06/14/2011 9:56 AM

Thank you for sending me to re-brush my knowledge.

In any case, I am concerned about the paragraph:'Due to this the only way for the zero sequence current to loop back to source is through the ground connection.'

If the system is 4 wires (3 phases and Neutral) the neutral wire will carry the unbalanced (zero sequence) current back to source directly without having to go to ground (Not a ground fault current here).

In the case you refer above (Italics), I presume that ONLY the fault to ground current will be going via ground to the neutral at source.(?)

Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 5)
Anonymous Poster #1
#10
In reply to #9

Re: Some Electrical Engineering Questions

06/15/2011 12:59 AM

Though we may get the fourth wire at our end (the neutral) The power transmitted is through three wire system and hence the unbalance (or the zero sequence) will be felt by the substation, though we may at our end use the neutral to take care of the zero sequence, but it would have to reach the generator afterall.

Register to Reply Off Topic (Score 5)
Guru

Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 1294
Good Answers: 35
#8
In reply to #2

Re: Some Electrical Engineering Questions

06/14/2011 8:27 AM

Re: 1- If the current is going to return via the ground, it will end up in the neutral point in any case, at the source! so what makes it decide to take the more resistive earth path????

I agree with AP #1 below, but I can see a simpler explanation. Consider the location of the NGR (neutral grounding resistor)--it is between the neutral point of the transformer (or a ZigZag transformer used to create a neutral) and ground. Then consider where the ground / neutral conductor (carried to the power consumer) is connected--it is on the ground side of the NGR.

Thus when a ground fault occurs at the consumer, the fault current has to travel back through that ground / neutral conductor and must go through the NGR to get back to the source (the transformer) to complete the circuit.

Because it must travel through the NGR, the fault current is limited.

Register to Reply
Active Contributor

Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 13
#3

Re: Some Electrical Engineering Questions

06/13/2011 10:31 AM

to restrict ground fault current. the fault current to ground is decided by the bus capacity.(fault level).

Register to Reply
Power-User

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Bengaluru, India
Posts: 128
Good Answers: 3
#4

Re: Some Electrical Engineering Questions

06/14/2011 12:23 AM

Relation is a mathematical one.

If we have phase a,b,c and a neutral circuit, n,

The relation between neutral current and phase current is given by

In = Ia+Ib+Ic [Vector sum] = 0 under balanced conditions

Vn = Va+Vb+Vc [Vector sum] = 0 under balanced conditions

If a,b,c are balanced , the corresponding symmetrical component transformation , results in 'Zero' value for zero sequence component.

If a,b,c are not balanced, the symmetrical component transformation results in "Non-Zero" component for zero-sequence component.

Since by definition, positive and negative sequence quantities are balanced [with different directions], The unbalanced 0 sequence component having the same phase, has to flow through the neutral.

In otherwords, zero sequence component represents the unbalanced portion in the 3 phase networks and is distinctly available as pure zero sequence component in the neutral.

Thus by including additional resistance or impedance in the neutral circuit, we can minimize the zero sequence component. The objective is to minimize earth fault, short circuit current and resulting damage to equipments and operating personnel.

Your last question:

Power Trasfer Capability is determined by the basic fundamental equation as follows

P = [Vs.Vr/X]Sin(angle 1 - angle 2]

where Vs is sending end voltage magnitude and angle 1 is its phase angle

Vr is the receiving end bus voltage magnitude and angle 2 is its phase angle

X is the series impedance of the transmission lines.

Shunt reactances affects the magnitudes Vs, Vr and hence affects the power flow P.

The dependency of P over magnitude Vs, Vr is lesser compared to angular separation between sending and receiving bus voltages in a pure inductive network. When resistance is dominant in the series circuit, voltage magnitude also affects the value of P significantly

__________________
Dr.Raghunatha Ramaswamy - We discover nothing new other than knowledge
Register to Reply
Participant

Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 2
#5
In reply to #4

Re: Some Electrical Engineering Questions

06/14/2011 2:07 AM

Dear All,

Many thanks for helping me out. Grateful to you all.

Regards

Shazz

Register to Reply
Power-User

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: BHOPAL, INDIA
Posts: 201
Good Answers: 20
#6

Re: Some Electrical Engineering Questions

06/14/2011 2:36 AM

Any unbalanced system of voltage / current can be resolved in three balance systems known as Positive Sequence component which rotates in same direction and with same frequency as the original (unbalanced) system, Negative phase sequence which rotates in opposite direction but with the same frequency and zero sequence which does not rotate but varies with same frequency as the original unbalanced system. Each rotating electrical machine offers different reactance to these three phase sequence quantities and are known as positive, negative and zero sequence reactnce respectively. Zero sequence component comes into picture only when system involves ground (as in case of single earth fault or double ground to earth fault). But three phase to ground fault being symmetrical fault does not in unbalance and therefore does not result in either negative sequence or zero sequence component.

Since earth fault current passes through ground, then in system involving grounding of neutral, this current flows through the neutral. This current is then controlled by all the three reactnces. In order to control this fault current to a safe value, resistance is added in the neutral grounding circuit.

Register to Reply
Register to Reply 10 comments
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

Anonymous Poster (3); LAA_Lucke (2); pcchatur (1); raghunath7 (1); rhkramer (1); Shazz (1); subhash wad (1)

Previous in Forum: ATEF   Next in Forum: BS EN 62305

Advertisement