Previous in Forum: Pneumatic Conveying System for Wooden Pulp   Next in Forum: Requirement of Crusher
Close
Close
Close
11 comments
Rate Comments: Nested
Associate

Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 38
Good Answers: 1

Hazards From Low Dew Point Nitrogen?

08/02/2011 8:33 AM

What are the hazards of having nitrogen in steel pipe #150 network with relevant valves, regulators, buffer vessel, etc, which has dew point, at atmospheric pressure, minus 40 deg C ?

Is there a risk for elastomeric material only? Or for all non-metallic material ?

Register to Reply
Interested in this topic? By joining CR4 you can "subscribe" to
this discussion and receive notification when new comments are added.

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".

"Almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, vote them!
Guru
United Kingdom - Member - Indeterminate Engineering Fields - Control Engineering - New Member

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: In the bothy, 7 chains down the line from Dodman's Lane level crossing, in the nation formerly known as Great Britain. Kettle's on.
Posts: 32175
Good Answers: 839
#1

Re: Hazards from low dew point nitrogen?

08/02/2011 8:54 AM

It depends upon the materials and whether or not they have been correctly selected.

What piping standards are in use, please?

__________________
"Did you get my e-mail?" - "The biggest problem in communication is the illusion that it has taken place" - George Bernard Shaw, 1856
Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Stoke-on-Trent, UK
Posts: 4496
Good Answers: 137
#2

Re: Hazards From Low Dew Point Nitrogen?

08/02/2011 12:00 PM

Are you under the impression that the system has to be OK for temperature minus 40° C ? That's probably not the case. Dewpoint is the temperature to which the gas has to be cooled for dew to form. It gives a measure of the water vapour content, the lower the dewpoint the drier the gas. It's not the actual temperature.

You need to consider the actual pressure and temperature to determine material selection.

Codey

__________________
Give masochists a fair crack of the whip
Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
2
Guru
Engineering Fields - Mechanical Engineering - New Member India - Member - New Member

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: City of destiny, INDIA
Posts: 775
Good Answers: 67
#3

Re: Hazards From Low Dew Point Nitrogen?

08/03/2011 4:01 AM

Normally bulk nitrogen produced in air separation plants is dry. But moisture content equivalent, which has dew point at atmospheric pressure, minus 40 deg C, will not pose any significant hazard on piping material which is is designed to handle this gas at operating pressure and temperature. As far as material is concerned, you can treat this gas same as air for similar operating parameters like pressure, temp. & due point.

Hazards vary only for exposure to humans.

Register to Reply Good Answer (Score 2)
Guru
Hobbies - DIY Welding - New Member

Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1601
Good Answers: 58
#4

Re: Hazards From Low Dew Point Nitrogen?

08/03/2011 7:43 AM

Nitrogen is a generally inert gas and will not react with any of the materials in your pipe. It is safe to use as long as you remember that if you breath it exclusively you will die of suffocation.

Register to Reply
Associate

Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 38
Good Answers: 1
#5

Re: Hazards From Low Dew Point Nitrogen?

08/03/2011 11:56 AM

Thank you all for your answers.

The general piping standard is B31.8.

I should explained it earlier. What makes me ask this question is that having so low humidity in the N2, may be considered as relatively big (bigger than usual) differential concentrations of humidity in areas that are near fluids (atmosphere air, other proccess gases) with higher humidity. Could that be a problem?

Could a non-metallic material, for example, be "dehydrated" and loose some of its functionality?

Normally the specifications of non-metallic material (gaskets, o-ring, membrans, teflon, etc) say nothing about the low limit of the humidity, so that's why I ask this.

Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Stoke-on-Trent, UK
Posts: 4496
Good Answers: 137
#6
In reply to #5

Re: Hazards From Low Dew Point Nitrogen?

08/03/2011 12:06 PM

How can your dry nitrogen be "near" other gases? They're either separate or mixed, as far as I can see.

But I'd be surprised if there's a problem. Though you still haven't told us the pressure and temperature.

__________________
Give masochists a fair crack of the whip
Register to Reply
Associate

Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 38
Good Answers: 1
#8
In reply to #6

Re: Hazards From Low Dew Point Nitrogen?

08/04/2011 3:04 AM

By "near" I mean areas where dry N2 is separated from other fluids by a thin piece of no-metallic material, for example, flanged joints, o-ring sealings, membrane of relief valves.

The nitrogen network has design temperature from -24 to 80 deg C, and design pressure 11 bar.

Register to Reply
Guru
Engineering Fields - Mechanical Engineering - New Member India - Member - New Member

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: City of destiny, INDIA
Posts: 775
Good Answers: 67
#9
In reply to #8

Re: Hazards From Low Dew Point Nitrogen?

08/04/2011 8:37 AM

Absolutely no risk. As I have earlier mentioned, you can treat it like air inside the pipe or buffer vessels. Specifications do not specify about the low limit of the humidity because lower humidity is always better for most of the materials.

Register to Reply
Guru

Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Stoke-on-Trent, UK
Posts: 4496
Good Answers: 137
#10
In reply to #8

Re: Hazards From Low Dew Point Nitrogen?

08/04/2011 9:13 AM

OK thanks. Need to ensure the materials are good for the temperature range, the -24°C is likely to be the limiting condition, but nothing directly to do with the nitrogen and its dryness.

Codey

__________________
Give masochists a fair crack of the whip
Register to Reply
Guru
Hobbies - DIY Welding - New Member

Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1601
Good Answers: 58
#7
In reply to #5

Re: Hazards From Low Dew Point Nitrogen?

08/03/2011 1:17 PM

"Could a non-metallic material, for example, be "dehydrated" and loose some of its functionality?"

No, most properties of non-metallics improve as they get drier, especially electrical properties. One of the reasons for using dry gas backfill is to lower the dew point of all the gas trapped in the pipe so there will be no condensation when the pipe temperature drops.

Register to Reply Score 1 for Good Answer
Associate

Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 48
Good Answers: 2
#11
In reply to #7

Re: Hazards From Low Dew Point Nitrogen?

08/09/2011 2:03 PM

One non-metallic material that is affected by humidity is polyamide (nylon). Different types (6, 6/6, etc) are affected to differing degrees. It will take up and release water from whatever service atmosphere it is in. It is plasticized (softened) by water, so will be more brittle at low humidity. This is not normally an issue in a static condition. It normally surfaces as an issue during assembly or during dynamic loading/unloading. I am not familiar with plumbing specifications, so I don't know if this is a material you would encounter.

Register to Reply
Register to Reply 11 comments

Good Answers:

These comments received enough positive votes to make them "good answers".

"Almost" Good Answers:

Check out these comments that don't yet have enough votes to be "official" good answers and, if you agree with them, vote them!
Copy to Clipboard

Users who posted comments:

Codemaster (3); cosv001 (2); polymerfan (1); pritam (2); PWSlack (1); welderman (2)

Previous in Forum: Pneumatic Conveying System for Wooden Pulp   Next in Forum: Requirement of Crusher

Advertisement